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From: Greendistantstar on 19 Apr 2010 21:03
Mark-T wrote:
> On Apr 18, 6:20 pm, "nemo_outis" <a...(a)xyz.com> wrote:
>>> yeah, I know that one: "You can't prove a negative."
>> Actually, while not every negative propoposition that is true
>> can be proved to be true, many (in fact, an infinite number) can!
>>
>> If by "negative" you mean there aren't valid negative existence
>> proofs (there is no x such that y is true) then the above examples
>> dispose of your error. If you instead mean that no proposition
>> that is expressed in the negative can be proved true then
>> demolishing this error is simpler yet.
>>
>> So, yes, many "negatives" (whatever you twist that to mean)
>> can indeed be proved.
>
> Cool. Hence, "you can't prove a negative" is false.

You didn't understand Nemo's reply, did you?

> So if I claim Jehovah sends disasters to punish
> the sinners, and someone denies it (because Jehovah
> is imaginary), and I challenge him to prove it, he
> should be able.

You simply do not understand what constitutes proof. If you say God creates disasters and I say that
is nonsense, the burden of proof is with YOU who made the assertion, not me. You get that?

One can prove that earthquakes are caused by plate tectonics etc but this does not prove that God
didn't initiate that. Maybe he did, but it also might have been the Flying Spaghetti Monster, Mickey
Mouse or your mom.

If you still don't get it, here's another example.

Let's say I accuse you of being a murderer. You deny that, and I say, "Prove you are not a murderer!"

How will you do that? Logically, we would have to investigate every death anywhere at any time to
see if you're the culprit. So off we go, travelling the world, seeking out every murder, but with
every instance of a murder of which you are NOT guilty, I am not satisfied, it might be the next
one, or the one after that, and so on until there are no instances left. Pretty dumb, eh?

The correct response would be for you to say "Well, you provide a specific instance of a murder of
which you believe I am guilty." which correctly places the burden of proof on me (the claimant) not you.

This is Logic 101, taught in many high schools and very many undergrad degrees.

GDS

"Let's roll!"

From: Greendistantstar on 20 Apr 2010 20:39
Mark-T wrote:
> On Apr 19, 6:03 pm, Greendistantstar <Greendistants...(a)iinet.net.au>
> wrote:
>>>>> yeah, I know that one: "You can't prove a negative."
>>>> So, yes, many "negatives" (whatever you twist
>>>> that to mean) can indeed be proved.
>>> Cool. Hence, "you can't prove a negative" is false.
>> You didn't understand Nemo's reply, did you?
>>
>>> So if I claim Jehovah sends disasters to punish
>>> the sinners, and someone denies it (because Jehovah
>>> is imaginary), and I challenge him to prove it, he
>>> should be able.
>> You simply do not understand what constitutes
>> proof. If you say God creates disasters and I
>> say that is nonsense, the burden of proof is with
>> YOU who made the assertion, not me.
>> One can prove that earthquakes are caused by
>> plate tectonics etc but this does not prove that God
>> didn't initiate that.
>>
>> Let's say I accuse you of being a murderer. You deny that, and I say, "Prove you are not a murderer!"
>>
>> How will you do that? Logically, we would
>> have to investigate every death anywhere at any
>> time to see if you're the culprit.
>> The correct response would be for you to say
>> "Well, you provide a specific instance of a murder
>> of which you believe I am guilty." which correctly
>> places the burden of proof on me (the claimant) not you.
>
> Legally, that's true. But t still doesn't prove my innocence.

<slaps head>

>> This is Logic 101, taught in many high schools
>> and very many undergrad degrees.
>
> You confuse schooling with understanding.

I confuse nothing; you fail Logic 101, it's as simple as that.

GDS

"Let's roll!"
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