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From: Ron on 8 Jul 2010 12:10
On 08/07/2010 16:44, George's Pro Sound Co. wrote:
> "Joe Kotroczo"<kotroczo(a)mac.com> wrote in message
> news:C85BB63F.C439A%kotroczo(a)mac.com...
>> On 08/07/2010 15:46, in article
>> U5adncgr_aY8S6jRnZ2dnUVZ_tidnZ2d(a)earthlink.com, "George's Pro Sound Co."
>> <bmoas(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> "Joe Kotroczo"<kotroczo(a)mac.com> wrote in message
>>> news:C85B99AA.C4389%kotroczo(a)mac.com...
>>>> On 08/07/2010 14:55, in article
>>>> R5OdnckHbd9VV6jRnZ2dnUVZ_tidnZ2d(a)earthlink.com, "George's Pro Sound Co."
>>>> <bmoas(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Joe Kotroczo"<kotroczo(a)mac.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:C85B9484.C437C%kotroczo(a)mac.com...
>>>>>> On 08/07/2010 13:58, in article
>>>>>> 7fidnaRrQLvjIKjRnZ2dnUVZ_uudnZ2d(a)earthlink.com, "George's Pro Sound
>>>>>> Co."
>>>>>> <bmoas(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "nandan21"<nandan21(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:a396a3dc-4c2a-4dc6-b91a-70b8fd02a11c(a)x2g2000prk.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>>>> Most of the Engineers prefer to sit in centre of the audience to mix
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>> live performance, but a few prefer to sit off-centre. Sitting in
>>>>>>>> centre does not give correct idea of your mix as bass frequencies
>>>>>>>> sum
>>>>>>>> up at that position, points tech papers and writings. What are your
>>>>>>>> reasoned preferences?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> it makes no diffrence to me
>>>>>>> I am as happy behind or next to the stage as I am out front
>>>>>>> what ever works for the event
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You are really claiming to be able to mix a concert from behind the
>>>>>> stage?
>>>>>>
>>>>> if that is what is BEST for the event iot is what I would do
>>>>> have you ever been to a concert where mixing behind the stage was BEST
>>>>> FOR
>>>>> THE EVENT?
>>>>> please read what I write
>>>>> I am happy to mix where ever is BEST FOR THE EVENT
>>>>> I do not insist on being front center at industrial trade shows
>>>>> JOE "BEST FOR THE EVENT"
>>>>> need I say it again
>>>>> if front center is BEST FOR THE EVENT, I am happy to mix there
>>>>> if not I am just as happy to mix else where
>>>>
>>>> I just cannot imagine any situation where BEHIND is BEST FOR THE EVENT.
>>>> You
>>>> can neither hear nor see what is going on on stage, so you can not mix.
>>>> Not
>>>> being able to mix cannot be BEST FOR THE EVENT.
>>>>
>>>> George, maybe you should do me the courtesy of actually reading what I
>>>> wrote. Did I write anywhere that one should insist to be front centre?
>>>>
>>>> It makes sense, to me at least, to have FOH somewhere where the person
>>>> mixing can see and hear what is happening on stage. Or are you going to
>>>> contradict me out of spite and tell me one does not need to hear or see
>>>> to
>>>> be able to mix?
>>>>
>>> I have mixed at several churches where the sound equipment is located
>>> behind
>>> the alter
>>> the Green man pub in Asheville NC the sound mixer is in a closet two
>>> rooms
>>> away from the stage facing the back of the closet, you have to stand on a
>>> chair and look over your shoulder to even see the stage
>>> No industrial event have I ever done where the console is front center
>>> just because you can't imagine does not mean that it is not happening
>>> and for reasons unknown to me , somebody decided that behind the alter,
>>> or
>>> in the mop storage closet was best for thier events
>>> I just rolled with it
>>> not a big deal, get in do your job, get paid, get out
>>> G
>>
>> I can believe that you've done that, but I still would be interested in
>> how
>> you were able to mix without hearing.
>>
>> If at the next pub gig, they decide that the mixer has go go in a house
>> across the street, how will you be able to mix?
>>
>> I for one can't mix anything if I'm not hearing it.
>
> JOE , you walk out , listen , go back and make a adjustment, repeat as neede
> it was great when I had my wo0nderful LS9 and was running studio manager
> I could set it up anywhere and still mix where ever I wanted via the
> wireless interface
> I will be going to another yamaha desk shortly just for that feature, but
> waiting out till the next gen of yamaha digitals is announced, I expect a
> big announcment of (value priced )digital desks at the winter trade shows
> George


I do a regular outdoor spot where because of many factors, the mixing
desk has to be alongside the stage. I`m right behind the S/L stacks. I
rig a speaker facing back at me driven from the mono out so that I can
get a reasonable idea of the FoH sound. Once I have everything roughly
in the mix, I nip out front for a listen.

On the occasions I have a helper who's ears I can trust, He`s the one to
pop out front and we have a simple system of hand gestures by which he
can let me know what needs to go up or down.

You do what you have to do.


Ron(UK)


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From: GregS on 8 Jul 2010 12:54
In article <a396a3dc-4c2a-4dc6-b91a-70b8fd02a11c(a)x2g2000prk.googlegroups.com>, nandan21 <nandan21(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
>Most of the Engineers prefer to sit in centre of the audience to mix a
>live performance, but a few prefer to sit off-centre. Sitting in
>centre does not give correct idea of your mix as bass frequencies sum
>up at that position, points tech papers and writings. What are your
>reasoned preferences?

Sounds reasonable. Random distances should produce more averaged sounds.
From a listeners point of view, the only thing important is getting
most if not all the audience a good sound. Getting it to only sound decent at the mixing desk
is not good. I think you NEED a walker.

greg
From: Sean Conolly on 8 Jul 2010 15:22
"nandan21" <nandan21(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a396a3dc-4c2a-4dc6-b91a-70b8fd02a11c(a)x2g2000prk.googlegroups.com...
> Most of the Engineers prefer to sit in centre of the audience to mix a
> live performance, but a few prefer to sit off-centre. Sitting in
> centre does not give correct idea of your mix as bass frequencies sum
> up at that position, points tech papers and writings. What are your
> reasoned preferences?

I think I can count on one hand the number of times I've even had a choice
about where the mix position would be.

My worst situation was in the college theater, running sound from the back
of the lighting booth at the back of the balcony. The only acoustic path was
through the holes for the spotlights. My solution was to put a mic about two
feet below the front edge of the balcony and mix through headphones.
Sometimes you just do what you gotta do.

Sean


From: Denny Strauser on 8 Jul 2010 17:23
On 7/8/2010 10:48 AM, Tim Perry wrote:
> "nandan21"<nandan21(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:a396a3dc-4c2a-4dc6-b91a-70b8fd02a11c(a)x2g2000prk.googlegroups.com...
>> Most of the Engineers prefer to sit in centre of the audience to mix a
>> live performance, but a few prefer to sit off-centre. Sitting in
>> centre does not give correct idea of your mix as bass frequencies sum
>> up at that position, points tech papers and writings.
>
> And what of the people sitting in the center? who's to say what is correct?
>
>
>> What are your
>> reasoned preferences?
>
> I find that being able to hear both sides equally is preferable, however
> last nights big band gig put me in front of the stage left speakers.
>
> Like George says, more often then not, the dictates of others preclude
> personal preference.

I also like mixing from the center, because I often like do mix a wide
stereo mix. But, like was elsewhere in this thread, you should walk
around the venue to hear problems that apparent, wherever your FOH is
positioned. Sometimes this isn't possible (theatre & large venues), so
this should be done during soundcheck.

- Denny
From: Denny Strauser on 8 Jul 2010 17:30
On 7/8/2010 3:22 PM, Sean Conolly wrote:
> "nandan21"<nandan21(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:a396a3dc-4c2a-4dc6-b91a-70b8fd02a11c(a)x2g2000prk.googlegroups.com...
>> Most of the Engineers prefer to sit in centre of the audience to mix a
>> live performance, but a few prefer to sit off-centre. Sitting in
>> centre does not give correct idea of your mix as bass frequencies sum
>> up at that position, points tech papers and writings. What are your
>> reasoned preferences?
>
> I think I can count on one hand the number of times I've even had a choice
> about where the mix position would be.
>
> My worst situation was in the college theater, running sound from the back
> of the lighting booth at the back of the balcony. The only acoustic path was
> through the holes for the spotlights. My solution was to put a mic about two
> feet below the front edge of the balcony and mix through headphones.
> Sometimes you just do what you gotta do.

It's not just college theater. I've worked quite a few theater shows in
a wide variety of venues. I absolutely hate mixing from a booth, even if
the windows can be removed. My rider said FOH position should be center,
in the middle of the room, but it seldom happened in theatre. Off to one
side, back of room under balcony, and, yes, occasionally a damn booth.
It got better when digital boards came out, because my footprint got
incredibly smaller. I've mixed shows on my knees to get a decent FOH
position in theatre.

- Denny
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