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From: Nick Naym on 11 Apr 2010 22:36
In article 4bc268a4$0$4805$ba624c82(a)nntp02.dk.telia.net, Erik Richard
S�rensen at NOSPAM(a)NOSPAM.dk wrote on 4/11/10 8:26 PM:

>
> Nick Naym wrote:
>> nospam at nospam(a)nospam.invalid wrote on 4/11/10 4:53 PM:
>>> Nick Naym <nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid> wrote:
>>>> I had two external FW drives (Seagate/Icy Dock for TM; and LaCie d2 Quadra
>>>> for SuperDuper!) connected in a daisy chain to my iMac. The Seagate/Icy
>>>> Dock
>>>> is closest to the iMac, and the LaCie is daisy-chained off of it.
>>>>
>>>> I received two additional FW drives (larger LaCie d2 Quadras) as gifts over
>>>> the past couple of weeks. The first one arrived last week; I shut down my
>>>> iMac, installed the drive in the daisy chain, and rebooted without any
>>>> problems.
>>> there's no need to shut down. firewire is hot-pluggable.
>>>
>>>> The second one arrived a couple of days ago, and I installed that one as
>>>> well. However, initially, the Seagate/Icy Dock didn't show up (either on my
>>>> Desktop nor in Disk Utility) when I rebooted (all the others in the chain
>>>> did). I shut everything down again, checked the connections to/from the
>>>> Seagate/Icy Dock, powered everything up and rebooted. Everything then
>>>> seemed
>>>> to be OK.
>>> some firewire bridges are not as good as others and not necessarily
>>> fully compliant. you may have one or more such bridges in the chain.
>>
>> I've had the Seagate/Icy Dock and the LaCie since September 2008, and
>> they've both performed flawlessly. The two new LaCies are the same model as
>> the 2008 model, except larger capacities. I can only _assume_ that LaCie
>> hasn't suddenly decided to change a successful design by slapping in
>> inferior components.
>>
>> I realize that the 1.5-year-old Seagate or Icy Dock could suddenly have
>> crapped out on me; or that one of the two new LaCies is somehow defective.
>> It also could be a Mac problem, notwithstanding the fact that it's a
>> brand-new machine. But since all of these items seem to be equally likely
>> "it could be" candidates however, I have no idea how to narrow it down.
>
> What happens if you put the IcyDock as the last unit in the chain? - Try
> also to delete the DiskUtility prefs file from
> username/library/preferences - before turning on the power on any of the
> external units. - Have you run 'Repair Pe3rmissions' after daisy
> chaining all units? - Have you tried using other FW cables?

I haven' yet moved the Seagate/Icy Dock to the end of the chain; I have,
however, ejected (via Disk Utility) all the other drives, but didn't see any
change (though I'm not sure this would have the same effect as actually
truncating the daisy chain).

I have, however, run and repaired permissions a couple of times.

FWIW: I never touched the FW cables/connections since setting up the drives
on my previous machine, except recently to (1) disconnect the beginning end
of the chain from the previous machine and plug it into the current machine,
and, subsequently, (2) to install each of the new LaCie's. It was only after
the second LaCie installation did this problem occur. When I shut down the
iMac and "played" with the cables -- specifically, the connections between
the Seagate/Icy Dock and the LaCie I had just installed -- did the Seagate
then mount after reboot. I _assumed_, therefore, that _maybe_ the difficulty
was due to a "loose connection" of some sort involving the Seagate/Icy Dock.
However, since the problem has since recurred for no apparent reason, I kind
of discounted the cable/connection as the culprit.

(I do find it odd, however, that this problem suddenly appeared out of the
blue, coincident with the installation of some new drives.)

I'll play with the cables some more (I don't have "extras"), possibly
removing one of the drives temporarily and using its cables as replacements
for the Seagate's.


> - Are you
> sure that all the cables are full corded cables?

I don't know what you mean by "full corded." All I can say is that the
cables I've been using are the FW 800 cables that came with the products.



> ...Just my first thoughts... I once had the near same problem with my
> professional LaCie d2 music CD burner with a daisy chained Archos
> external harddisk that wouldn't mount though it was visible in both
> Systemprofile and DiskUtility. In my case it was a defective FW cable so
> exchanged the cable with another one the problem was gone....
>

I guess I'll find out soon enough. But, again, the sudden appearance of the
problem coincident with the introduction of the 2nd of 2 additional external
drives is what I find particularly puzzling.


> Cheers, Erik Richard

--
iMac (27", 3.06 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 4 GB RAM, 1 TB HDD) � OS X (10.6.3)

From: Nick Naym on 11 Apr 2010 22:39
In article 110420101737030928%nospam(a)nospam.invalid, nospam at
nospam(a)nospam.invalid wrote on 4/11/10 8:37 PM:

> In article <C7E7D830.587E3%nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid>,
> Nick Naym <nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid> wrote:
>
>> I've had the Seagate/Icy Dock and the LaCie since September 2008, and
>> they've both performed flawlessly. The two new LaCies are the same model as
>> the 2008 model, except larger capacities. I can only _assume_ that LaCie
>> hasn't suddenly decided to change a successful design by slapping in
>> inferior components.
>
> why not? lacie uses whatever is cheap and available. there's no
> guarantee what you get.
>

Even so, wouldn't a LaCie problem affect the drives later in the chain, not
at the beginning of the chain?


> it's also not necessarily inferior. they might work ok with n devices
> on the chain. maybe it's within spec, but borderline enough that n+1
> devices causes a problem.

--
iMac (27", 3.06 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 4 GB RAM, 1 TB HDD) � OS X (10.6.3)

From: Paul Sture on 12 Apr 2010 03:04
In article <C7E80036.587F3%nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid>,
Nick Naym <nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid> wrote:

> Even so, wouldn't a LaCie problem affect the drives later in the chain, not
> at the beginning of the chain?

Have you tried the latest device on its own to check that it works?

I had something weird last week after accidentally dislodging one of the
cables in my daisy chain (it was connected, but not fully pressed home).

In Disk Utility I saw a volume which claimed to be an unformatted 2TB
LaCie. In fact that volume is an external 80 GB LaCie and reseating the
cable properly caused it to be recognized correctly.

--
Paul Sture
From: Erik Richard Sørensen on 12 Apr 2010 08:01

Nick Naym wrote:
> Erik Richard Sørensen at NOSPAM(a)NOSPAM.dk wrote on 4/11/10 8:26 PM:
>> What happens if you put the IcyDock as the last unit in the chain? - Try
>> also to delete the DiskUtility prefs file from
>> username/library/preferences - before turning on the power on any of the
>> external units. - Have you run 'Repair Pe3rmissions' after daisy
>> chaining all units? - Have you tried using other FW cables?
>
> I haven' yet moved the Seagate/Icy Dock to the end of the chain; I have,
> however, ejected (via Disk Utility) all the other drives, but didn't see any
> change (though I'm not sure this would have the same effect as actually
> truncating the daisy chain).
>
> I have, however, run and repaired permissions a couple of times.
>
> FWIW: I never touched the FW cables/connections since setting up the drives
> on my previous machine, except recently to (1) disconnect the beginningend
> of the chain from the previous machine and plug it into the current machine,
> and, subsequently, (2) to install each of the new LaCie's. It was only after
> the second LaCie installation did this problem occur. When I shut down the
> iMac and "played" with the cables -- specifically, the connections between
> the Seagate/Icy Dock and the LaCie I had just installed -- did the Seagate
> then mount after reboot. I _assumed_, therefore, that _maybe_ the difficulty
> was due to a "loose connection" of some sort involving the Seagate/Icy Dock.
> However, since the problem has since recurred for no apparent reason, Ikind
> of discounted the cable/connection as the culprit.
>
> (I do find it odd, however, that this problem suddenly appeared out of the
> blue, coincident with the installation of some new drives.)
>
> I'll play with the cables some more (I don't have "extras"), possibly
> removing one of the drives temporarily and using its cables as replacements
> for the Seagate's.

OK, it isn't normal that a FW cable just out of the blue becomes
defective, but it can happen if one or more of the cords get corroded -
just like it can happen in a mains cord. This can be so for years, but
suddenly when you touch the cable the corroded threads inside the cord
brake and either contact are fully or partially lost...

>> - Are you sure that all the cables are full corded cables?
>
> I don't know what you mean by "full corded." All I can say is that the
> cables I've been using are the FW 800 cables that came with the products.

Some cables are 6/9, some are 9)9 corded, which means that the 6)9
cables don't support fully daisy chaining. - But the 6/9 cables mostly
come with portable units.

>> ...Just my first thoughts... I once had the near same problem with my
>> professional LaCie d2 music CD burner with a daisy chained Archos
>> external harddisk that wouldn't mount though it was visible in both
>> Systemprofile and DiskUtility. In my case it was a defective FW cable so
>> exchanged the cable with another one the problem was gone....
>
> I guess I'll find out soon enough. But, again, the sudden appearance ofthe
> problem coincident with the introduction of the 2nd of 2 additional external
> drives is what I find particularly puzzling.
>
> iMac (27", 3.06 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 4 GB RAM, 1 TB HDD) € OS X (10.6.3)

Hm, it's first now that I notice that you're running 10.6.3. I recall
from the release dates around the SnowLeopard that some have reported
errors and mis-connections when using Firewire, but I thought that these
problems already were solved. So maybe it is the 'old FW problem' that
has occoured on your system.

If I remember right the only solution was to re-install the SnowLeopard
from the buttom with all external FW units connected and powered on... -
Gosh! I hope it's only a cable error, - the re-installing will take time...

Cheers, Erik Richard


--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Erik Richard Sørensen, Member of ADC, <mac-manNOSP(a)Mstofanet.dk>
NisusWriter - The Future In Multilingual Text Processing - www.nisus.com
OpenOffice.org - The Modern Productivity Solution - www.openoffice.org
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


From: Nick Naym on 12 Apr 2010 10:26
In article paul.nospam-4EEE64.09045012042010(a)pbook.sture.ch, Paul Sture at
paul.nospam(a)sture.ch wrote on 4/12/10 3:04 AM:

> In article <C7E80036.587F3%nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid>,
> Nick Naym <nicknaym@_remove_this_gmail.com.invalid> wrote:
>
>> Even so, wouldn't a LaCie problem affect the drives later in the chain, not
>> at the beginning of the chain?
>
> Have you tried the latest device on its own to check that it works?
>


I planned to try various combinations: the 2nd LaCie (the "latest device")
totally removed from the chain (i.e., the configuration just before the
Seagate/Icy Dock drive "vanished"); relocated to the end of the chain; and
by itself. And if none of those made a difference, moving the Seagate/Icy
Dock to the end of the chain.

However, out of curiosity, when I first awoke (and while still half asleep
;) ) I decided to see what would happen when I booted to a "test" account.
So I created one, and when I booted to it, not only didn't the Seagate/Icy
Dock show up on the Desktop, but neither did my internal drive! (though it
did show up in Disk Utility and System Profiler). Maybe this is related?

Either I need more coffee, or something's amiss.


> I had something weird last week after accidentally dislodging one of the
> cables in my daisy chain (it was connected, but not fully pressed home).
>
> In Disk Utility I saw a volume which claimed to be an unformatted 2TB
> LaCie. In fact that volume is an external 80 GB LaCie and reseating the
> cable properly caused it to be recognized correctly.

--
iMac (27", 3.06 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 4 GB RAM, 1 TB HDD) � OS X (10.6.3)

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