Danger of running hot receiver (Kyocera)?
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From: Trevor Wilson on 1 Jul 2010 17:56 "David Nebenzahl" <nobody(a)but.us.chickens> wrote in message news:4c2d0650$0$3736$822641b3(a)news.adtechcomputers.com... > On 7/1/2010 2:16 PM Trevor Wilson spake thus: > >> "Cydrome Leader" <presence(a)MUNGEpanix.com> wrote in message >> news:i0e4fs$apf$1(a)reader1.panix.com... > > >>> David Nebenzahl <nobody(a)but.us.chickens> wrote: > >> >>>> Got someone with a Kyocera receiver (R-851, 85 w/chan.) that they say >>>> "smells like something's burning". Don't have more specific information >>>> than that; I'm assuming no magic smoke is visible. I'm advising them >>>> that perhaps something (dust, etc.) is in the heat sink that's getting >>>> heated and smelling. Apparently the output stages (MOSFET) of these >>>> beasts tend to run on the hot side. >>> >>> weird heatsink in that thing: >>> >>> http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=246095 >> >> **Ah, heat pipes. Quite common in the late 1970s, early 1980s. If the >> fluid has leaked, there can be problems. A quick way to test is to power >> up and ensure that heat travels rapidly (less than 10 seconds) from the >> hot devices to the other end of the heat pipe. If it doesn't then it is >> possible that the fluid is gone from inside the pipe. > > Having been inside this unit before, I'm fairly certain the heat pipe is > intact. **You need to measure to be certain. > > Any idea what the fluid is? **Not really. Some kind of refrigerant. It could be FreonT, ammonia, alcohol or a number of others. -- Trevor Wilson www.rageaudio.com.au
From: Cydrome Leader on 1 Jul 2010 18:20 Trevor Wilson <trevor(a)rageaudio.com.au> wrote: > > "David Nebenzahl" <nobody(a)but.us.chickens> wrote in message > news:4c2d0650$0$3736$822641b3(a)news.adtechcomputers.com... >> On 7/1/2010 2:16 PM Trevor Wilson spake thus: >> >>> "Cydrome Leader" <presence(a)MUNGEpanix.com> wrote in message >>> news:i0e4fs$apf$1(a)reader1.panix.com... >> > >>>> David Nebenzahl <nobody(a)but.us.chickens> wrote: >> >> >>>>> Got someone with a Kyocera receiver (R-851, 85 w/chan.) that they say >>>>> "smells like something's burning". Don't have more specific information >>>>> than that; I'm assuming no magic smoke is visible. I'm advising them >>>>> that perhaps something (dust, etc.) is in the heat sink that's getting >>>>> heated and smelling. Apparently the output stages (MOSFET) of these >>>>> beasts tend to run on the hot side. >>>> >>>> weird heatsink in that thing: >>>> >>>> http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=246095 >>> >>> **Ah, heat pipes. Quite common in the late 1970s, early 1980s. If the >>> fluid has leaked, there can be problems. A quick way to test is to power >>> up and ensure that heat travels rapidly (less than 10 seconds) from the >>> hot devices to the other end of the heat pipe. If it doesn't then it is >>> possible that the fluid is gone from inside the pipe. >> >> Having been inside this unit before, I'm fairly certain the heat pipe is >> intact. > > **You need to measure to be certain. > >> >> Any idea what the fluid is? > > **Not really. Some kind of refrigerant. It could be FreonT, ammonia, alcohol > or a number of others. I got curious and dug up a sample of a heat pipe (Noren Products http://www.norenproducts.com ) from a trade show, and it seems they can even be filled with distilled water depending on the use. It's still interesting to me that anybody bothered to use these in amplifiers, products where nobody cares about size and complains about it being made too sturdy and too heavy. I have an ATI amp where it's not clear if the heatsinks or tranformer weigh more.
From: Robert Macy on 1 Jul 2010 18:28 On Jul 1, 2:24 pm, David Nebenzahl <nob...(a)but.us.chickens> wrote: > On 7/1/2010 2:16 PM Trevor Wilson spake thus: > > > > > > > > > "Cydrome Leader" <prese...(a)MUNGEpanix.com> wrote in message > >news:i0e4fs$apf$1(a)reader1.panix.com... > > >> David Nebenzahl <nob...(a)but.us.chickens> wrote: > > >>> Got someone with a Kyocera receiver (R-851, 85 w/chan.) that they say > >>> "smells like something's burning". Don't have more specific information > >>> than that; I'm assuming no magic smoke is visible. I'm advising them > >>> that perhaps something (dust, etc.) is in the heat sink that's getting > >>> heated and smelling. Apparently the output stages (MOSFET) of these > >>> beasts tend to run on the hot side. > > >> weird heatsink in that thing: > > >>http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=246095 > > > **Ah, heat pipes. Quite common in the late 1970s, early 1980s. If the fluid > > has leaked, there can be problems. A quick way to test is to power up and > > ensure that heat travels rapidly (less than 10 seconds) from the hot devices > > to the other end of the heat pipe. If it doesn't then it is possible that > > the fluid is gone from inside the pipe. > > Having been inside this unit before, I'm fairly certain the heat pipe is > intact. > > Any idea what the fluid is? > > -- > The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring, > with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags. > > - Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com) At a show a heat pipe/heat sink company took a straight normal looking tube at room temperature and plunging it into ice water transferred ice water temp to your hand NOW! The speed of the heat flow was impressive. a simple copper pipe was no where near as fast. Old issues of ?? Electronics Design?? described the heat pipe and its operation in great detail. Should be at Wiki, or someplace, too. I think this is the right firm for heat pipes. I munged his email address a bit. Amir Tahsini, Regional Sales Manager Radian Heatsinks an Intricast Div. 2160 Walsh Avenue Santa Clara, CA 95050 Phone: 408-988-6200 ext. 224 Fax: 408-988-0683 Email: atahsini @?radianheatsinks .?com http://www.radianheatsinks.com
From: Meat Plow on 1 Jul 2010 19:03 On Thu, 01 Jul 2010 22:20:16 +0000, Cydrome Leader ǝʇoɹʍ: > Trevor Wilson <trevor(a)rageaudio.com.au> wrote: >> >> "David Nebenzahl" <nobody(a)but.us.chickens> wrote in message >> news:4c2d0650$0$3736$822641b3(a)news.adtechcomputers.com... >>> On 7/1/2010 2:16 PM Trevor Wilson spake thus: >>> >>>> "Cydrome Leader" <presence(a)MUNGEpanix.com> wrote in message >>>> news:i0e4fs$apf$1(a)reader1.panix.com... >>> > >>>>> David Nebenzahl <nobody(a)but.us.chickens> wrote: >>> >> >>>>>> Got someone with a Kyocera receiver (R-851, 85 w/chan.) that they >>>>>> say "smells like something's burning". Don't have more specific >>>>>> information than that; I'm assuming no magic smoke is visible. I'm >>>>>> advising them that perhaps something (dust, etc.) is in the heat >>>>>> sink that's getting heated and smelling. Apparently the output >>>>>> stages (MOSFET) of these beasts tend to run on the hot side. >>>>> >>>>> weird heatsink in that thing: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=246095 >>>> >>>> **Ah, heat pipes. Quite common in the late 1970s, early 1980s. If the >>>> fluid has leaked, there can be problems. A quick way to test is to >>>> power up and ensure that heat travels rapidly (less than 10 seconds) >>>> from the hot devices to the other end of the heat pipe. If it doesn't >>>> then it is possible that the fluid is gone from inside the pipe. >>> >>> Having been inside this unit before, I'm fairly certain the heat pipe >>> is intact. >> >> **You need to measure to be certain. >> >> >>> Any idea what the fluid is? >> >> **Not really. Some kind of refrigerant. It could be FreonT, ammonia, >> alcohol or a number of others. > > I got curious and dug up a sample of a heat pipe (Noren Products > http://www.norenproducts.com ) from a trade show, and it seems they can > even be filled with distilled water depending on the use. > > It's still interesting to me that anybody bothered to use these in > amplifiers, products where nobody cares about size and complains about > it being made too sturdy and too heavy. > > I have an ATI amp where it's not clear if the heatsinks or tranformer > weigh more. The whole heatpipe/heat sink/mosfet mount block assembly on my SCS 350x350 WRMS rackmount amp probably weighs 2 pounds minus the 12 fets. The actual heat sink looks like a round bristled aluminum brush through which an infinitely speed controlled fan blows through from back to front. SCS is not in business now, hasn't been for a long time but I really like this amp. Low THD for a pro audio amp easily usable for a big home system. Makes no noise unless you're pushing it then the noise doesn't really matter.
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