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From: Neil Jones on 24 Jan 2010 03:13
Hello everyone,

I am an amateur photographer and try to creat slide shows with the
photos. Some of them did turn really good. I want try and take videos
now. I haven't owned a camcorder for 10 years now and the last one I
owned used 8mi (something like that) tapes.

I am looking for some advice and recommendations on which camcorder I
should buy. These are the features I am looking for:

1. High Optical Zoom
2. High FPS for slow motion capture.
3. Lens accessories (wide angle, telephoto and macro zooming lenses
availability)

Also, I am planning to move all my computer activities to Linux. Are
there any good video editing tools on Linux?

Thank you in advance.

NJ
From: Frank on 24 Jan 2010 11:55
On Sun, 24 Jan 2010 09:13:12 +0100, in 'rec.video',
in article <Digital Camcorder recommendation?>,
Neil Jones <myself(a)dev.null> wrote:

>Hello everyone,

Hello Neil,

>I am an amateur photographer and try to creat slide shows with the
>photos. Some of them did turn really good. I want try and take videos
>now. I haven't owned a camcorder for 10 years now and the last one I
>owned used 8mi (something like that) tapes.

It was probably Video 8 or Hi8 format if analog or Digital8 (D8)
format if digital.

>I am looking for some advice and recommendations on which camcorder I
>should buy. These are the features I am looking for:
>
>1. High Optical Zoom

12x to 20x is about as good as you're going to find in the typical
one-piece camcorder. Anything beyond that puts you into specialized
territory.

>2. High FPS for slow motion capture.

There are some low-end consumer grade camcorders that offer very high
over-cranking rates, often promoted as being useful for analyzing golf
swings, for example, but these products drop the frame size so as to
limit the recorded data rate, resulting in extremely low-grade video.
(Low-grade in this instance means just above cell phone quality.) In
other words, the feature is just a gimmick for the unknowing and not
designed or intended for serious professional use.

Truly high speed cameras do exist, but they're usually very pricey,
specialized products relegated to the professional world and are
usually rented as needed and not purchased outright.

>3. Lens accessories (wide angle, telephoto and macro zooming lenses
>availability)

Sounds like you want a camcorder with an interchangeable lens
capability. This alone will up the price considerably compared to the
usual consumer offerings.

In summary, I don't see how anyone can really make any recommendations
for you without knowing your budget. I can tell you that the world's
best camcorder is probably the Sony SRW-9000. You might want to take a
serious look at what that has to offer and then work your way downward
to a more comfortable price point.

http://pro.sony.com/bbsc/ssr/product-SRW9000/

In the under (U.S.) $10,000 category, the best camcorder in my opinion
is the Sony PMW-EX1R. If you really need interchangeable lens
capability, then it would be the PMW-EX3. These are both XDCAM EX
format products that record to (solid state) flash memory cards, not
magnetic tape. The use of tape is slowly disappearing at all levels of
the video food chain and is now essentially gone at the consumer level
in the sense that few if any new tape-based consumer camcorders will
be introduced - and certainly no high-quality models.

Also in the budget category, you've got the handheld Panasonic
AG-HMC40 series products (24 Mbps interframe AVCHD format), as well as
the full-size, over-the-shoulder Panasonic AG-HPX300 series products
(AVC-Intra format at 100 Mbps intraframe). While I like the 10-bit
4:2:2 AVC-Intra 100 codec, overall I would tend to take a PMW-EX1R
over the Panny.

If your needs are really specialized, and don't include such ordinary
and mundane activities such as "family video", you might want to
consider use of a DSLR such as the Canon EOS 5D Mark II or for great
low-light capability, the new Canon EOS-1D Mark IV, but please be
warned that using a DSLR as a camcorder imposes a number of
limitations that camcorder users simply do not face.

A primary limitation is ergonomic, making it almost impossible to use
a DSLR in typical run-and-gun situations. If you're planning all of
your shots, have lots of time in which to set them up, and have full
control over the shot, then a DSLR may be for you, else my advice is
to use a still image camera for shooting stills and a camcorder for
shooting motion video (some would say, as god intended).

The other major limitation related to using a DSLR for shooting video
relates to resolution. No one, especially the DSLR-as-camcorder
fanboys, wants to talk about it, but the video resolution from a 1080p
DSLR is usually in the 500 to 700 line range. The Sony PMW-EX1R, in
comparison, will give you almost 1000 lines of real resolution. The
apparent resolution that you'll see from a DSLR is mostly attributable
to aliasing, so it's false resolution and not real. This is
unacceptable to the technically inclined user, but the movie maker
crowd seems to like it.

>Also, I am planning to move all my computer activities to Linux. Are
>there any good video editing tools on Linux?

I'll let the Linux users answer that one.

>Thank you in advance.

Hope this helps.

>NJ

--
Frank, Independent Consultant, New York, NY
[Please remove 'nojunkmail.' from address to reply via e-mail.]
Read Frank's thoughts on HDV at http://www.humanvalues.net/hdv/
[also covers AVCHD (including AVCCAM & NXCAM) and XDCAM EX].
From: Neil Jones on 25 Jan 2010 17:00
Frank,

Thanks for this input. Yes, I should have mentioned my budget too. It
is $500 and $800. Certainly, I would be making mostly home/vacation
videos. Within that category, I would like to go to the high end HD
camcorder. Probably I am asking too much without knowing the field well.

Any recommendation within that budget would be great.

Thank you once again.

NJ

Frank wrote:
> On Sun, 24 Jan 2010 09:13:12 +0100, in 'rec.video',
> in article <Digital Camcorder recommendation?>,
> Neil Jones <myself(a)dev.null> wrote:
>
>> Hello everyone,
>
> Hello Neil,
>
>> I am an amateur photographer and try to creat slide shows with the
>> photos. Some of them did turn really good. I want try and take videos
>> now. I haven't owned a camcorder for 10 years now and the last one I
>> owned used 8mi (something like that) tapes.
>
> It was probably Video 8 or Hi8 format if analog or Digital8 (D8)
> format if digital.
>
>> I am looking for some advice and recommendations on which camcorder I
>> should buy. These are the features I am looking for:
>>
>> 1. High Optical Zoom
>
> 12x to 20x is about as good as you're going to find in the typical
> one-piece camcorder. Anything beyond that puts you into specialized
> territory.
>
>> 2. High FPS for slow motion capture.
>
> There are some low-end consumer grade camcorders that offer very high
> over-cranking rates, often promoted as being useful for analyzing golf
> swings, for example, but these products drop the frame size so as to
> limit the recorded data rate, resulting in extremely low-grade video.
> (Low-grade in this instance means just above cell phone quality.) In
> other words, the feature is just a gimmick for the unknowing and not
> designed or intended for serious professional use.
>
> Truly high speed cameras do exist, but they're usually very pricey,
> specialized products relegated to the professional world and are
> usually rented as needed and not purchased outright.
>
>> 3. Lens accessories (wide angle, telephoto and macro zooming lenses
>> availability)
>
> Sounds like you want a camcorder with an interchangeable lens
> capability. This alone will up the price considerably compared to the
> usual consumer offerings.
>
> In summary, I don't see how anyone can really make any recommendations
> for you without knowing your budget. I can tell you that the world's
> best camcorder is probably the Sony SRW-9000. You might want to take a
> serious look at what that has to offer and then work your way downward
> to a more comfortable price point.
>
> http://pro.sony.com/bbsc/ssr/product-SRW9000/
>
> In the under (U.S.) $10,000 category, the best camcorder in my opinion
> is the Sony PMW-EX1R. If you really need interchangeable lens
> capability, then it would be the PMW-EX3. These are both XDCAM EX
> format products that record to (solid state) flash memory cards, not
> magnetic tape. The use of tape is slowly disappearing at all levels of
> the video food chain and is now essentially gone at the consumer level
> in the sense that few if any new tape-based consumer camcorders will
> be introduced - and certainly no high-quality models.
>
> Also in the budget category, you've got the handheld Panasonic
> AG-HMC40 series products (24 Mbps interframe AVCHD format), as well as
> the full-size, over-the-shoulder Panasonic AG-HPX300 series products
> (AVC-Intra format at 100 Mbps intraframe). While I like the 10-bit
> 4:2:2 AVC-Intra 100 codec, overall I would tend to take a PMW-EX1R
> over the Panny.
>
> If your needs are really specialized, and don't include such ordinary
> and mundane activities such as "family video", you might want to
> consider use of a DSLR such as the Canon EOS 5D Mark II or for great
> low-light capability, the new Canon EOS-1D Mark IV, but please be
> warned that using a DSLR as a camcorder imposes a number of
> limitations that camcorder users simply do not face.
>
> A primary limitation is ergonomic, making it almost impossible to use
> a DSLR in typical run-and-gun situations. If you're planning all of
> your shots, have lots of time in which to set them up, and have full
> control over the shot, then a DSLR may be for you, else my advice is
> to use a still image camera for shooting stills and a camcorder for
> shooting motion video (some would say, as god intended).
>
> The other major limitation related to using a DSLR for shooting video
> relates to resolution. No one, especially the DSLR-as-camcorder
> fanboys, wants to talk about it, but the video resolution from a 1080p
> DSLR is usually in the 500 to 700 line range. The Sony PMW-EX1R, in
> comparison, will give you almost 1000 lines of real resolution. The
> apparent resolution that you'll see from a DSLR is mostly attributable
> to aliasing, so it's false resolution and not real. This is
> unacceptable to the technically inclined user, but the movie maker
> crowd seems to like it.
>
>> Also, I am planning to move all my computer activities to Linux. Are
>> there any good video editing tools on Linux?
>
> I'll let the Linux users answer that one.
>
>> Thank you in advance.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
>> NJ
>
From: Frank on 25 Jan 2010 16:12
On Mon, 25 Jan 2010 23:00:16 +0100, in 'rec.video',
in article <Re: Digital Camcorder recommendation?>,
Neil Jones <myself(a)dev.null> wrote:

>Frank,
>
>Thanks for this input. Yes, I should have mentioned my budget too. It
>is $500 and $800. Certainly, I would be making mostly home/vacation
>videos. Within that category, I would like to go to the high end HD
>camcorder. Probably I am asking too much without knowing the field well.
>
>Any recommendation within that budget would be great.
>
>Thank you once again.
>
>NJ

So I guess that a $100,000 Sony SRW-9000 is completely out of the
question?

Okay, would you settle for a $699 Canon HV40? It's a 25 Mbps cassette
tape based palmcorder-sized DV/HDV camcorder and offers fairly decent
image quality for the price and you'll have money left over for
accessories.

Or perhaps someone else will have some other suggestions for you.

Good luck!

--
Frank, Independent Consultant, New York, NY
[Please remove 'nojunkmail.' from address to reply via e-mail.]
Read Frank's thoughts on HDV at http://www.humanvalues.net/hdv/
[also covers AVCHD (including AVCCAM & NXCAM) and XDCAM EX].
From: Neil Jones on 25 Jan 2010 17:41
:-) Yes. The $100000 camcorder got to wait until I will the lotto
jackpot. :-)

I will check out the Canon HV40 model. Probably, sometime next month.

Thank you once again.

NJ

Frank wrote:
> On Mon, 25 Jan 2010 23:00:16 +0100, in 'rec.video',
> in article <Re: Digital Camcorder recommendation?>,
> Neil Jones <myself(a)dev.null> wrote:
>
>> Frank,
>>
>> Thanks for this input. Yes, I should have mentioned my budget too. It
>> is $500 and $800. Certainly, I would be making mostly home/vacation
>> videos. Within that category, I would like to go to the high end HD
>> camcorder. Probably I am asking too much without knowing the field well.
>>
>> Any recommendation within that budget would be great.
>>
>> Thank you once again.
>>
>> NJ
>
> So I guess that a $100,000 Sony SRW-9000 is completely out of the
> question?
>
> Okay, would you settle for a $699 Canon HV40? It's a 25 Mbps cassette
> tape based palmcorder-sized DV/HDV camcorder and offers fairly decent
> image quality for the price and you'll have money left over for
> accessories.
>
> Or perhaps someone else will have some other suggestions for you.
>
> Good luck!
>
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