ECL: Why'd they use negative voltages?
in [Design]
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From: D Yuniskis on 7 Jun 2010 21:35 krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz wrote: >>>> If you "slipped" when pulling/installing a chip, the legs >>>> would vaporize before the power supply would even hiccup. >>>> (needless to say, you removed all jewelry -- belt buckles, >>>> eye glasses, rings, etc. -- when working on it) >>> I worked on a test system that had a 100A -4V *linear* HP supply in it. The >> The Vbb supply was a *shunt* regulator. A bunch of Lambda power >> supplies driving a pair of *big* diodes "selected at test". >> A colossal waste of power. >> >>> thing was the size of a small refrigerator. The other engineer did the 1600 >>> pin pin-driver logic in proprietary ECL (-4V). I did the clock drivers in >>> MECL 10K. I only needed about 50A for the 64 clocks. ;-) >> This was the brains of a "600-pin tester". Programmable power >> supplies to the UUT. Programmable thresholds for the input >> comparators. 1ns timing resolution. It was just "insane". > > Yep, all that and 1600 pins. ;-) OTOH, it was a DC logic tester (clocks ran > at system speed - 25ns). This is what soured me on stupid, brute force solutions to problems. Nothing elegant about N copies of the same thing over and over and over and over...
From: Jim Thompson on 7 Jun 2010 21:36 On Mon, 07 Jun 2010 18:21:55 -0700, John Larkin <jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote: >On Mon, 07 Jun 2010 19:54:48 -0500, "krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz" ><krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote: > >>On Mon, 07 Jun 2010 17:47:12 -0700, John Larkin >><jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote: >> >>>On Mon, 07 Jun 2010 19:43:49 -0500, "krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz" >>><krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote: >>> >>>>On Mon, 7 Jun 2010 17:35:05 -0700, "Joel Koltner" >>>><zapwireDASHgroups(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>><krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote in message >>>>>news:4e3r065vr383q2hc9fiuhre2mu9opopbai(a)4ax.com... >>>>>>>And why 5.2V anyway? (Granted, 5.2V is no stranger than 6.3V filament >>>>>>>transformers, I suppose...) >>>>>> >>>>>> Stack up the voltages (don't forget the AND gate). >>>>> >>>>>Purportedly it'll run down to around VCC-VEE = 3V and up to about 8V before >>>>>you start seeing massive performance differences. 5.2V is certainly pretty >>>>>close to the center of those two... hmm... I wouldn't be surprised if that's >>>>>how they came upon it! >>>> >>>>No, Jim had the reason above. Try an AND gate at 3V. ;-) >>> >>>MC10EP05. >>> >>Got a schematic? > >People used to publish schematics of their chips, or at least >functional schematics. No more. > >The EPs are SiGe, I think. > >John Yep. ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, CTO | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | The only thing bipartisan in this country is hypocrisy
From: Jim Thompson on 7 Jun 2010 21:37 On Mon, 07 Jun 2010 18:26:36 -0700, John Larkin <jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote: >On Mon, 07 Jun 2010 19:51:13 -0500, "krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz" ><krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote: > >>On Mon, 7 Jun 2010 17:44:55 -0700, "Joel Koltner" >><zapwireDASHgroups(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >> >>>Thanks John, that's quite informative. >>> >>>"John Larkin" <jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote in message >>>news:di3r0613v9lkk2p8dq06snde2hgopt87fr(a)4ax.com... >>>> Newer stuff, like EclipsLite, works at 3.3 volts, and some at 2.5. I >>>> do mixed-mode PECL and cmos/FPGAs off a +3.3 volt supply. >>> >>>That's kinda what prompted the question -- Joerg has been pointing me at some >>>of the high-speed logic from the likes of Micrel, and I was reading up some in >>>the old MECL System Design Handbook so that I hopefully won't embarrass myself >>>too badly when I go to use some of it. :-) >> >>Cool stuff. ...and easy to use. > >Just be careful when doing wired-OR. It seems like a natural in ECL, >until you start to think about the speed of light. > >John Thus was born CML. ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, CTO | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | The only thing bipartisan in this country is hypocrisy
From: Vladimir Vassilevsky on 7 Jun 2010 21:44 Joel Koltner wrote: > --> http://sound.westhost.com/project117.htm (a 1500W audio amplifier, > "It is capable of destroying any loudspeaker connected to it, regardless > of claimed power rating.") :-) Pathetic :))))) Here is 10kW audio amplifier. Yes, 10kW true RMS sustained sinusoidal power. I designed the DSP and control loops for it. It indeed burns 2kW rated woofers while developing SPL of somewhat 170dB. http://www.kicker.com/warhorse Vladimir Vassilevsky DSP and Mixed Signal Design Consultant http://www.abvolt.com
From: Joel Koltner on 7 Jun 2010 21:59
"Vladimir Vassilevsky" <nospam(a)nowhere.com> wrote in message news:26GdnUsFmvX4PZDRnZ2dnUVZ_vadnZ2d(a)giganews.com... > Joel Koltner wrote: >> --> http://sound.westhost.com/project117.htm (a 1500W audio amplifier, "It >> is capable of destroying any loudspeaker connected to it, regardless of >> claimed power rating.") :-) > Pathetic :))))) > Here is 10kW audio amplifier. Yes, 10kW true RMS sustained sinusoidal power. One has to wonder what sort of speaker systems are used with such an amplifier (10kW) if 1.5kW is purportedly enough to kill any individual speaker -- must be quite the array! Ah, only a 200Hz frequency limit though: http://caraudiomag.com/articles/kicker-wx100001-warhorse-review-amplifier -- and I bet even there the distortion specs aren't that great? Still, a very cool accomplishment... ---Joel |