Error Handling
in [Java Help]
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From: Rhino on 30 May 2010 13:19 "Eric Sosman" <esosman(a)ieee-dot-org.invalid> wrote in message news:hts0qe$dnj$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... > On 5/29/2010 4:50 PM, Rhino wrote: >> "Lew"<noone(a)lewscanon.com> wrote in message >> news:htq17k$45n$1(a)news.albasani.net... >>> >>> Yeah, situations that involve a programmer actually willing to do what >>> it >>> takes to learn their craft. Except for those situations, I guess the >>> suggestions are pretty useless. >> >> Oh please! Could YOU pick up a significant amount of detail - either via >> memorization or making notes - from a 400 or 500 page book in just a >> couple >> of hours of reading? > > No. And it's clear that *you* can't, not even with far more > time spent studying: > > May 17, 2010: "I used to know how to [use instanceof] > several years ago" > > Feb 13, 2006[!]: "I've been writing Java code [...] for > several years now and feel that I could do a decent job > at an intermediate level" > > Dec 22, 2005[!!]: "I've been writing Java for several years" > > Dec 6, 2004[!!!]: "I have been writing Java for several > years and am fluent enough that I don't have to post > questions here very often" [!!!!!!!!] > > If "several plus five and a half" years of Java experience have > left you unaware of instanceof, baffled by the use of interface types, > and still asking long-winded elementary questions about exceptions, > I'd guess that you will not benefit from any book, however excellent. > Something in your brain resists Java, and you'd just be wasting time > and money trying to pound square-pegged Java into your head's round > hole. Forget Java and take up set design or viola playing or politics > or something -- there must be *some* field for which you have more > talent, because your talent for Java seems small indeed. > As the Brits would say: "Charming!" I had expected better of you. I certainly hadn't imagined that you would take time from your busy schedule to research past posts to try to find things to throw in my face. Try taking nearly four years away from Java and then see how much YOU remember when you come back to it.... -- Rhino
From: Rhino on 30 May 2010 13:39 "Lew" <noone(a)lewscanon.com> wrote in message news:hts1gk$5f7$1(a)news.albasani.net... > Daniel Pitts wrote: >>>>> You might try your local library or book store. Near where I live, >>>>> Borders >>>>> is a good place to pick up a book and read it before buying it. > > Rhino wrote: >>>> Thanks for the suggestion though! It would be good in other situations >>>> :-) > > Lew wrote: >>> Yeah, situations that involve a programmer actually willing to do what >>> it >>> takes to learn their craft. Except for those situations, I guess the >>> suggestions are pretty useless. > > Rhino wrote: >> Oh please! Could YOU pick up a significant amount of detail - either via >> memorization or making notes - from a 400 or 500 page book in just a >> couple >> of hours of reading? > > Yes, if that couple of hours is repeated, say, weekly, and accompanied > with actual practice in the art. So now I'm supposed to go back to that bookstore say, weekly, for a couple of hours each time and work on my memorizing and note-taking until I have found all that is of use to me in Robust Java. We're assuming that the staff of the store won't mind if I keep showing up and studying that book every week, right? Ok, just so I'm clear on the plan you've laid out for me.... > In fact, that pretty much describes how I learn to program Java. I don't > spend much money on books at all, so when I do buy it has to really be > worth it. > > I certainly didn't get this good at Java by protecting my ego at the > expense of my skill. > You know, I don't get my jollies from responding to character assasination so I am going to be brief. I _DO_ spend a signficant part of my day writing and reworking my Java code. But it's pretty hard to make it better if I don't know what I'm shooting for. That's why I ask questions here, so that I can try to find out how to do it better. So if you want to assume that I am just lazy and waiting for all the answers to be given to me, that's up to you. > Nor by making pathetic excuses that somehow not buying books should in any > way impede my learning. > And I say again, for the LAST time, that memorizing large tracts of a complex book where you have to get the details right is just not something I can do. In fact, I don't think it's something ANYONE can realistically do, unless perhaps they have so called eidetic ("photographic") memory, which I don't. And making handwritten notes of that same book while sitting in a bookstore/coffeeshop is only marginally more plausible. I don't have a laptop and can't afford to buy one either so it would take ages to write down any significant part of a book that size. And unless bookstores are radically different in your part of the world, I don't think you'll be surprised to hear that photocopiers aren't available in the bookstores here.... >> Do YOU have so much influence that you can put in a request for an >> interlibrary loan and have the book appear in a mere day or two? > > Maybe a week. And that's just the normal public library, no special > influence needed. So? > > How is never better than a week's delay? > I have never done an interlibrary loan but I seem to recall that friends who tried it waited several MONTHS for the book they wanted. And "never" didn't figure into any discussion about Interlibrary Loans. I said that if it was going to take a long time - by which I meant months since that was what friends had told me - I would just have to wait until I could afford to BUY the book. Just to show you my heart's in the right place, I will put in an Interlibrary Loan for Robust Java this afternoon and see how long it takes. >> If so, my hat is off to you for you are clearly a superhuman, not a mere >> mortal like me. > > Oh, please! > -- Rhino
From: markspace on 30 May 2010 13:59 Rhino wrote: > And I say again, for the LAST time, that memorizing large tracts of a > complex book where you have to get the details right is just not something I > can do. In fact, I don't think it's something ANYONE can realistically do, > unless perhaps they have so called eidetic ("photographic") memory, which I > don't. Just a brief note before I disappear for the (American) holiday weekend: this is exactly how I learned Java. Or one of the ways, at least. I got a copy of Kathy Sierra's book for the SCJP exam, went through each chapter, took notes, took the exams at the end of each chapter, corrected my own exams, etc. It's tedious and frustrating work, but it will teach you Java. You just have to preserve and keep at it. The other thing that teaches Java is taking a structured course with programming exercises. Hands on work is essential to learning. (At college, they call this a "lab" class.) I used the javapassion.com site when it was free. I'd still recommend that site if you have the $39US to spare, as it was a step above what you'd normally get at a local community college. You can simulate this yourself with your own self-programming studies, but one also tends to get stuck in a rut this way and not learn new things. Having a lab designed by someone else can move you into new areas of learning.
From: Tom Anderson on 30 May 2010 15:58 On Sun, 30 May 2010, Rhino wrote: > "Eric Sosman" <esosman(a)ieee-dot-org.invalid> wrote in message > news:hts0qe$dnj$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... > >> May 17, 2010: "I used to know how to [use instanceof] several years >> ago" >> >> Feb 13, 2006[!]: "I've been writing Java code [...] for several years >> now and feel that I could do a decent job at an intermediate level" >> >> Dec 22, 2005[!!]: "I've been writing Java for several years" >> >> Dec 6, 2004[!!!]: "I have been writing Java for several years and am >> fluent enough that I don't have to post questions here very often" >> [!!!!!!!!] >> >> If "several plus five and a half" years of Java experience have left >> you unaware of instanceof, baffled by the use of interface types, and >> still asking long-winded elementary questions about exceptions, I'd >> guess that you will not benefit from any book, however excellent. >> Something in your brain resists Java, and you'd just be wasting time >> and money trying to pound square-pegged Java into your head's round >> hole. Forget Java and take up set design or viola playing or politics >> or something -- there must be *some* field for which you have more >> talent, because your talent for Java seems small indeed. > > As the Brits would say: "Charming!" > > I had expected better of you. I certainly hadn't imagined that you would > take time from your busy schedule to research past posts to try to find > things to throw in my face. Try taking nearly four years away from Java > and then see how much YOU remember when you come back to it.... I did - well, except it was nearly ten years rather than nearly four. I had a paying java job in 1998, then stopped and went off to pursue a career in biology. Gave up on that in 2008 and returned to the fold. I wrote the odd bit of java in my time away, but mostly switched to python for my programming needs. I had quite a bit of catching up to do, and a lot of stuff to remember, but i did. In fact, it was easy; i suspect because i'd learned it fairly well before i left, so it call came flooding back. The fact that you are not finding it as easy suggests to me that despite your several years of experience before your break, you had never really understood java. This fits with an impression that i am developing of you: you are energetic, interested, and clever, but you are lacking in attention span. To understand something, you need to take time to sit down and think about it, really think about it, to do your own reading and work through problems, learning from them as you do so. From your posts, it seems like you tend to work in a more reactive, superficial way: hit a problem, post about it, get answers, try to apply them, then come back with more questions. There is a flow of information, but it seems to bypass the part of your brain that does learning. Now, that might actually be a reasonably effective way of getting things done - indeed, i think it might be the way in which the vast majority of working programmers operate! - but it is not a road which leads to mastery. tom -- There is no latest trend.
From: Patricia Shanahan on 1 Jun 2010 09:29
Rhino wrote: > "Daniel Pitts" <newsgroup.spamfilter(a)virtualinfinity.net> wrote in message > news:LvWLn.15255$7d5.3812(a)newsfe17.iad... >> On 5/28/2010 1:51 PM, Rhino wrote: >>> "Jeff Higgins"<oohiggins(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message >>> news:htp86q$arf$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... >>>> On 5/28/2010 2:58 PM, Rhino wrote: >>>>> I'm trying to figure out some "best practices" for error handling. >>>>> >>>> <http://books.google.com/books?id=Fz1kQgAACAAJ&dq=Robust+Java&cd=1> >>> Thank you. Money is tight right now so I won't be able to get that book >>> right away but I'll look at buying it when I have a bit more disposable >>> income.... >>> >>> -- >>> Rhino >>> >>> >> You might try your local library or book store. Near where I live, Borders >> is a good place to pick up a book and read it before buying it. >> >> Some might say this is a dubious activity, however I buy plenty of books >> and also patronize the coffee shop frequently. >> > > That would be a better strategy for a situation where I just want to get one > or two details and could write them down or memorize them while "browsing". > But the description makes it look like there's lot of good stuff inside, far > more than I could reasonably memorize or summarize even if I spent a couple > of hours browsing. I would combine the two suggested free reading strategies. First check whether the book is available in your local library, and if not place an inter-library loan request for it. Meanwhile, start hanging out at Borders. Even if you do not have the money for coffee, they have chairs scattered around the shelf area. You need to get away from thinking of programming in terms of a set of rules of thumb that you would have to write down. Look for understanding and ways of thinking. Those can be absorbed and internalized by a mix of reading and practice. Until you get the library book, go to Borders, read a bit, then go home and practice what you read. Repeat. Unless you have enough money for a shelf full of Java books, you need to apply the free reading strategies to get a good range of viewpoints. Patricia |