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From: Ken Blake, MVP on 15 Dec 2009 09:52 On Mon, 14 Dec 2009 21:02:39 -0500, "Daave" <daave(a)example.com> wrote: > Ken Blake, MVP wrote: > > On Mon, 14 Dec 2009 17:54:55 -0700, "Bill in Co." > > <not_really_here(a)earthlink.net> wrote: > > > >> HeyBub wrote: > >>> Bill in Co. wrote: > >>>> Yes, I know you said that, but I asked specifically about what > >>>> would be the consequences of running System Restore in more > >>>> detail, Peter (see below). > >>> > >>> Because Restore doesn't add or delete ordinary files. Restore > >>> snapshots the > >>> Registry and backs up dynamic system files, unsigned drivers, > >>> automatic updates, and the like. It does not touch what it thinks > >>> are "application" programs, nor does it fool with "data." > >> > >> I was under the impression System Restore monitored ALL exe, dll, > >> com, and the like, files. > > > > > > No, it doesn't do this at all. It's *System* Restore. What it monitors > > is *system* files only. Application files like exes, dlls, etc. are > > not monitored. > > See the link PA Bear posted: > > http://bertk.mvps.org:80/html/filesfolders.html > > They are monitored (unless they are located in a non-monitored folder). That essentially says the same thing I said. The monitored folders are system folders. The application files are not in system folders and are not monitored. It does not monitor "ALL exe, dll, com, and the like, files." > >> In other words, all potentially problematic files. > >> (Excluded would be things like text files, for example). > >> > >> In fact, I'm pretty sure it does this, since if you've ever added > >> any such files to your HD, and then done a System Restore back prior > >> to that point in time, you will lose them all, UNLESS those files > >> were saved in the personal folders, like Documents and Settings, My > >> Documents. > > > > > > No, not even if they are saved there. > > Maybe the term "monitored" is causing confusion. If you download an > installation file (.exe) to your desktop and perform a System Restore to > a time before you downloaded it there, it will be gone. If you place it > in your My Documents folder however, "Bill in Co" is correct; it will > remain there after a System Restore(becuase even though .exe files are > normally monitored, they are not monitored if they are in a > non-monitored folder). You can confirm this yourself if you wish. > -- Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP (Windows Desktop Experience) since 2003 Please Reply to the Newsgroup
From: Bill in Co. on 15 Dec 2009 14:38 Ken Blake, MVP wrote: > On Mon, 14 Dec 2009 21:02:39 -0500, "Daave" <daave(a)example.com> wrote: > >> Ken Blake, MVP wrote: >>> On Mon, 14 Dec 2009 17:54:55 -0700, "Bill in Co." >>> <not_really_here(a)earthlink.net> wrote: >>> >>>> HeyBub wrote: >>>>> Bill in Co. wrote: >>>>>> Yes, I know you said that, but I asked specifically about what >>>>>> would be the consequences of running System Restore in more >>>>>> detail, Peter (see below). >>>>> >>>>> Because Restore doesn't add or delete ordinary files. Restore >>>>> snapshots the >>>>> Registry and backs up dynamic system files, unsigned drivers, >>>>> automatic updates, and the like. It does not touch what it thinks >>>>> are "application" programs, nor does it fool with "data." >>>> >>>> I was under the impression System Restore monitored ALL exe, dll, >>>> com, and the like, files. >>> >>> >>> No, it doesn't do this at all. It's *System* Restore. What it monitors >>> is *system* files only. Application files like exes, dlls, etc. are >>> not monitored. >> >> See the link PA Bear posted: >> >> http://bertk.mvps.org:80/html/filesfolders.html >> >> They are monitored (unless they are located in a non-monitored folder). > > > That essentially says the same thing I said. The monitored folders are > system folders. NOT only those, Ken. In fact, unless your monitored-type files (that list is pretty extensive, and includes EXE, DLL, COM, etc) are in a personal folder like My Docs, it IS monitored, to the extent that if it contains an exe file that was added later, those files will be deleted after a System Restore (more below - I know this from firsthand experience, too) > The application files are not in system folders and > are not monitored. It does not monitor "ALL exe, dll, com, and the > like, files." Ken, check out the link I posted from the Microsoft web site. The exe and dll files ARE indeed monitored, and NOT just in system folders. You can do this test yourself: save some exe program file of your choice anywhere you like on your HD, except in an unmonitored directory like My Documents, then do a System Restore, and it WILL be removed. Again, I know it from firsthand experience. Here is one of the MS links: http://www.microsoft.com/resources/documentation/windows/xp/all/proddocs/en-us/app_system_restore_hss_understand.mspx (from this link, on System Restore): "For example, if you accidentally delete monitored program files (such as files that have the .exe or .dll file name extensions), or monitored program files become corrupted, you can restore your computer to a state that existed before those changes occurred. [ed note: this does not mean the exe file has to be in c:\program files!] By default, System Restore monitors and restores all partitions and drives on your computer. It also monitors all installations of applications or drivers that users perform through delivery mechanisms such as CD-ROM, floppy disk, Systems Management Server (SMS), or IntelliMirror. Restores your computer without losing your personal files: System Restore does not cause you to lose your personal files or password. Items like documents, e-mail messages, browsing history, and the last specified password are saved when you revert to an earlier state with System Restore. System Restore protects your personal files by not restoring any files in the My Documents folder. It also does not restore any files that use common data file name extensions, such as .doc or .xls. If you're not sure whether your personal files use common data file name extensions, and you do not want the data files to be affected by System Restore, save them in the My Documents folder. NOTE this last point. **If your personal files include program file types like exe, you're out of luck unless you saved them in an unmonitored folder like My Documents! (by out of luck I mean SR will remove them after a restore operation, if they were added after that) >>>> In other words, all potentially problematic files. >>>> (Excluded would be things like text files, for example). >>>> >>>> In fact, I'm pretty sure it does this, since if you've ever added >>>> any such files to your HD, and then done a System Restore back prior >>>> to that point in time, you will lose them all, UNLESS those files >>>> were saved in the personal folders, like Documents and Settings, My >>>> Documents. >>> >>> >>> No, not even if they are saved there. >> >> Maybe the term "monitored" is causing confusion. If you download an >> installation file (.exe) to your desktop and perform a System Restore to >> a time before you downloaded it there, it will be gone. If you place it >> in your My Documents folder however, "Bill in Co" is correct; it will >> remain there after a System Restore(becuase even though .exe files are >> normally monitored, they are not monitored if they are in a >> non-monitored folder). You can confirm this yourself if you wish. >> > > -- > Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP (Windows Desktop Experience) since 2003 > Please Reply to the Newsgroup
From: Bill in Co. on 15 Dec 2009 14:59 ** Addended with a list of the monitored file extensions Bill in Co. wrote: > Ken Blake, MVP wrote: >> On Mon, 14 Dec 2009 21:02:39 -0500, "Daave" <daave(a)example.com> wrote: >> >>> Ken Blake, MVP wrote: >>>> On Mon, 14 Dec 2009 17:54:55 -0700, "Bill in Co." >>>> <not_really_here(a)earthlink.net> wrote: >>>> >>>>> HeyBub wrote: >>>>>> Bill in Co. wrote: >>>>>>> Yes, I know you said that, but I asked specifically about what >>>>>>> would be the consequences of running System Restore in more >>>>>>> detail, Peter (see below). >>>>>> >>>>>> Because Restore doesn't add or delete ordinary files. Restore >>>>>> snapshots the >>>>>> Registry and backs up dynamic system files, unsigned drivers, >>>>>> automatic updates, and the like. It does not touch what it thinks >>>>>> are "application" programs, nor does it fool with "data." >>>>> >>>>> I was under the impression System Restore monitored ALL exe, dll, >>>>> com, and the like, files. >>>> >>>> >>>> No, it doesn't do this at all. It's *System* Restore. What it monitors >>>> is *system* files only. Application files like exes, dlls, etc. are >>>> not monitored. >>> >>> See the link PA Bear posted: >>> >>> http://bertk.mvps.org:80/html/filesfolders.html >>> >>> They are monitored (unless they are located in a non-monitored folder). >> >> >> That essentially says the same thing I said. The monitored folders are >> system folders. > > NOT only those, Ken. In fact, unless your monitored-type files (that > list > is pretty extensive, and includes EXE, DLL, COM, etc) are in a personal > folder like My Docs, it IS monitored, to the extent that if it contains an > exe file that was added later, those files will be deleted after a System > Restore (more below - I know this from firsthand experience, too) > >> The application files are not in system folders and >> are not monitored. It does not monitor "ALL exe, dll, com, and the >> like, files." > > Ken, check out the link I posted from the Microsoft web site. The exe > and > dll files ARE indeed monitored, and NOT just in system folders. > > You can do this test yourself: save some exe program file of your choice > anywhere you like on your HD, except in an unmonitored directory like My > Documents, then do a System Restore, and it WILL be removed. Again, I > > know it from firsthand experience. Here is one of the MS links: > http://www.microsoft.com/resources/documentation/windows/xp/all/proddocs/en-us/app_system_restore_hss_understand.mspx > > (from this link, on System Restore): > "For example, if you accidentally delete monitored program files (such as > files that have the .exe or .dll file name extensions), or monitored > program > files become corrupted, you can restore your computer to a state that > existed before those changes occurred. > > [ed note: this does not mean the exe file has to be in c:\program files!] > > By default, System Restore monitors and restores all partitions and drives > on your computer. It also monitors all installations of applications or > drivers that users perform through delivery mechanisms such as CD-ROM, > floppy disk, Systems Management Server (SMS), or IntelliMirror. > > Restores your computer without losing your personal files: > System Restore does not cause you to lose your personal files or password. > Items like documents, e-mail messages, browsing history, and the last > specified password are saved when you revert to an earlier state with > System Restore. > > System Restore protects your personal files by not restoring any files in > the My Documents folder. It also does not restore any files that use > common > data file name extensions, such as .doc or .xls. If you're not sure > whether > your personal files use common data file name extensions, and you do not > want the data files to be affected by System Restore, save them in the My > Documents folder. > > NOTE this last point. **If your personal files include program file > types > like exe, you're out of luck unless you saved them in an unmonitored > folder > like My Documents! (by out of luck I mean SR will remove them after a > restore operation, if they were added after that) > > >>>>> In other words, all potentially problematic files. >>>>> (Excluded would be things like text files, for example). >>>>> >>>>> In fact, I'm pretty sure it does this, since if you've ever added >>>>> any such files to your HD, and then done a System Restore back prior >>>>> to that point in time, you will lose them all, UNLESS those files >>>>> were saved in the personal folders, like Documents and Settings, My >>>>> Documents. >>>> >>>> >>>> No, not even if they are saved there. >>> >>> Maybe the term "monitored" is causing confusion. If you download an >>> installation file (.exe) to your desktop and perform a System Restore to >>> a time before you downloaded it there, it will be gone. If you place it >>> in your My Documents folder however, "Bill in Co" is correct; it will >>> remain there after a System Restore(becuase even though .exe files are >>> normally monitored, they are not monitored if they are in a >>> non-monitored folder). You can confirm this yourself if you wish. >>> Addended: Here is a list of the monitored file extensions from http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa378870(VS.85).aspx Monitored File Name Extensions The following is a list of monitored file name extensions. Files with these extensions are monitored by System Restore in Windows Vista and later. The files that are monitored or excluded from monitoring in Windows XP are specified in the file %windir%\system32\restore\Filelist.xml. The file Filelist.xml does not exist in Windows Vista and later. ~~C ~~D 12A 1PA 1ST 386 8BA 8BY 8LI A2A AAS AAX ABM ABR ACF ACG ACO ACS ADK ADW ADX AFM AID AIP ALT AM AMB APL APM APP APV AR ARX AS AT ATC ATL ATM ATN AW AWE AWX AX B0 BAT BCF BD BDR BE BGB BGR BID BIT BK1 BLD BM BMA BND BNF BOF BPP BPT BPX BT BTN BUC CAG CAO CAT CBS CC CF CFG CHA CIK CL CLW CLX CLY CMD CNT CNV COL COM CPB CPL CQM CR CRL CRS CRV CS CSB CSI CSL CSW CTB CTG CTY CUS CW_ D01 D02 D03 D04 D05 D32 DATA DB0 DB1 DB2 DC2 DCA DCF DCI DCL DDB DDD DEP DES DESKLINK DET DGM DIALOG DID DIR DISABLED DIX DLL DOB DOS DRC DRS DRV DS DSC DSK DSN DSR DSX DT DTT DUN DVB DWT DXT DYNCMD ECF EFF EFM EID EL ELM END ENU ENV EOT EPF ET EX_ EXA EXCLUDE EXE EXL F32 FAE FAM FAS FFP FIN FIO FLL FLW FMC FMP FNT FON FSG FSS GCS GDB GI_ GMS GNG GPD GS GSF GST GUIATN GUICMD GVT GWD H16 HCT HDC HDI HDP HFX HGD HHC HHK HK0 HK1 HK2 HK3 HLP HM HTA HTC HTZ HU HWL HYP IAT IBD ICD ICM ICO ICR ICW ID IDS IFA ILF ILG ILM IN_ INCL INF INI INK INL INO INS INV IP IRS ISA ISS ISU ITF J0 JA JBR JCM JGD K01 K02 K03 KBD KNN KO L0 L2L L2P LAB LAM LAST LCA LCK LDA LEX LGC LGD LGE LGF LIC LID LIM LIVEREG LLI LMC LMG LMP LNK LO~ LRD LRS LSM LSO LSQ LSS LSX LT LTS LV M20 MANIFEST MAPIMAIL MC MCD MCM MD2 MDM MDP ME MFL MHK MIL MLN MMC MMM MMX MNC MNL MNR MNS MOF MOR MP MPD MPT MSB MSC MSE MSI MST MSK MSO MXT MYDOCS N0 NAM NAME NDX NEW NFO NIB NMD NOD NPM NQM NQV NSI NSW NTE NU4 NUM NUS NV OBE OCM OCX ODE ODL OLB OLD OLE OP OPG OR5 OSD OUT P2A PAG PBC PBK PBV PC3 PCI PDI PDR PEN PER PFB PFM PFR PH PHO PHX PID PIF PL3 PLY PMT PNF POC POF POL PPD PR4 PROPERTIES PRX PSC PSF PSP PT PTH PTX PV Q0 Q32 Q3X QDAT QJF QRS QTC QTD QTW QUE QUF QUT R0 R98 RAD RAT RC2 RCP RCT RDB RDC REF REG RGS RH RI RJS RO ROB RPR RPS RSD RSP RSRC RTA RTR RU S98 SAM SAX SCK SCR SCS SECURITY SELFREG SFP SG SG0 SG1 SHARED SHR SHX SIF SK SLL SMC SMM SNP SOF SPC SPE SPM SPT SPX SR SRC SRG SRT SSM SST
From: Daave on 15 Dec 2009 17:15 Trying to untangle this web... Ken Blake, MVP wrote: > On Mon, 14 Dec 2009 17:54:55 -0700, "Bill in Co." > <not_really_here(a)earthlink.net> wrote: > >> HeyBub wrote: >>> Bill in Co. wrote: >>>> Yes, I know you said that, but I asked specifically about what >>>> would be the consequences of running System Restore in more >>>> detail, Peter (see below). >>> >>> Because Restore doesn't add or delete ordinary files. Restore >>> snapshots the >>> Registry and backs up dynamic system files, unsigned drivers, >>> automatic updates, and the like. It does not touch what it thinks >>> are "application" programs, nor does it fool with "data." >> >> I was under the impression System Restore monitored ALL exe, dll, >> com, and the like, files. Okay, this is the beginning of the misunderstanding. :-) System Restore does not monitor *all* of those files because *most* of these files are normally in non-monitored folders. The example I gave in another post was an .exe file (e.g., and installation file for a program you wish to install) saved to the desktop. That file *would* be monitored. And if you ran System Restore, choosing a point before you downloaded this .exe file, it would indeed be deleted (because the Desktop is monitored). However, if you had instead downloaded this .exe file to "My Documents," it would be safe (since that location is *not* monitored). So "Bill in Co." is incorrect. (Or he is not totally correct.) The reason: System Restore does not monitor *all* those files mentioned (including .exe files). They only get monitored if they are in folders that get monitored. :-) > No, it doesn't do this at all. It's *System* Restore. What it monitors > is *system* files only. Application files like exes, dlls, etc. are > not monitored. And Ken is also incorrect (at least partially). Those files *are* mointored, but then again, provided they are located in folders that get monitored. Source: http://bertk.mvps.org/html/filesfolders.html
From: Bill in Co. on 15 Dec 2009 18:00
Daave wrote: > Trying to untangle this web... > > Ken Blake, MVP wrote: >> On Mon, 14 Dec 2009 17:54:55 -0700, "Bill in Co." >> <not_really_here(a)earthlink.net> wrote: >> >>> HeyBub wrote: >>>> Bill in Co. wrote: >>>>> Yes, I know you said that, but I asked specifically about what >>>>> would be the consequences of running System Restore in more >>>>> detail, Peter (see below). >>>> >>>> Because Restore doesn't add or delete ordinary files. Restore >>>> snapshots the >>>> Registry and backs up dynamic system files, unsigned drivers, >>>> automatic updates, and the like. It does not touch what it thinks >>>> are "application" programs, nor does it fool with "data." >>> >>> I was under the impression System Restore monitored ALL exe, dll, >>> com, and the like, files. > > Okay, this is the beginning of the misunderstanding. :-) > > System Restore does not monitor *all* of those files because *most* of > these files are normally in non-monitored folders. The example I gave in > another post was an .exe file (e.g., and installation file for a program > you wish to install) saved to the desktop. That file *would* be > monitored. And if you ran System Restore, choosing a point before you > downloaded this .exe file, it would indeed be deleted (because the > Desktop is monitored). However, if you had instead downloaded this .exe > file to "My Documents," it would be safe (since that location is *not* > monitored). > > So "Bill in Co." is incorrect. (Or he is not totally correct.) The > reason: System Restore does not monitor *all* those files mentioned > (including .exe files). They only get monitored if they are in folders > that get monitored. :-) And that's precisely the point, or one of the main points I was trying to say. To restate: MOST folders on your HD *are*, in fact, monitored - the rare exception is in the My Documents arena. Anything you save in a normal folder that you create or use EXCEPT in the Documents and Settings area like in My Documents, WILL be monitored for any changes to those monitored file types. >> No, it doesn't do this at all. It's *System* Restore. What it monitors >> is *system* files only. Application files like exes, dlls, etc. are >> not monitored. > > And Ken is also incorrect (at least partially). Those files *are* > mointored, but then again, provided they are located in folders that get > monitored. Which are, in fact, MOST folders on your HD, except as noted above. In case anybody is a Doubting Thomas, I'd suggest you try it out with some test files (exe type) saved in ANY folder on your HD except the one noted above (under Documents and Settings as noted above). Try it. Create a folder C:\Temp and put some in there, do a System Restore, and see what's left when you come back after Restore. (N.B.: .doc and .txt files and similar are untouched, of course) |