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From: Winston on 17 Dec 2009 16:54
IYM wrote:

(...)

>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ___B___ ___15___
>>>>>>>> / \/\/
>>>>>>>> /
>>>>>>>> | /
>>>>>>>> |/__
>>>>>>>>


(...)

> Just FYI - I got confirmation back from the customer today....They had
> been looking at it, checking archives ect. and finally came up with....
>
> <drum-roll>
>
> "We have no freakin' idea what the hell that is!" LOL and the solution
> was to give us a waiver saying to ignore that callout...
>
> There is always a first for everything.... lol


You passed the test!

That looks like a 'Van Halen Callout'
http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/vanhalen.asp

"By far the most notorious of these whimsical requests is the legend that
Van Halen's standard concert contract called for them to be provided with
a bowl of M&Ms backstage, but with provision that all the brown candies
must be removed. The presence of even a single brown M&M in that bowl,
rumor had it, was sufficient legal cause for Van Halen to peremptorily
cancel a scheduled appearance without advance notice (and usually an
excuse for them to go on a destructive rampage as well).

The legendary "no brown M&Ms" contract clause was indeed real, but the
purported motivation for it was not. The M&Ms provision was included in
Van Halen's contracts not as an act of caprice, but because it served a
practical purpose: to provide an easy way of determining whether the
technical specifications of the contract had been thoroughly read
(and complied with)."


--Winston


--

Congratulations Robert Piccinini and Steven A. Burd, WalMart Publicists of the Year!
From: John R. Carroll on 17 Dec 2009 17:37
IYM" <"S U N risr wrote:
> Gerald Abrahamson wrote:
>> On Fri, 11 Dec 2009 08:37:37 -0500, IYM <"S U N
>> risr"@optonline.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Cliff wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 09 Dec 2009 11:21:14 -0800, BillT <kinzie(a)mail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Kirk Gordon wrote:
>>>>>> Cliff wrote:
>>>>>>> On Mon, 07 Dec 2009 14:57:54 -0500, IYM <"S U N
>>>>>>> risr"@optonline.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've been working on drawings since the mid 1980's and I
>>>>>>>> haven't come across this one yet...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Anyone ever see a call out on a print like the one below?
>>>>>>>> This print is from the '60 and it points to a few surfaces and
>>>>>>>> a bore. I'm thinking it might be some kind of burr call-out?
>>>>>>>> The mating part calls out the same symbol on the mating shaft
>>>>>>>> and face. All the same surfaces indicated by this also have
>>>>>>>> the normal 32 surface finish call out, so it's not that.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ___B___ ___15___
>>>>>>>> / \/\/
>>>>>>>> /
>>>>>>>>> /
>>>>>>>>> /__
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I tried searching the web, but came up short...any ideas?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> IYM
>>>>>>> Anybody?
>>>>>> I don't recognize it the way it shows up in text-only; but
>>>>>> given the age and content, I'd guess it's calling for a .015
>>>>>> corner or corner break.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> KG
>>>>>>
>>>>> I think that's a bingo! Old print - R looks like a B... makes
>>>>> sense.
>>> No - Definatly a B...Print is clear, just old. Sorry about the text
>>> look of it, but I tried (lol) the bottom is supposed to be an arrow
>>> head, not a corner it's pointing to. It's supposed to be one
>>> straight unbroken line with a kind of "w" in the line and it
>>> actually points to 3 surfaces and a bore. Interestingly, the
>>> mating part has the same symbol on the mating surfaces and
>>> features. Customer is still looking into it and will post the
>>> reply when I find out.
>>
>> If these mating parts/surfaces are hand-fitted for final
>> assembly, then it is probably a "get it this close" to the
>> final dimension--and that leaves enough material to be
>> ground off a round surface or manually honed out of the hole
>> diameter to fit. Think crankshaft and bearing.... Turn the
>> OD of the crank surfaces to within (say) .015" and then use
>> the crank grinder to get to the final dimension. Then
>> machine the bearings (or whatever) to 015" undersize--and
>> then manually bore and fit the final crank dimensions once
>> it is in hand. This would be especially true if the
>> centerlines of those surfaces were required to be straight
>> line.
>
>
> Just FYI - I got confirmation back from the customer today....They had
> been looking at it, checking archives ect. and finally came up
> with....
>
> <drum-roll>
>
> "We have no freakin' idea what the hell that is!" LOL and the
> solution was to give us a waiver saying to ignore that callout...
>
> There is always a first for everything.... lol

I would have thought it was a weld joint specification and looked for
something there.
What this might be is a call out for a butt welded joint.

--
John R. Carroll


From: Cliff on 18 Dec 2009 13:17
On Thu, 17 Dec 2009 19:35:22 -0800, Bruce L. Bergman
<bruceNOSPAMbergman(a)gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, even with the free pass I still wouldn't "just" ignore that
>callout without thinking it through first.

Nor would I.

> Look at the names in the
>title box, and see if you can track down any of the original engineers
>or designers of the device - ask them what the heck it means.
>
> Get the details of what this part is supposed to do and how it goes
>together,

Check the mating parts, if any. It still has to mate, right?

>and have their engineers think it through as if they were
>designing it new. If it makes sense to do a radius break on that
>corner, you want to do it - AIUI, a knife-edge corner is a real good
>place to start a crack,

And to get dinged in shippping & assembly, etc.
Or even prevent assembly.

>where a nice radius edge spreads the stresses
>around _just_ enough to keep it from starting...
>
> And if this is for aircraft or medical use, you'll be in BIG trouble
>not following the print, especially when it fails and kills someone -
>The FAA or the FDA is going to want to know the exact parentage of
>that part that failed. And they'll be looking for blood.

If there are even older versions of the print one might
have a note of adding that callout. Might.
--
Cliff
From: Cliff on 18 Dec 2009 13:20
On Fri, 18 Dec 2009 07:49:45 -0500, IYM <"S U N risr"@optonline.net> wrote:

>Have to try the nursing home - lol...<joke> Some of the other
>components calling out the same symbol have a 1953 dwn date...On the
>basis that the engineer/designer/draftsman were around say 30 years old
>around that time, that would put them in their late 70's or 80's, well
>past retirement. I don't think there is anyone there from that era
>anymore. Also, the prints were acquired by our customer in the 1980's
>when the original company was acquired (I believe), so the paper trail
>to find someone gets a little muddy..

IIRC The /\/ on the label leader indicates an edge break
& R indicates radius while no R indicates a chamfer break.
But don't hold me to it.
--
Cliff.
From: Cliff on 18 Dec 2009 13:23
On Thu, 17 Dec 2009 14:37:58 -0800, "John R. Carroll" <nunya(a)bidness.dev.nul>
wrote:

>I would have thought it was a weld joint specification and looked for
>something there.
>What this might be is a call out for a butt welded joint.

That should be on an assembly, not detail, drawing I'd think.
Plus I checked some weld symbod charts (but no doubt missed many).
--
Cliff
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