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From: guskz on 28 Mar 2010 11:20
Space is seen to expand uniformly in all directions, which disobeys
both the Hypotenuse and Euclidean law.

Instead of a right-angle triangle, if points A,B,C are along a linear
trajectory in space, Hubble observation also cannot be Euclidean.
Therefore even though Hubble observation shows an accelerate expansion
when comparing Velocity AtoC versus Velocity AtoB, it does not mean it
really is an accelerated expansion until non-Euclidean geometry is
factored into the observation.....
From: Sam Wormley on 28 Mar 2010 13:56
On 3/28/10 10:20 AM, guskz(a)hotmail.com wrote:
> Space is seen to expand uniformly in all directions, which disobeys
> both the Hypotenuse and Euclidean law.
>

Expanding space does NOT violate Euclidean geometry.

History of the Universe from This Week's Finds in Mathematical Physics
(Week 196) -- First of all, we only "know" anything about the world on
the basis of various assumptions. If our assumptions turn out to be
wrong, our "knowledge" may turn out to be wrong too. Even worse, our
favorite concepts may turn out to be meaningless, or meaningful only
under some restrictions.

So, when we talk about what happened in the first microsecond after the
Big Bang, we're not claiming absolute certainty. Instead, we're using
various widely accepted assumptions about physics to guess what
happened. Given these assumptions, the concept of "the first microsecond
after the Big Bang" makes perfect sense. But if these assumptions are
wrong, the whole question could dissolve into meaninglessness. That's
just a risk we have to run. What are these assumptions, exactly? They
include:

1. General Relativity
2. Standard Model of particle physics

supplemented by

3. Dark Energy (a non zero cosmological constant)
4. Dark Matter (electromagnetic non interaction)

Assumptions 3 and 4 are the ones most people like to worry about,
because our only evidence for them comes from cosmological observations,
and if they're true, they probably require some sort of modification of
the Standard Model. But if we don't make these assumptions, our model of
cosmology just doesn't work... while if we *do*, it seems to work quite
well.

In fact, the WMAP experiment gives a lot of new evidence that it
works surprisingly well.

1. The polarization of the microwave background anisotropy coming from
scattering by electrons 400 million years after the Big Bang has been
detected. This is evidence for an early generation of stars existing 2
to 3 times earlier than any object yet observed.

2. The WMAP data agree with previous work showing the Universe is flat
and in an accelerating expansion.

3. The WMAP data give the most precise values for the density of
ordinary [baryonic] matter made of protons and neutrons: 0.4 yoctograms
per cubic meter, and for the total of dark and baryonic matter: 2.5
yoctograms per cubic meter. These correspond to omega_b = 0.0224 +/-
0.0009 and omega_m = 0.135 +/- 0.009.

4. The WMAP data give the most precise value for the age of the
Universe: 13.7 +/- 0.2 Gyr. The Hubble constant is Ho = 71 +/- 4
km/sec/Mpc, and the vacuum energy density corresponds to lambda = 0.73
+/- 0.04.


From: HardySpicer on 28 Mar 2010 14:00
On Mar 29, 4:20 am, "gu...(a)hotmail.com" <gu...(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
> Space is seen to expand uniformly in all directions, which disobeys
> both the Hypotenuse and Euclidean law.
>
> Instead of a right-angle triangle, if points A,B,C are along a linear
> trajectory in space, Hubble observation also cannot be Euclidean.
> Therefore even though Hubble observation shows an accelerate expansion
> when comparing Velocity AtoC versus Velocity AtoB, it does not mean it
> really is an accelerated expansion until non-Euclidean geometry is
> factored into the observation.....

It's all down to the aberation of light experiment which is a bit
questionable.
Could be that we THINK the Universe is Euclidean in our small region
but it's almost certainly Lobacheski in nature ie curved outward.
Only makes a diffference at very large distances.

Hardy
From: Sam Wormley on 28 Mar 2010 14:18
On 3/28/10 1:00 PM, HardySpicer wrote:

> Could be that we THINK the Universe is Euclidean in our small region
> but it's almost certainly Lobacheski in nature ie curved outward.
> Only makes a diffference at very large distances.
>
> Hardy

WMAP Data:

1. The polarization of the microwave background anisotropy coming from
scattering by electrons 400 million years after the Big Bang has been
detected. This is evidence for an early generation of stars existing 2
to 3 times earlier than any object yet observed.

2. The WMAP data agree with previous work showing the Universe is flat
and in an accelerating expansion.

3. The WMAP data give the most precise values for the density of
ordinary [baryonic] matter made of protons and neutrons: 0.4 yoctograms
per cubic meter, and for the total of dark and baryonic matter: 2.5
yoctograms per cubic meter. These correspond to omega_b = 0.0224 +/-
0.0009 and omega_m = 0.135 +/- 0.009.

4. The WMAP data give the most precise value for the age of the
Universe: 13.7 +/- 0.2 Gyr. The Hubble constant is Ho = 71 +/- 4
km/sec/Mpc, and the vacuum energy density corresponds to lambda = 0.73
+/- 0.04.

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