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From: P2B on 21 Feb 2006 21:25


FlamingTaco wrote:
> I'd take 133 if I can get it. Anything to feed the CPU a little
> better.

That would require changing the clock chip - not a trivial task,
especially since new ones aren't available so you'd have to transplant.

Your Celeron 1.3 is unlikely to be stable on 133Mhz FSB anyway - most
Tualatin cores become unstable between 1.5 and 1.6Ghz, very few can
manage 1.73Ghz. The safe choice for 133Mhz FSB is a Celeron 1.1, while a
1.2 carries some risk but usually works.

> Do you have any boards for sale? Or chips?

I have one brand new P2B-S 1.04 on the shelf, but it's the spare for my
file server - not for sale, sorry. There's a couple of known-good
9250-08 clock chips on otherwise dead boards, but it would be cheaper
and easier to buy a P2B-S 1.04 on eBay than to buy a used chip and
install it.

If you went the eBay route, you could have it shipped to me to add the
4th FSB jumper on it's way to you.

> Would I need a VRM as well, or does the slot-t card handle that?

Slot-T does not have a VRM. You have not posted your board revision or
VRM chip details, so I don't know if you need one. If it's rev 1.03 it
should have a Tualatin-capable VRM, otherwise not.

> Also, have you looked for better cooling options, or are the stock
> HSF's up to the task?

Tualatin processors run nice and cool. The stock HSFs are overkill at
stock speeds and perfectly adequate for overclocking since Tualatins
usually don't respond to Vcore increases. There may be cases where a
Tualatin overclock is *almost* stable and would benefit from improved
cooling, but I have not encountered one.

P2B

> I'm considering fabricating a clip to attach something like this:
>
> http://www.frozencpu.com/images/products/detail_secondary_hires/ex-blc-212_3.jpg
>
> or this:
>
> http://www.scythe-usa.com/product/cpu/009/scktncu1000_detail.html
>
> I also think this might fit without impinging upon the first RAM slot.
> I'm going to measure shortly. Won't do much for overclocking, though.
>
> http://www.pcabusers.com/reviews/zalman/p1.html
>
> Thanks,
> David
>
From: P2B on 21 Feb 2006 21:44


Roland Scheidegger wrote:

> FlamingTaco wrote:
>
>> I had wanted to use a Pentium 1.4, but was talked out of it by the
>> Slot-T rep. The rep said I might or might not get it to work. Well, I
>> want it to work, so, I got a 1.3 Celeron (because it's 3/5 to cost of
>> a 1.4).
>
> A Celeron 1.4 works just as well as a 1.3, if you have the latest 1014
> beta3 bios (otherwise the 1.4 will not boot at all IIRC, not sure about
> the 1.3, older bios have a bug with high multipliers). In any case
> though it's not really a big win, those chips are usually highly
> bandwidth-starved due to the slow fsb (so, a celeron 1.0a overclocked to
> 1.33Ghz will be quite a bit faster than a celeron 1.4 unless your
> workload fits into cache like with synthetic cpu benchmarks), that 8%
> clock speed advantage doesn't really translate into that much of
> real-world performance advantage. Tualatin P3 as opposed to Tualatin
> Celeron doesn't really provide any benefits, other than the (quite big)
> advantage due to higher fsb, which you can easily get with the
> lower-clocked celerons by overclocking (1.0A and 1.1 sould overclock to
> 133Mhz fsb). P3-S has two times the cache, which is nice but may be
> overpriced for the modest performance advantage (for single core systems
> that is). Since you can't get 133Mhz FSB this is all only interesting in
> theory only though anyway...
>
>> I did some more searching, but apparently this clockgen is so far out
>> of date, even google can't reveal anything usefull about it. And it's
>> not in Allied's Catalog.
>
> I think I have seen a datasheet a long time ago but couldn't find it
> neither recently.

FYI datasheets for most (all?) ICS clock generators are still available
here:

http://www.icst.com/datasheets/

Nice of them :-)

P2B

>> But then, on another of P2B's pages, where he tests various cpu's,
>> it's mentioned that a P2B-S board is run at 150Mhz, but no detail is
>> provided on how this was accomplished.
>>
>> So.................................
>>
>> Mr P2B... how did you get the P2B-S to run at 150Mhz FSB? Solder in a
>> different clock gen? Find a magic pin setting? Place a magnet on the
>> FSB?
>
> Well, new revistion P2B-S/LS/L boards (those are all the same pcb) use
> newer clock chips, as well as vrm which go down to 1.3V (which you
> really want for using slot-t + tualatin).
> Board rev. 1.04 pcba D02 and newer are guaranteed to have new vrm (there
> are apparently even 1.03 boards out with new vrm), and for the new clock
> chip you need even a newer rev. (unless you really want to try your
> soldering skills...)
> (shameless plug
> http://homepage.hispeed.ch/rscheidegger/p2b_procupgrade_faq.html)
>
> Roland
From: daytripper on 21 Feb 2006 22:48
On Tue, 21 Feb 2006 21:44:22 -0500, P2B <p2b(a)sympatico.ca> wrote:
>
>FYI datasheets for most (all?) ICS clock generators are still available
>here:
>
>http://www.icst.com/datasheets/
>
>Nice of them :-)
>
>P2B

Considering how much ICS charges to do a clock chip design, posting their
datasheets is the least they could do...though I'd trade that for them getting
it right on the first pass...
From: P2B on 21 Feb 2006 23:11


daytripper wrote:

> On Tue, 21 Feb 2006 21:44:22 -0500, P2B <p2b(a)sympatico.ca> wrote:
>
>>FYI datasheets for most (all?) ICS clock generators are still available
>>here:
>>
>>http://www.icst.com/datasheets/
>>
>>Nice of them :-)
>>
>>P2B
>
>
> Considering how much ICS charges to do a clock chip design, posting their
> datasheets is the least they could do...though I'd trade that for them getting
> it right on the first pass...

Yeah, upgrading older P2B-series boards would be a lot simpler if the
9150-08 133Mhz setting actually worked, instead of producing an ugly
signal the BX interprets as 109Mhz.

Maybe next time you are beating on them about the cost of deficient
designs, you could suggest they atone for past sins by making 9250-08
samples available to those of us who still care...

P2B
From: FlamingTaco on 22 Feb 2006 07:32
Another item while I've got people's attention...

Anyone have an idea of what generation are the best video cards for
these boards? So far I've worked my way up to an nVidea MX series
card (second generation GPU?). It's been a long while since I've
looked at the cards.

I don't want to pay an extra $100 for that last 1/10th of a percent of
performance (that kind of spending is for the car!), but if my current
card would be significantly dusted by a newer generation with the
tualatin chip and limitations of the P2B AGP (2x?), I'm good for an
upgrade. The computer sees some serious gaming periodically (Falcon
4.0 - has two "game engines").

Thanks!

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