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From: linnix on 5 Oct 2009 13:48
On Oct 5, 10:29 am, Chatarras <ignacio.gar...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> On Oct 5, 11:12 am, Tim Wescott <t...(a)seemywebsite.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Mon, 05 Oct 2009 10:06:30 -0700, Chatarras wrote:
> > > On Oct 5, 10:53 am, Tim Wescott <t...(a)seemywebsite.com> wrote:
> > >> On Mon, 05 Oct 2009 09:45:48 -0700, Chatarras wrote:
> > >> > Using either CR30-DN or CR30-15A0. According to the datasheet (Click
> > >> > on "CR Series - Catalogue":
> > >> >http://www.autonics.com/products/products_detail.php?
>
> > >> catecode=01/01/03&db_uid=10)
>
> > >> > the current consumptiion is "Max.15 mA for the digital sensor
> > >> > (CR30-DN and a ----- or blank for the analog sensor. )
>
> > >> > First I don't understand why there is a blank for the analog sensor,
> > >> > does this mean it doesn't matter since it will take whatever it needs
> > >> > from the AC outlet? Then, I suppose for the DC sensor, which needs 15
> > >> > mA max, I could use a supply with multiple DC power outputs, (eight I
> > >> > need) at 24V that would supply these 15 mA for each sensor. What
> > >> > then, can I use? ( I assume I could use eight 24V ac adapters? but
> > >> > then its to many of them). Please if you can guide me, this is my
> > >> > first time supplying anything with power other than in the lab, If
> > >> > you know about <b> a "multiple DC output power supply" I could use or
> > >> > where to get it </b>. Or what is the best solution? I'm pretty sure
> > >> > this is a very simple thing to do, please let me know if this
> > >> > reasoning is correct, or even an article about this would be great.
>
> > >> One big 24V supply, with all the sensors connected in parallel, should
> > >> do just fine. The sensors will take what they need; the promise in the
> > >> data sheet is that they won't take _more_ than 15mA.
>
> > >> I can't download anything from the site so I just see the page you see.
> > >> I suspect that the "AC" sensor is _just_ the sensor without any signal
> > >> conditioning electronics. It's there so that _you_ can build the
> > >> signal conditioning electronics, and as such the power consumption will
> > >> depend on how you excite the thing. If you can't even figure out how
> > >> to plug more than one DC-powered unit into a power supply, you don't
> > >> want to touch this task.
>
> > >> --www.wescottdesign.com
>
> > > the page is
> > >http://www.autonics.com/products/products_detail.php?
>
> > catecode=01/01/03&db_uid=10
>
> > Yes, and I can't get to a data sheet from there, as I said.
>
> > > The question is about a recomendation of a "big 24V power supply" that
> > > will supply the 8 sensors, with 8 connectors. I guess a normal 24V
> > > adapter I could buy anywhere could do the task but I would need to split
> > > the cable.. into 8.
>
> > That's right, if the adapter can supply 8 x 15mA.
>
> > This is really, really basic stuff -- you need to find some basic
> > electronics text that starts with an explanation of how to light a bulb
> > with a battery and goes on from there.
>
> > I sincerely hope that your training isn't in electronics -- if it is you
> > got short changed. Did you never take a class in electronics for non-
> > electronic engineering majors? If not, if you have the time, and if you
> > are close to a school that offers it -- take the class.
>
> > --www.wescottdesign.com
>
> Thanks for the answer, I appreciate it. This is really basic stuff,
> but I've never seen it. I haven't seen a physical 24V power supply
> with multiple outputs, that I can buy. I've seen a power adapter, that
> outputs 24V I'm searching the Internet, maybe Siemens has one. There
> is nothing wrong with my reasoning, simple as it may be, and from the
> beggining I said I was looking for a "multiple output power supply".
> I've bought electronics about twice, from sparkfun electronics and
> maybe one time from Digikey. I can get a 24V power supply, which I
> think most of them are 300 mA, so it will work, but then I need to
> split the cable, and create connectors for all of them. Thought
> something more nice was to be found.
>
> It the difference between buying a single cable or a surge protector
> with 8 outlets. Its not a neccesity, but makes things easier. That's
> all, I don't even know how to call it, "multiple output dc power
> supply with 8 outputs". And well this is my first time supplying 8
> sensors with a single power supply. Maybe I need to be more confident
> in asking questions, like when asking a girl out.

What is the difference between powering 8 sensors or 8 transistors in
a circuit board? Are you going to build 8 power supplies for a 8
transistors amplifier? How about 16, 32 or 64 transistors?
From: Jon Kirwan on 5 Oct 2009 13:52
On Mon, 5 Oct 2009 10:29:34 -0700 (PDT), Chatarras
<ignacio.garita(a)gmail.com> wrote:

>On Oct 5, 11:12�am, Tim Wescott <t...(a)seemywebsite.com> wrote:
>> On Mon, 05 Oct 2009 10:06:30 -0700, Chatarras wrote:
>> > On Oct 5, 10:53�am, Tim Wescott <t...(a)seemywebsite.com> wrote:
>> >> On Mon, 05 Oct 2009 09:45:48 -0700, Chatarras wrote:
>> >> > Using either CR30-DN or CR30-15A0. According to the datasheet (Click
>> >> > on "CR Series - Catalogue":
>> >> >http://www.autonics.com/products/products_detail.php?
>>
>> >> catecode=01/01/03&db_uid=10)
>>
>> >> > the current consumptiion is "Max.15 mA for the digital sensor
>> >> > (CR30-DN and a ----- or blank for the analog sensor. )
>>
>> >> > First I don't understand why there is a blank for the analog sensor,
>> >> > does this mean it doesn't matter since it will take whatever it needs
>> >> > from the AC outlet? Then, I suppose for the DC sensor, which needs 15
>> >> > mA max, I could use a supply with multiple DC power outputs, (eight I
>> >> > need) at 24V that would supply these 15 mA for each sensor. What
>> >> > then, can I use? ( I assume I could use eight 24V ac adapters? but
>> >> > then its to many of them). Please if you can guide me, this is my
>> >> > first time supplying anything with power other than in the lab, If
>> >> > you know about <b> a "multiple DC output power supply" I could use or
>> >> > where to get it </b>. Or what is the best solution? I'm pretty sure
>> >> > this is a very simple thing to do, please let me know if this
>> >> > reasoning is correct, or even an article about this would be great.
>>
>> >> One big 24V supply, with all the sensors connected in parallel, should
>> >> do just fine. �The sensors will take what they need; the promise in the
>> >> data sheet is that they won't take _more_ than 15mA.
>>
>> >> I can't download anything from the site so I just see the page you see.
>> >> I suspect that the "AC" sensor is _just_ the sensor without any signal
>> >> conditioning electronics. �It's there so that _you_ can build the
>> >> signal conditioning electronics, and as such the power consumption will
>> >> depend on how you excite the thing. �If you can't even figure out how
>> >> to plug more than one DC-powered unit into a power supply, you don't
>> >> want to touch this task.
>>
>> >> --www.wescottdesign.com
>>
>> > the page is
>> >http://www.autonics.com/products/products_detail.php?
>>
>> catecode=01/01/03&db_uid=10
>>
>> Yes, and I can't get to a data sheet from there, as I said.
>>
>>
>>
>> > The question is about a recomendation of a "big 24V power supply" that
>> > will supply the 8 sensors, with 8 connectors. I guess a normal 24V
>> > adapter I could buy anywhere could do the task but I would need to split
>> > the cable.. into 8.
>>
>> That's right, if the adapter can supply 8 x 15mA.
>>
>> This is really, really basic stuff -- you need to find some basic
>> electronics text that starts with an explanation of how to light a bulb
>> with a battery and goes on from there.
>>
>> I sincerely hope that your training isn't in electronics -- if it is you
>> got short changed. �Did you never take a class in electronics for non-
>> electronic engineering majors? �If not, if you have the time, and if you
>> are close to a school that offers it -- take the class.
>>
>> --www.wescottdesign.com
>
>Thanks for the answer, I appreciate it. This is really basic stuff,
>but I've never seen it. I haven't seen a physical 24V power supply
>with multiple outputs, that I can buy. I've seen a power adapter, that
>outputs 24V I'm searching the Internet, maybe Siemens has one. There
>is nothing wrong with my reasoning, simple as it may be, and from the
>beggining I said I was looking for a "multiple output power supply".
>I've bought electronics about twice, from sparkfun electronics and
>maybe one time from Digikey. I can get a 24V power supply, which I
>think most of them are 300 mA, so it will work, but then I need to
>split the cable, and create connectors for all of them. Thought
>something more nice was to be found.
>
>It the difference between buying a single cable or a surge protector
>with 8 outlets. Its not a neccesity, but makes things easier. That's
>all, I don't even know how to call it, "multiple output dc power
>supply with 8 outputs". And well this is my first time supplying 8
>sensors with a single power supply. Maybe I need to be more confident
>in asking questions, like when asking a girl out.

Fair enough. But I don't think there isn't much of a market for 24V
power strips. It is the 'output strip' part that's a problem. Most
would get the power supply with the right current compliance and then
fabricate or buy suitable distribution. You might contact the vendor
of those parts, if you are looking for a ready-to-use solution. They
may have one. If they don't, then you may have to take a moment to
either find something you think will be suitable or else just make it.

Jon
From: Chatarras on 5 Oct 2009 14:25
On Oct 5, 11:52 am, Jon Kirwan <j...(a)infinitefactors.org> wrote:
> On Mon, 5 Oct 2009 10:29:34 -0700 (PDT), Chatarras
>
>
>
>
>
> <ignacio.gar...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> >On Oct 5, 11:12 am, Tim Wescott <t...(a)seemywebsite.com> wrote:
> >> On Mon, 05 Oct 2009 10:06:30 -0700, Chatarras wrote:
> >> > On Oct 5, 10:53 am, Tim Wescott <t...(a)seemywebsite.com> wrote:
> >> >> On Mon, 05 Oct 2009 09:45:48 -0700, Chatarras wrote:
> >> >> > Using either CR30-DN or CR30-15A0. According to the datasheet (Click
> >> >> > on "CR Series - Catalogue":
> >> >> >http://www.autonics.com/products/products_detail.php?
>
> >> >> catecode=01/01/03&db_uid=10)
>
> >> >> > the current consumptiion is "Max.15 mA for the digital sensor
> >> >> > (CR30-DN and a ----- or blank for the analog sensor. )
>
> >> >> > First I don't understand why there is a blank for the analog sensor,
> >> >> > does this mean it doesn't matter since it will take whatever it needs
> >> >> > from the AC outlet? Then, I suppose for the DC sensor, which needs 15
> >> >> > mA max, I could use a supply with multiple DC power outputs, (eight I
> >> >> > need) at 24V that would supply these 15 mA for each sensor. What
> >> >> > then, can I use? ( I assume I could use eight 24V ac adapters? but
> >> >> > then its to many of them). Please if you can guide me, this is my
> >> >> > first time supplying anything with power other than in the lab, If
> >> >> > you know about <b> a "multiple DC output power supply" I could use or
> >> >> > where to get it </b>. Or what is the best solution? I'm pretty sure
> >> >> > this is a very simple thing to do, please let me know if this
> >> >> > reasoning is correct, or even an article about this would be great.
>
> >> >> One big 24V supply, with all the sensors connected in parallel, should
> >> >> do just fine.  The sensors will take what they need; the promise in the
> >> >> data sheet is that they won't take _more_ than 15mA.
>
> >> >> I can't download anything from the site so I just see the page you see.
> >> >> I suspect that the "AC" sensor is _just_ the sensor without any signal
> >> >> conditioning electronics.  It's there so that _you_ can build the
> >> >> signal conditioning electronics, and as such the power consumption will
> >> >> depend on how you excite the thing.  If you can't even figure out how
> >> >> to plug more than one DC-powered unit into a power supply, you don't
> >> >> want to touch this task.
>
> >> >> --www.wescottdesign.com
>
> >> > the page is
> >> >http://www.autonics.com/products/products_detail.php?
>
> >> catecode=01/01/03&db_uid=10
>
> >> Yes, and I can't get to a data sheet from there, as I said.
>
> >> > The question is about a recomendation of a "big 24V power supply" that
> >> > will supply the 8 sensors, with 8 connectors. I guess a normal 24V
> >> > adapter I could buy anywhere could do the task but I would need to split
> >> > the cable.. into 8.
>
> >> That's right, if the adapter can supply 8 x 15mA.
>
> >> This is really, really basic stuff -- you need to find some basic
> >> electronics text that starts with an explanation of how to light a bulb
> >> with a battery and goes on from there.
>
> >> I sincerely hope that your training isn't in electronics -- if it is you
> >> got short changed.  Did you never take a class in electronics for non-
> >> electronic engineering majors?  If not, if you have the time, and if you
> >> are close to a school that offers it -- take the class.
>
> >> --www.wescottdesign.com
>
> >Thanks for the answer, I appreciate it. This is really basic stuff,
> >but I've never seen it. I haven't seen a physical 24V power supply
> >with multiple outputs, that I can buy. I've seen a power adapter, that
> >outputs 24V I'm searching the Internet, maybe Siemens has one. There
> >is nothing wrong with my reasoning, simple as it may be, and from the
> >beggining I said I was looking for a "multiple output power supply".
> >I've bought electronics about twice, from sparkfun electronics and
> >maybe one time from Digikey. I can get a 24V power supply, which I
> >think most of them are 300 mA, so it will work, but then I need to
> >split the cable, and create connectors for all of them. Thought
> >something more nice was to be found.
>
> >It the difference between buying a single cable or a  surge protector
> >with 8 outlets. Its not a neccesity, but makes things easier. That's
> >all, I don't even know how to call it, "multiple output dc power
> >supply with 8 outputs".  And well this is my first time supplying 8
> >sensors with a single power supply. Maybe I need to be more confident
> >in asking questions, like when asking a girl out.
>
> Fair enough.  But I don't think there isn't much of a market for 24V
> power strips.  It is the 'output strip' part that's a problem.  Most
> would get the power supply with the right current compliance and then
> fabricate or buy suitable distribution.  You might contact the vendor
> of those parts, if you are looking for a ready-to-use solution.  They
> may have one.  If they don't, then you may have to take a moment to
> either find something you think will be suitable or else just make it.
>
> Jon

Makes sense linnix; in this case there is no circuit board, just the
sensors, some relays, and that's all. Seems like just make it. I
believe many times when you are a beginner, which I undoubtly am, you
confuse yourself more than necessary.
From: Jon Kirwan on 5 Oct 2009 14:55
On Mon, 5 Oct 2009 11:25:26 -0700 (PDT), Chatarras
<ignacio.garita(a)gmail.com> wrote:

>On Oct 5, 11:52�am, Jon Kirwan <j...(a)infinitefactors.org> wrote:
>> On Mon, 5 Oct 2009 10:29:34 -0700 (PDT), Chatarras
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> <ignacio.gar...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>> >On Oct 5, 11:12�am, Tim Wescott <t...(a)seemywebsite.com> wrote:
>> >> On Mon, 05 Oct 2009 10:06:30 -0700, Chatarras wrote:
>> >> > On Oct 5, 10:53�am, Tim Wescott <t...(a)seemywebsite.com> wrote:
>> >> >> On Mon, 05 Oct 2009 09:45:48 -0700, Chatarras wrote:
>> >> >> > Using either CR30-DN or CR30-15A0. According to the datasheet (Click
>> >> >> > on "CR Series - Catalogue":
>> >> >> >http://www.autonics.com/products/products_detail.php?
>>
>> >> >> catecode=01/01/03&db_uid=10)
>>
>> >> >> > the current consumptiion is "Max.15 mA for the digital sensor
>> >> >> > (CR30-DN and a ----- or blank for the analog sensor. )
>>
>> >> >> > First I don't understand why there is a blank for the analog sensor,
>> >> >> > does this mean it doesn't matter since it will take whatever it needs
>> >> >> > from the AC outlet? Then, I suppose for the DC sensor, which needs 15
>> >> >> > mA max, I could use a supply with multiple DC power outputs, (eight I
>> >> >> > need) at 24V that would supply these 15 mA for each sensor. What
>> >> >> > then, can I use? ( I assume I could use eight 24V ac adapters? but
>> >> >> > then its to many of them). Please if you can guide me, this is my
>> >> >> > first time supplying anything with power other than in the lab, If
>> >> >> > you know about <b> a "multiple DC output power supply" I could use or
>> >> >> > where to get it </b>. Or what is the best solution? I'm pretty sure
>> >> >> > this is a very simple thing to do, please let me know if this
>> >> >> > reasoning is correct, or even an article about this would be great.
>>
>> >> >> One big 24V supply, with all the sensors connected in parallel, should
>> >> >> do just fine. �The sensors will take what they need; the promise in the
>> >> >> data sheet is that they won't take _more_ than 15mA.
>>
>> >> >> I can't download anything from the site so I just see the page you see.
>> >> >> I suspect that the "AC" sensor is _just_ the sensor without any signal
>> >> >> conditioning electronics. �It's there so that _you_ can build the
>> >> >> signal conditioning electronics, and as such the power consumption will
>> >> >> depend on how you excite the thing. �If you can't even figure out how
>> >> >> to plug more than one DC-powered unit into a power supply, you don't
>> >> >> want to touch this task.
>>
>> >> >> --www.wescottdesign.com
>>
>> >> > the page is
>> >> >http://www.autonics.com/products/products_detail.php?
>>
>> >> catecode=01/01/03&db_uid=10
>>
>> >> Yes, and I can't get to a data sheet from there, as I said.
>>
>> >> > The question is about a recomendation of a "big 24V power supply" that
>> >> > will supply the 8 sensors, with 8 connectors. I guess a normal 24V
>> >> > adapter I could buy anywhere could do the task but I would need to split
>> >> > the cable.. into 8.
>>
>> >> That's right, if the adapter can supply 8 x 15mA.
>>
>> >> This is really, really basic stuff -- you need to find some basic
>> >> electronics text that starts with an explanation of how to light a bulb
>> >> with a battery and goes on from there.
>>
>> >> I sincerely hope that your training isn't in electronics -- if it is you
>> >> got short changed. �Did you never take a class in electronics for non-
>> >> electronic engineering majors? �If not, if you have the time, and if you
>> >> are close to a school that offers it -- take the class.
>>
>> >> --www.wescottdesign.com
>>
>> >Thanks for the answer, I appreciate it. This is really basic stuff,
>> >but I've never seen it. I haven't seen a physical 24V power supply
>> >with multiple outputs, that I can buy. I've seen a power adapter, that
>> >outputs 24V I'm searching the Internet, maybe Siemens has one. There
>> >is nothing wrong with my reasoning, simple as it may be, and from the
>> >beggining I said I was looking for a "multiple output power supply".
>> >I've bought electronics about twice, from sparkfun electronics and
>> >maybe one time from Digikey. I can get a 24V power supply, which I
>> >think most of them are 300 mA, so it will work, but then I need to
>> >split the cable, and create connectors for all of them. Thought
>> >something more nice was to be found.
>>
>> >It the difference between buying a single cable or a �surge protector
>> >with 8 outlets. Its not a neccesity, but makes things easier. That's
>> >all, I don't even know how to call it, "multiple output dc power
>> >supply with 8 outputs". �And well this is my first time supplying 8
>> >sensors with a single power supply. Maybe I need to be more confident
>> >in asking questions, like when asking a girl out.
>>
>> Fair enough. �But I don't think there isn't much of a market for 24V
>> power strips. �It is the 'output strip' part that's a problem. �Most
>> would get the power supply with the right current compliance and then
>> fabricate or buy suitable distribution. �You might contact the vendor
>> of those parts, if you are looking for a ready-to-use solution. �They
>> may have one. �If they don't, then you may have to take a moment to
>> either find something you think will be suitable or else just make it.
>>
>> Jon
>
>Makes sense linnix; in this case there is no circuit board, just the
>sensors, some relays, and that's all. Seems like just make it. I
>believe many times when you are a beginner, which I undoubtly am, you
>confuse yourself more than necessary.

Um, I'm not linnix. :)

Jon
From: John Fields on 5 Oct 2009 16:11
On Mon, 5 Oct 2009 09:45:48 -0700 (PDT), Chatarras
<ignacio.garita(a)gmail.com> wrote:

>Using either CR30-DN or CR30-15A0. According to the datasheet (Click
>on "CR Series - Catalogue": http://www.autonics.com/products/products_detail.php?catecode=01/01/03&db_uid=10)
>the current consumptiion is "Max.15 mA for the digital sensor (CR30-DN
>and a ----- or blank for the analog sensor. )
>
>First I don't understand why there is a blank for the analog sensor,
>does this mean it doesn't matter since it will take whatever it needs
>from the AC outlet? Then, I suppose for the DC sensor, which needs 15
>mA max, I could use a supply with multiple DC power outputs, (eight I
>need) at 24V that would supply these 15 mA for each sensor. What then,
>can I use? ( I assume I could use eight 24V ac adapters? but then its
>to many of them). Please if you can guide me, this is my first time
>supplying anything with power other than in the lab, If you know about
><b> a "multiple DC output power supply" I could use or where to get it
></b>. Or what is the best solution? I'm pretty sure this is a very
>simple thing to do, please let me know if this reasoning is correct,
>or even an article about this would be great.

---

The CR30-DN sensors require a 12 to 24VDC supply capable of delivering a
maximum of 15mA to the sensor, while the CR30-15A0 need to be powered
from 100 to 240VAC mains, and I suspect what they call "leakage
consumption" is the actual sensor load on the mains.

As for connecting the sensors, for the DN's it's like this:

(View in Courier)


+---------+
| +|--+-------+---------/ /-+
| | | +---+ | +---+ | +---+
| | +-|+ | +-|+ | +-|+ |
| 24VDC | | #1| | #2| | #n|
| | +-|- | +-|- | +-|- |
| | | +---+ | +---+ | +---+
| -|--+-------+--------/ /--+
+---------+

and for the 15-A0's it's like this:


AC MAINS>-----+-------+---------/ /-+
| +---+ | +---+ | +---+
+-|+ | +-|+ | +-|+ |
| #1| | #2| | #n|
+-|- | +-|- | +-|- |
| +---+ | +---+ | +---+
AC MAINS>-----+-------+--------/ /--+



In the case of the DN's all you need is a 24VDC supply (or 12V or
anything in between) with one output, to which all of the sensors are
wired, which can supply (since the sensors are wired in parallel) 8 *
35mA = 280mA, so a 12V 300mA wall-wart would work fine.

for the 15A0's you can either wire them up in parallel, as I've shown,
or put plugs on them and just plug them into the wall.

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