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From: Robert Hedström Robert on 4 Dec 2009 03:53
Hello!

I am upgrading a computer in a factory and on it runs software that uses DDE
to connect to two machines (grinding) which seem to be running windows 3.11
or something similar.

The current computer runs windows 2000 and now I try to replace it with
windows XP but the NETDDE.EXE from 2004 and the NDDENB32.DLL from 2004 does
not work.
They seem to be the result of a "fix" described in:
Microsoft Security Bulletin MS04-031
Vulnerability in NetDDE Could Allow Remote Code Execution (841533)
If I replace these two files with the version from 2003 and 1999 from the
old windows 2000 the DDE connection with the grinding machines work properly.

Now on to my problem since the replacement described above could be
considered a fix.

The File Protection system . . . it replaces the files with the not-working
ones unless I do some things I don't feel happy about.

So my question:
Can anyone give me advice or indicate how I do to get the working files to
stay in the system. I expect the computers to run for another 10 years before
next overhaul and I do not want any Microsoft updates to mess with these
during this time. I know about tweaks such as disabling WFP by editing files
with hex editor and kernel debuggers etc. but that just can't be the way to
go.

Ideal solution:
That Microsoft issues a small update that can be downloaded and run if you
want to replace these two files with the working versions.

Less than ideal solution:
That someone informs me how to get the newer versions to work, why this is a
less prefered solution is because I doubt that it is doable and the time I
spend trying out stuff will be considered too expensive.

/Robert Hedström over in Sweden

From: Jeffrey W. Bowen on 4 Dec 2009 12:11
Hello Robert,

Have you tried to replace these files with the originals in "Safe Mode"?

If not. Boot into Safe Mode. rename the non-working files with an extension
like .bak or something that doesn't make them recognized as system files.

Then paste the working files in their proper places and reboot your
computer.

See if this works. If not, you may wish to consider upgrading all your
computers(especially those with Win3.11) with later or the latest operating
systems on the market.

--
Peace,

Jeffrey W. Bowen
Remove NO SPAM entries from email address to send personal email.

Please post replies of successes or failures so we all can benefit from each
others' experiences.


"Robert Hedstr�m" <Robert Hedstr�m(a)discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message news:95B85EAF-D39B-4D3E-A970-66ACC405AD89(a)microsoft.com...
> Hello!
>
> I am upgrading a computer in a factory and on it runs software that uses
> DDE
> to connect to two machines (grinding) which seem to be running windows
> 3.11
> or something similar.
>
> The current computer runs windows 2000 and now I try to replace it with
> windows XP but the NETDDE.EXE from 2004 and the NDDENB32.DLL from 2004
> does
> not work.
> They seem to be the result of a "fix" described in:
> Microsoft Security Bulletin MS04-031
> Vulnerability in NetDDE Could Allow Remote Code Execution (841533)
> If I replace these two files with the version from 2003 and 1999 from the
> old windows 2000 the DDE connection with the grinding machines work
> properly.
>
> Now on to my problem since the replacement described above could be
> considered a fix.
>
> The File Protection system . . . it replaces the files with the
> not-working
> ones unless I do some things I don't feel happy about.
>
> So my question:
> Can anyone give me advice or indicate how I do to get the working files to
> stay in the system. I expect the computers to run for another 10 years
> before
> next overhaul and I do not want any Microsoft updates to mess with these
> during this time. I know about tweaks such as disabling WFP by editing
> files
> with hex editor and kernel debuggers etc. but that just can't be the way
> to
> go.
>
> Ideal solution:
> That Microsoft issues a small update that can be downloaded and run if you
> want to replace these two files with the working versions.
>
> Less than ideal solution:
> That someone informs me how to get the newer versions to work, why this is
> a
> less prefered solution is because I doubt that it is doable and the time I
> spend trying out stuff will be considered too expensive.
>
> /Robert Hedstr�m over in Sweden
>


From: Robert Hedström on 4 Dec 2009 16:38
Hm, I don't think the safe mode will help, I have managed to replace the files
(The WFP has a one minute cooldown I suspect when it has restored a file
and during that time you can replace it again without it triggering a
file-change
event ;)
No the problem is that I expect them to be "restored" if the WFP is
triggered by
any reason (or the SFC), I can't risk that.

The old machines cannot be upgraded, the DDE servers are run on old PC that
is hard-wired into the grinding machines and you just don't touch such
machines.

Since the plant run 24/7 I can't risk that something causes the "System File
Checker"
to be triggered, that would stop the operation and I can't babysit the plant.

I have actually failed to get the new NETDDE to work between my XP machines
in my office too, I have spent hours on that and since the old version works
directly I just don't think the 2004 year edition is working at all.

Thanks for your responce though.

/Robert

"Jeffrey W. Bowen" wrote:

> Hello Robert,
>
> Have you tried to replace these files with the originals in "Safe Mode"?
>
> If not. Boot into Safe Mode. rename the non-working files with an extension
> like .bak or something that doesn't make them recognized as system files.
>
> Then paste the working files in their proper places and reboot your
> computer.
>
> See if this works. If not, you may wish to consider upgrading all your
> computers(especially those with Win3.11) with later or the latest operating
> systems on the market.
>
> --
> Peace,
>
> Jeffrey W. Bowen
> Remove NO SPAM entries from email address to send personal email.

From: Jeffrey W. Bowen on 4 Dec 2009 21:46
Thank you for getting back to me Robert. I have used this method with
success myself replacing other system files.

If you haven't tried it, you don't know if it will work or not. I don't say
this to be rude, it is just a simple fact.

If you were able to temporarily change these files before without risk, then
it shouldn't hurt to try it again in Safe Mode when the WFP is not started.
When the computer starts up, WFP should recognize the files as the correct
ones and leave them alone.

Now, as far as your XP machines, check your services that support and rely
on NETDDE, and see if there are any that are disabled or not running. It
might be possible that there is a service that needs to be enabled or
started. If it just needs to be started, then change its startup option to
"automatic".

Another option is to establish exactly when the problem began. Did it begin
after installing updates? If so find out which update caused the issue and
uninstall it through the Add/Remove programs applet in Control Panel.

Since you mention a "fix" that may have caused your problem. If these
computers are not connected to the Internet, the patches would be
unnecessary, so it may be possible to uninstall them.

You may even be able to find a solution in Microsoft's Knowledge Base.

I have one more question that might lead to another option. What version of
Windows XP are you using, Sp2 or Sp3? If you are using Sp2, then try
updating to Sp3. This may be that simple solution that has been overlooked .
.. . or avoided. :-)

I'm sorry, this is all I have to offer. I hope someone with more knowledge
than I do can provide a better solution.

Good luck.


--
Peace,

Jeffrey W. Bowen
Remove NO SPAM entries from email address to send personal email.

Please post replies of successes or failures so we all can benefit from each
others' experiences.



"Robert Hedstr�m" <RobertHedstrm(a)discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:D2E155D6-ED09-4EA7-AA76-DD9CE74F602D(a)microsoft.com...
> Hm, I don't think the safe mode will help, I have managed to replace the
> files
> (The WFP has a one minute cooldown I suspect when it has restored a file
> and during that time you can replace it again without it triggering a
> file-change
> event ;)
> No the problem is that I expect them to be "restored" if the WFP is
> triggered by
> any reason (or the SFC), I can't risk that.
>
> The old machines cannot be upgraded, the DDE servers are run on old PC
> that
> is hard-wired into the grinding machines and you just don't touch such
> machines.
>
> Since the plant run 24/7 I can't risk that something causes the "System
> File
> Checker"
> to be triggered, that would stop the operation and I can't babysit the
> plant.
>
> I have actually failed to get the new NETDDE to work between my XP
> machines
> in my office too, I have spent hours on that and since the old version
> works
> directly I just don't think the 2004 year edition is working at all.
>
> Thanks for your responce though.
>
> /Robert
>
> "Jeffrey W. Bowen" wrote:
>
>> Hello Robert,
>>
>> Have you tried to replace these files with the originals in "Safe Mode"?
>>
>> If not. Boot into Safe Mode. rename the non-working files with an
>> extension
>> like .bak or something that doesn't make them recognized as system files.
>>
>> Then paste the working files in their proper places and reboot your
>> computer.
>>
>> See if this works. If not, you may wish to consider upgrading all your
>> computers(especially those with Win3.11) with later or the latest
>> operating
>> systems on the market.
>>
>> --
>> Peace,
>>
>> Jeffrey W. Bowen
>> Remove NO SPAM entries from email address to send personal email.
>


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