Offpage connector symbols
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From: D Yuniskis on 21 Jan 2010 11:40 WangoTango wrote: > In article <hj88ic$vam$2(a)speranza.aioe.org>, not.going.to.be(a)seen.com > says... >> Hi AL, >> >> LittleAlex wrote: >>> On Jan 19, 1:17 pm, D Yuniskis <not.going.to...(a)seen.com> wrote: >>>> As a side-comment to the schematic preferences thread >>>> (hopefully not another lengthy thread :> ), I'm curious >>>> as to what folks use as an offpage connector symbol. >>> I use a CAD program. It has "input", "output", "bidirectional", and >>> "passive" (none of the above, AKA don't care) for off-page and off- >>> sheet. >>> >>> I've never seen a reason to change them from the default. >> Yes, all of the tools I use do this. I am just not happy >> with their symbol choices. And, since I can change them, >> I have. >> >> E.g., I don't like an output on the right side of the page >> drawn as < >> > I guess your CAD package doesn't have a rotate or flip? Sure! Then you get a symbol that looks like > -- but now the pin connection is on the *right* side of the symbol instead of on the *left* (since this example was describing an offpage connector for an output to be located on the right edge of the page!) > Funny what these guys will forget. ;) Funny how these posters fail to think things through! :)
From: D Yuniskis on 21 Jan 2010 13:24 Hi Colin, colin_toogood(a)yahoo.com wrote: > > Something to bear in mind is that many users of your design won't use > the schematic, eg your layout guy isn't going to look at the schematic > for every net he picks up, nor is your firmware guy going to > constantly check when he defines and uses an FPGA pin. Yes. Though the schematic is the driving document in both cases. I.e., it wins all arguments ("Oh, I thought RESET was on pin 23..." "No, it's not.") The biggest consumer of the document is the end user. He needs to be able to quickly understand what the design is trying to do and how it is trying to do it. To that end, you have to balance "information" with "clutter". > We name almost every net on the board :- > > {source}_{destination}_{major function name}_{minor function name} Ouch! Your schematics must be very "dark" :> I only name things that *need* names. E.g., if I have an RC snubber across a switching diode, I don't name the signal *between* the R and the C. Chances are, I will never have to refer to it in my written commentary. And, if I actually *do* need to refer to it (e.g., to tell a technician to probe the signal there), I would simply say "the junction of Rx and Cy". > With not much thought you can define three letter acronyms for every > source and destination and probably major function name. Suddenly you > have a schematic where you don't have to drill up and down through > hierarchy and fewer mistakes are made. Yes, but everything you put on a document is one more thing that has to be maintained. It's like putting comments on each line of code in a program. Or, using "FirstArrayIndex" and "SecondArrayIndex" (as in array[FirstArrayIndex][SecondArrayIndex]) instead of array[i][j]). I.e., it's just more than you need. <shrug> YMMV. The whole point of this was to elicit *preferences* as none of these things are cast in stone...
From: WangoTango on 21 Jan 2010 13:26 In article <hj9vf5$idp$1(a)speranza.aioe.org>, not.going.to.be(a)seen.com says... > WangoTango wrote: > > In article <hj88ic$vam$2(a)speranza.aioe.org>, not.going.to.be(a)seen.com > > says... > >> Hi AL, > >> > >> LittleAlex wrote: > >>> On Jan 19, 1:17 pm, D Yuniskis <not.going.to...(a)seen.com> wrote: > >>>> As a side-comment to the schematic preferences thread > >>>> (hopefully not another lengthy thread :> ), I'm curious > >>>> as to what folks use as an offpage connector symbol. > >>> I use a CAD program. It has "input", "output", "bidirectional", and > >>> "passive" (none of the above, AKA don't care) for off-page and off- > >>> sheet. > >>> > >>> I've never seen a reason to change them from the default. > >> Yes, all of the tools I use do this. I am just not happy > >> with their symbol choices. And, since I can change them, > >> I have. > >> > >> E.g., I don't like an output on the right side of the page > >> drawn as < > >> > > I guess your CAD package doesn't have a rotate or flip? > > Sure! Then you get a symbol that looks like > -- but now > the pin connection is on the *right* side of the symbol > instead of on the *left* (since this example was describing > an offpage connector for an output to be located on the > right edge of the page!) > > > Funny what these guys will forget. ;) > > Funny how these posters fail to think things through! :) > OK, well then who makes a symbol that isn't grouped into a cohesive unit, or what CAD package can't handle such things? All in/out/bi symbols I have EVER seen are not treated as individual parts/lines/primitives. They are a equivalent to a symbol or part that is manipulated as a unit. So ---> becomes <--- when flipped or rotated. ---< becomes >--- rotating around what would be the electrical connection point. I guess I assumed you spent more than $1.50 on the software..... :)
From: D Yuniskis on 21 Jan 2010 14:11 WangoTango wrote: > In article <hj9vf5$idp$1(a)speranza.aioe.org>, not.going.to.be(a)seen.com > says... >> WangoTango wrote: >>> In article <hj88ic$vam$2(a)speranza.aioe.org>, not.going.to.be(a)seen.com >>> says... >>>> Hi AL, >>>> >>>> LittleAlex wrote: >>>>> On Jan 19, 1:17 pm, D Yuniskis <not.going.to...(a)seen.com> wrote: >>>>>> As a side-comment to the schematic preferences thread >>>>>> (hopefully not another lengthy thread :> ), I'm curious >>>>>> as to what folks use as an offpage connector symbol. >>>>> I use a CAD program. It has "input", "output", "bidirectional", and >>>>> "passive" (none of the above, AKA don't care) for off-page and off- >>>>> sheet. >>>>> >>>>> I've never seen a reason to change them from the default. >>>> Yes, all of the tools I use do this. I am just not happy >>>> with their symbol choices. And, since I can change them, >>>> I have. >>>> >>>> E.g., I don't like an output on the right side of the page >>>> drawn as < >>>> >>> I guess your CAD package doesn't have a rotate or flip? >> Sure! Then you get a symbol that looks like > -- but now >> the pin connection is on the *right* side of the symbol >> instead of on the *left* (since this example was describing >> an offpage connector for an output to be located on the >> right edge of the page!) >> >>> Funny what these guys will forget. ;) >> Funny how these posters fail to think things through! :) >> > OK, well then who makes a symbol that isn't grouped into a cohesive > unit, or what CAD package can't handle such things? Sure. "Create a symbol". I think if you read upthread, that's where this discussion started. > All in/out/bi symbols I have EVER seen are not treated as individual > parts/lines/primitives. They are a equivalent to a symbol or part that > is manipulated as a unit. > So ---> becomes <--- when flipped or rotated. Sure! But the PoE moves, also! Or, graphically: --->X becomes X<--- where X is the PoE (i.e., where the signal connects). If, as I had stipulated in the discussion, you are creating an output for the right side of the page, then you really want: --->X If you are starting with; ---<X I think you will find "you can't get there from here". > ---< becomes >--- rotating around what would be the electrical > connection point. Only if that connection point is located in the *center* of the symbol. (Many eCAD packages put the PoE's on the *edge* of the symbol boundary). > I guess I assumed you spent more than $1.50 on the software..... :) This was OrCAD 9. I'll check Altium/Protel this afternoon if I get a chance. I know STRIDES would do it correctly (because I could always move the PoE manually if need be). I *really* don't want to fire up the Mentor Graphics workstation to see how *that* does it...
From: D Yuniskis on 21 Jan 2010 14:20
D Yuniskis wrote: > Or, graphically: > > --->X becomes X<--- > > where X is the PoE (i.e., where the signal connects). > If, as I had stipulated in the discussion, you are > creating an output for the right side of the page, > then you really want: > > --->X > > If you are starting with; > > ---<X > > I think you will find "you can't get there from here". Argh! I mispoke (confusing placement of signal name with signal PoE). You have: X--< SIGNALNAME (standard OrCAD symbol "OFFPAGELEFT-L") You want: X--> SIGNALNAME Tell me some combination of flips and rotates (remember, you're alleging that "silly me" doesn't need to bother editing the symbol itself -- creating a new one) will transform the first into the second? Unhappy with "OFFPAGELEFT"? You can always try OFFPAGERIGHT: SIGNALNAME >--X But, I think you will find you can't rotate *that* either to get to X--> SIGNALNAME (even if you are willing to manually *move* "SIGNALNAME" each time you place a connector). Perhaps your eCAD program works in N-dimensional space?? |