Power supply
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From: LeeG on 11 Jan 2010 12:57 I have been advised to get a better PSU because the ampage on the 12V is too low (20A) for my system. This came about due to corruption of my graphics when running 3D games. Where can I verify this? Phenom II x2 550 black MSI 770-c45 Bios v1.4 PNY 1GB gt220 PCIe graphics card (no 12v power socket) 2 x 2gb crucial 10600 memory 1 x usb printer 1 x usb All in one 1 x usb joystick Microsoft deskset 700 usb 1 x SATA combo optical drive 1 x SATA WD 320gb HDD blue 1 x CPU fan 2 x system fans
From: Rich Barry on 11 Jan 2010 13:38 Lee, you can check this helpful forum post. http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/261074-31-wattage-computer-need "LeeG" <lee.gorton(removethis)@hotmail.co.uk> wrote in message news:E646595A-59D9-40C4-A1FB-A6DA6739F475(a)microsoft.com... >I have been advised to get a better PSU because the ampage on the 12V is >too > low (20A) for my system. This came about due to corruption of my graphics > when running 3D games. > > Where can I verify this? > > Phenom II x2 550 black > MSI 770-c45 Bios v1.4 > PNY 1GB gt220 PCIe graphics card (no 12v power socket) > 2 x 2gb crucial 10600 memory > 1 x usb printer > 1 x usb All in one > 1 x usb joystick > Microsoft deskset 700 usb > 1 x SATA combo optical drive > 1 x SATA WD 320gb HDD blue > 1 x CPU fan > 2 x system fans > >
From: Paul on 11 Jan 2010 14:00 LeeG wrote: > I have been advised to get a better PSU because the ampage on the 12V is too > low (20A) for my system. This came about due to corruption of my graphics > when running 3D games. > > Where can I verify this? > > Phenom II x2 550 black > MSI 770-c45 Bios v1.4 > PNY 1GB gt220 PCIe graphics card (no 12v power socket) > 2 x 2gb crucial 10600 memory > 1 x usb printer > 1 x usb All in one > 1 x usb joystick > Microsoft deskset 700 usb > 1 x SATA combo optical drive > 1 x SATA WD 320gb HDD blue > 1 x CPU fan > 2 x system fans > > Phenom II x2 550 black 80W, 80W/12V * (1/0.90) = 7.4A from 12V2 (Assumes 90% Vcore conversion efficiency.) LOL :-) GT220 = 22.9W max! 22.9W/12V = 1.9A from 12V1 Overload. Um, sure... There are ten year old video cards that draw more power. This isn't even going to stress the pins in the video card slot. http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/gf-210-gt220_5.html#sect0 HDD = 12V @ 0.6A and 5V @ 1A. 12V would be from 12V1 rail ODD = 12V @ 1.5A and 5V @ 1.5A. 12V would be from 12V1 rail Estimate of all fans - 12V @ 0.5A (check what is printed on the hub of each fan) The fans run from 12V1. Now, assuming we used an older supply, where all the current came from one rail, 7.4+1.9+0.6+1.5+0.5 = 11.9 amps total from 12V rail If the power supply was split into 12V1 and 12V2, and had current limiters inserted in each rail, I suppose you could come up with a way to make the box fall over, but somehow I doubt this is the problem. Post a picture of the label of the power supply (find one on the Internet and post a link) if you want more info. ******* The corruption of the graphics, could be a bad graphics card. My advice would normally be, to set up an alternative testing environment. Either compare your existing Windows install with its graphics problems, to a fresh install on a second hard drive (to eliminate an obscure problem with the files currently on the machine). Or, use a separate OS and test there. For some kinds of problems, I use Linux, but graphics is not one of its stronger suits. It is pretty hard to make a stressful test in Linux, where you can be certain the GPU is getting a workout. If from one OS boot, you get corrupted graphics, and in the other environment, the corruption is gone, you'd suspect the original OS as having a problem of some sort (driver or whatever). If both environments (say comparing Windows to Linux) had corruption problems, you'd know immediately to return the video card to the retailer. I had one computer here, where even sitting idle in a Linux desktop, I could see a graphics problem, so sometimes you get lucky. But if the video card problem is only present under stress, Linux has a hard time duplicating the stress of a Windows setup. At 22.9W, it is hard to blame the power supply. If you want another test, try running Prime95 and getting that 80W processor to run flat out. Your processor can draw more power than the video card, so if it was a power supply problem, you might see a problem while the CPU was loaded up. See if the box crashes with that test running. http://www.mersenne.org/freesoft (p95v259.zip) If you keep getting errors in Prime95, you have issues other than the video card. Paul
From: LeeG on 11 Jan 2010 15:59 Hi Paul. A brief resume of my problem. Built new system. Graphics card (inno3d GT220 1GB)went BSOD on me. RMA'd replacement which BSOD'd. Rma'd new card(as stated). No BSOD as yet but some graphics corruption after a short time of running 3D games. PSU is WIN POWER 450W. Been told I need 32A on 12V for this system on a single rail. When problem first happened I ran Prime95 and memtest to see if the new build was the cause of the BSOD. All tests where okay. I can run my 7300GT with no problems. I do not want to damage this new card and want to hopefully find the problem before this happens. "Paul" wrote: > LeeG wrote: > > I have been advised to get a better PSU because the ampage on the 12V is too > > low (20A) for my system. This came about due to corruption of my graphics > > when running 3D games. > > > > Where can I verify this? > > > > Phenom II x2 550 black > > MSI 770-c45 Bios v1.4 > > PNY 1GB gt220 PCIe graphics card (no 12v power socket) > > 2 x 2gb crucial 10600 memory > > 1 x usb printer > > 1 x usb All in one > > 1 x usb joystick > > Microsoft deskset 700 usb > > 1 x SATA combo optical drive > > 1 x SATA WD 320gb HDD blue > > 1 x CPU fan > > 2 x system fans > > > > > > Phenom II x2 550 black 80W, 80W/12V * (1/0.90) = 7.4A from 12V2 > (Assumes 90% Vcore conversion efficiency.) > > LOL :-) GT220 = 22.9W max! 22.9W/12V = 1.9A from 12V1 > Overload. Um, sure... There are ten year old video cards that draw more power. > This isn't even going to stress the pins in the video card slot. > > http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/gf-210-gt220_5.html#sect0 > > HDD = 12V @ 0.6A and 5V @ 1A. 12V would be from 12V1 rail > ODD = 12V @ 1.5A and 5V @ 1.5A. 12V would be from 12V1 rail > > Estimate of all fans - 12V @ 0.5A (check what is printed on the hub of each fan) > The fans run from 12V1. > > Now, assuming we used an older supply, where all the current came from one > rail, 7.4+1.9+0.6+1.5+0.5 = 11.9 amps total from 12V rail > > If the power supply was split into 12V1 and 12V2, and had current > limiters inserted in each rail, I suppose you could come up with > a way to make the box fall over, but somehow I doubt this is the problem. > Post a picture of the label of the power supply (find one on the Internet and > post a link) if you want more info. > > ******* > > The corruption of the graphics, could be a bad graphics card. > > My advice would normally be, to set up an alternative testing environment. > Either compare your existing Windows install with its graphics problems, > to a fresh install on a second hard drive (to eliminate an obscure problem > with the files currently on the machine). Or, use a separate OS and > test there. For some kinds of problems, I use Linux, but graphics is > not one of its stronger suits. It is pretty hard to make a stressful > test in Linux, where you can be certain the GPU is getting a workout. > > If from one OS boot, you get corrupted graphics, and in the other > environment, the corruption is gone, you'd suspect the original OS > as having a problem of some sort (driver or whatever). If both environments > (say comparing Windows to Linux) had corruption problems, you'd know immediately > to return the video card to the retailer. I had one computer here, where > even sitting idle in a Linux desktop, I could see a graphics problem, > so sometimes you get lucky. But if the video card problem is only > present under stress, Linux has a hard time duplicating the stress of > a Windows setup. > > At 22.9W, it is hard to blame the power supply. > > If you want another test, try running Prime95 and getting that 80W processor > to run flat out. Your processor can draw more power than the video card, > so if it was a power supply problem, you might see a problem while the > CPU was loaded up. See if the box crashes with that test running. > > http://www.mersenne.org/freesoft (p95v259.zip) > > If you keep getting errors in Prime95, you have issues other than the > video card. > > Paul > . >
From: Paul on 11 Jan 2010 17:27
LeeG wrote: > Hi Paul. > > A brief resume of my problem. Built new system. Graphics card (inno3d > GT220 1GB)went BSOD on me. RMA'd replacement which BSOD'd. Rma'd new > card(as stated). No BSOD as yet but some graphics corruption after a short > time of running 3D games. PSU is WIN POWER 450W. Been told I need 32A on > 12V for this system on a single rail. > > When problem first happened I ran Prime95 and memtest to see if the new > build was the cause of the BSOD. All tests where okay. I can run my 7300GT > with no problems. I do not want to damage this new card and want to > hopefully find the problem before this happens. I checked the reviews on Newegg, for various GT220 cards, and I don't see a lot of problems mentioned there. Is the fan on the graphics card running OK ? What about the overclocking situation. Is the card clocked higher than the competition ? Does the card have a temperature sensor ? (I can't tell here, because the other tabs in GPU-z aren't shown.) http://www.xtremecomputing.co.uk/images/review/Inno3D_GT220/inno3d_gt220_12.jpg You can get GPU-z here. It is under 500KB. http://www.techpowerup.com/downloads/1709/TechPowerUp_GPU-Z_v0.3.8.html I don't know if SpeedFan has a working GPU temperature readout or not. My video card is too old for such things :-( http://www.almico.com/speedfan440.exe There is some mention here of support for Nvidia video cards. http://www.almico.com/sfhistory.php Since you've tried two cards, I assume the video card cooler was attached well on at least one of them. Maybe if you can manage to read out the temperature of the GPU on the video card, you'll have a better idea whether there is a temperature issue. Paul > > "Paul" wrote: > >> LeeG wrote: >>> I have been advised to get a better PSU because the ampage on the 12V is too >>> low (20A) for my system. This came about due to corruption of my graphics >>> when running 3D games. >>> >>> Where can I verify this? >>> >>> Phenom II x2 550 black >>> MSI 770-c45 Bios v1.4 >>> PNY 1GB gt220 PCIe graphics card (no 12v power socket) >>> 2 x 2gb crucial 10600 memory >>> 1 x usb printer >>> 1 x usb All in one >>> 1 x usb joystick >>> Microsoft deskset 700 usb >>> 1 x SATA combo optical drive >>> 1 x SATA WD 320gb HDD blue >>> 1 x CPU fan >>> 2 x system fans >>> >>> >> Phenom II x2 550 black 80W, 80W/12V * (1/0.90) = 7.4A from 12V2 >> (Assumes 90% Vcore conversion efficiency.) >> >> LOL :-) GT220 = 22.9W max! 22.9W/12V = 1.9A from 12V1 >> Overload. Um, sure... There are ten year old video cards that draw more power. >> This isn't even going to stress the pins in the video card slot. >> >> http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/gf-210-gt220_5.html#sect0 >> >> HDD = 12V @ 0.6A and 5V @ 1A. 12V would be from 12V1 rail >> ODD = 12V @ 1.5A and 5V @ 1.5A. 12V would be from 12V1 rail >> >> Estimate of all fans - 12V @ 0.5A (check what is printed on the hub of each fan) >> The fans run from 12V1. >> >> Now, assuming we used an older supply, where all the current came from one >> rail, 7.4+1.9+0.6+1.5+0.5 = 11.9 amps total from 12V rail >> >> If the power supply was split into 12V1 and 12V2, and had current >> limiters inserted in each rail, I suppose you could come up with >> a way to make the box fall over, but somehow I doubt this is the problem. >> Post a picture of the label of the power supply (find one on the Internet and >> post a link) if you want more info. >> >> ******* >> >> The corruption of the graphics, could be a bad graphics card. >> >> My advice would normally be, to set up an alternative testing environment. >> Either compare your existing Windows install with its graphics problems, >> to a fresh install on a second hard drive (to eliminate an obscure problem >> with the files currently on the machine). Or, use a separate OS and >> test there. For some kinds of problems, I use Linux, but graphics is >> not one of its stronger suits. It is pretty hard to make a stressful >> test in Linux, where you can be certain the GPU is getting a workout. >> >> If from one OS boot, you get corrupted graphics, and in the other >> environment, the corruption is gone, you'd suspect the original OS >> as having a problem of some sort (driver or whatever). If both environments >> (say comparing Windows to Linux) had corruption problems, you'd know immediately >> to return the video card to the retailer. I had one computer here, where >> even sitting idle in a Linux desktop, I could see a graphics problem, >> so sometimes you get lucky. But if the video card problem is only >> present under stress, Linux has a hard time duplicating the stress of >> a Windows setup. >> >> At 22.9W, it is hard to blame the power supply. >> >> If you want another test, try running Prime95 and getting that 80W processor >> to run flat out. Your processor can draw more power than the video card, >> so if it was a power supply problem, you might see a problem while the >> CPU was loaded up. See if the box crashes with that test running. >> >> http://www.mersenne.org/freesoft (p95v259.zip) >> >> If you keep getting errors in Prime95, you have issues other than the >> video card. >> >> Paul >> . >> |