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From: gavino on 31 Dec 2009 06:12
On Dec 28, 11:52 am, ccc31807 <carte...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> On Dec 28, 10:47 am, game_designer <alex.repenn...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Graham writes nice essays which have helped Lisp a lot. I am thankful
> > for that. The reference flavor aspect of ANSI Common Lisp is quite OK
> > but for people writing modern applications especially when including
> > OOP this is a book that needs to be avoided. It is not clear if Graham
> > only hates object oriented programming - there is quite some evidence
> > for that elsewhere - or actually does not understand it. In the end it
> > does not matter. Common Lisp has a very powerful object system (CLOS).
> > If you are planing to write a modern application making use of OO and
> > are not just planning to walk down memory lane then look elsewhere.
>
> Thank you for your helpful remarks. Two points:
>
> (1) There's no such thing as a perfect student, and there's no such
> thing as a perfect text -- sometimes I think that the match between
> the student and the text is simply a matter of sheer, dumb luck.
> Graham's book is strong in many ways, for example I like the way he
> serves up 'real' programs from the very beginning, and it's probably
> essential for the development of a mature Lisper, but it's certainly
> not good for the beginner. For my money, Wilensky and Winston & Horn
> are probably the best in that regard.
>
> (2) I received Norvig's 'Paradigms' for Christmas, and have read
> through the first three chapters. I've now read about 100 pages each
> of Graham and Norvig, comparing them. Each adds much, but I suspect
> that Norvig will have a lot more staying power than Graham.
>
> CC.

I was told incidentally that lamkins successful lisp and gentro intro
by touretsky are great for the beginner. I own the Winston/horn book
and found it not much better than graham in that he starts to go into
global vs local assignments before simply stating what set and setf
etc are and how they differ so you are trying to absorb bot at once.
I wish the book would simply define it terms. Then what they main
concept groupss are, and then code some examples.
tryign to absorb 2 or even 3 to 4 sets of things at same time with
them being separated out can lead to student [eg me I can't speak for
all] getting prehaps a wrong idea about 1 of the concepts. Then the
following chapter builds on the before so confusion gets worse. Math
book are suprisingly good at giving the concepts layed out before
going into execution.
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