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From: Alistair on 31 Oct 2007 10:30
On 31 Oct, 13:43, "Pete Dashwood" <dashw...(a)removethis.enternet.co.nz>
wrote:
> <docdw...(a)panix.com> wrote in messagenews:fg8hhd$mc$1(a)reader1.panix.com...
> > In article <5opm2vFnnl6...(a)mid.individual.net>,
> > Pete Dashwood <dashw...(a)removethis.enternet.co.nz> wrote:
>
> >><docdw...(a)panix.com> wrote in message
> >>news:fg6u2d$qvk$1(a)reader1.panix.com...
>
> > [snip]
>
> >>> All in all, it is usually a good thing to remember what Machiavelli had
> >>> to
> >>> say about the introduction of new systems
> >>> <http://www.gutenberg.org/files/1232/1232.txt>
>
> >>> --begin quoted text:
>
> >>> And it ought to be remembered that there is nothing more difficult to
> >>> take
> >>> in hand, more perilous to conduct, or more uncertain in its success,
> >>> then
> >>> to take the lead in the introduction of a new order of things.
>
> >>Only if you're a sissy. REAL Men embrace change and have no problem with
> >>being responsible for it. :-)
>
> > Just like military officers have no problems leading their men over the
> > tops of the trenches... and the Gallipoli-like results which may ensue.
>
> Death or Glory! THAT's the stuff for REAL men...
>
> (I recently finished reading the best book on Gallipoli I have ever come
> across. Obviously, this particular battle is woven into our culture and the
> "Spirit of Anzac" is something we grow up with. Despite the courage and
> tenacity shown by both sides, there is no doubt that it was a real tragedy
> for all concerned. The book I just finished is called "Letters from the
> coffin trenches" by Ken Catran. It is the best anti-war novel I have ever
> read. Understated, doesn't preach, but has been extremely well researched,
> and gives insight into the mores and attitudes of the times, both at home
> and at war.)
>

Many years ago, I read a book (which I can highly recommend) called
"The reason why" published by Penguin and authored by Cecil Woodham-
Smith. It covered the Sebastopol campaign and the battle of Balaclava.
If you have ever seen the film of the charge of the Light Brigade with
Vanessa Redgrave then it accurately reflects the contents of the book.
I had thought that the film was a joke until I read the book.


From: Judson McClendon on 31 Oct 2007 11:02
"Pete Dashwood" <dashwood(a)removethis.enternet.co.nz> wrote:
>
> My experience bears out what you say about starting with a smaller system and expanding it incrementally. Obviously, encapsulated
> building blocks facilitate this.

I don't agree that you should always start small and scale up. Build a system
modularly, absolutely. But not all designs scale up well. For some applications,
you need to "thing big" from the beginning, or it may not scale up properly. Or,
sometimes you miss opportunities if you "think small" but eventually will
"need big". Designing toward the actual target seems more appropriate to me.
Parhaps I'm just lucky, but I've never designed a system that didn't work as
well or better than the user's expectations.
--
Judson McClendon judmc(a)sunvaley0.com (remove zero)
Sun Valley Systems http://sunvaley.com
"For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that
whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."


From: HeyBub on 31 Oct 2007 15:06
Alistair wrote:
> On 31 Oct, 04:52, Robert <n...(a)e.mail> wrote:
>
>>> If you live in the USA then sorry, it it your tax dollars at work
>>> :-(
>>
>> "Pessimist drowns in half empty bathtub." :)
>>
>
> And an engineer would point out that the bathtub is twice the size
> that it needs to be.

No, the dude drowned, didn't he?


From: Anonymous on 31 Oct 2007 18:54
In article <5orf4qFnp62tU1(a)mid.individual.net>,
Pete Dashwood <dashwood(a)removethis.enternet.co.nz> wrote:
>
>
><docdwarf(a)panix.com> wrote in message news:fg8hhd$mc$1(a)reader1.panix.com...
>> In article <5opm2vFnnl68U1(a)mid.individual.net>,
>> Pete Dashwood <dashwood(a)removethis.enternet.co.nz> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>><docdwarf(a)panix.com> wrote in message
>>>news:fg6u2d$qvk$1(a)reader1.panix.com...
>>
>> [snip]
>>
>>>> All in all, it is usually a good thing to remember what Machiavelli had
>>>> to
>>>> say about the introduction of new systems
>>>> <http://www.gutenberg.org/files/1232/1232.txt>
>>>>
>>>> --begin quoted text:
>>>>
>>>> And it ought to be remembered that there is nothing more difficult to
>>>> take
>>>> in hand, more perilous to conduct, or more uncertain in its success,
>>>> then
>>>> to take the lead in the introduction of a new order of things.
>>>
>>>Only if you're a sissy. REAL Men embrace change and have no problem with
>>>being responsible for it. :-)
>>
>> Just like military officers have no problems leading their men over the
>> tops of the trenches... and the Gallipoli-like results which may ensue.
>
>Death or Glory! THAT's the stuff for REAL men...

Such 'REAL men' seem to ignore some simple, basic teachings that have held
for a few millennia, it seems... Qoh.IX:4 - 5: 'For to him that is joined
to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead
lion. For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any
thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is
forgotten.'

Or as a more modern author put it, 'Is there glory in a little heap of
whitened bones?'

[snip]

>The important point here is that in industry, when implementing change,
>people don't normally die.

That does not necessitate the conclusion, Mr Dashwood, that no lessons
from the military might be learnt.

[snip]

>> That might be the case, as well... but for me, I will leave lobbying to
>> the lobbyists and selling to the salesfolk; they have their jobs and I
>> have mine.
>>
>
>That's fine if you have the people... :-)

I'd disagree... it seems readily accepted that not everyone can be a
decent programmer; in like manner not everyone can be a decent lobbyist or
salesperson. If someone of the right skills/temperment is not there to do
a given job then the job tends to get done badly or not at all.

One can hook an Arabian stallion up to a wagon to haul bricks... but if
one has a lot of hauling to do one might consider getting a more
appropriate Clydesdale.

[snip]

>> I don't know many folks who spent time in modern Board
>> Rooms who have become Pope, as did Rodrigo Borgia.
>
>I heard that most Cardinals in the Catholic Church do Business Studies and
>are required to put some time in managing aspects of the Church's financial
>empire,(career progression?). Some are even Ivy League graduates (could be
>Honorary Degrees...)

I have heard many things... some of them I've even seen myself. I don't
know of a Pope lately who comes from the ranks of what you describe as
'most Cardinals'.

>
>The modern Church, like modern Business, is a very long way from how things
>were done in the Middle Ages.

As the Germans say, Mr Dashwood, 'plus ca change, plus c'est la meme
chose'; those who learn what Santayana said about the mistakes of the past
are doomed to repeat it.

DD

From: Charles Hottel on 31 Oct 2007 18:55

"Robert" <no(a)e.mail> wrote in message
news:7i1gi39darb3r0175mpg7ttie21572ktn1(a)4ax.com...
> On Tue, 30 Oct 2007 19:44:40 -0400, "Charles Hottel"
> <chottel(a)earthlink.net> wrote:
>

<snip>

> SAP is written in C and ABAP, not Java. If it's only 20-30% slower, it's
> better than most
> new systems, which are typically 2-3 TIMES slower. Tuning often produces
> dramatic
> improvements in speed.
>
Yes I know. I did not make it clear (perhaps because I posted about this
before). They will keep whatever they have in SAP and now they will use
Java to develop the rest. Othe rsubsytems will be totally conveted to Java.


<snip>


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