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From: Peter Flass on 23 Mar 2010 06:55
Jonathan de Boyne Pollard wrote:
>>
>>>>
>>>> I liked the 6809 instruction set, and *really* like the 68000
>>>> instruction set.
>>>>
>>> I'll second that (since no-one else in the thread has).
>>>
>> No-one?
>>
> I was surprised, too. (-:

I wasn't. I really like it too, but what's the point? Coldfire is a
stripped-down ISA. IIRC it doesn't include memory-management. Other
than that, where can I buy a 680x0 system today? I was sorry to see the
6800, and especially the 6809, lose out to the 8086, but Intel is like
Walmart - it's cr@p, but it's everywhere.
From: jmfbahciv on 23 Mar 2010 08:06
1022 guy wrote:
> Please stop crossposting to alt.sys.pdp10

Sigh! for you people who are snobs. The best
way for people, who have never had the pleasure
to use a PDP-10, to learn about the PDP-10 is
to welcome them into the newsgroup. A few
will get that itch of curiosity and delve
into the architecture. And then, perhaps,
they'll learn that there is another way
to code.

/BAH
From: George Neuner on 23 Mar 2010 14:26
On Tue, 23 Mar 2010 06:55:38 -0400, Peter Flass
<Peter_Flass(a)Yahoo.com> wrote:

>where can I buy a 680x0 system today?

There are industrial rack systems - VMEbus, BCN, BLN, etc. - that have
68K family processor boards available. Apart from utterly ridiculous
cost, the only real impediment is their snail-like performance ... the
fastest 68060 chips are 75MHz and I've never seen faster than 60MHz
from any CPU board vendor.

George
From: Bernd Felsche on 23 Mar 2010 19:57
George Neuner <gneuner2(a)comcast.net> wrote:
>On Tue, 23 Mar 2010 06:55:38 -0400, Peter Flass
><Peter_Flass(a)Yahoo.com> wrote:

>>where can I buy a 680x0 system today?

>There are industrial rack systems - VMEbus, BCN, BLN, etc. - that have
>68K family processor boards available. Apart from utterly ridiculous
>cost, the only real impediment is their snail-like performance ... the
>fastest 68060 chips are 75MHz and I've never seen faster than 60MHz
>from any CPU board vendor.

Industrial computers will always be at what domestic users consider
to be "utterly ridiculous cost". They are nevertheless built for a
far more harsh operating environment and with reliability as the
priority.

I wouldn't call a 68060 at 50 MHz "snail-like", having an Amiga
powered by one. It is more than adequate in the right system for an
application.

The real problem is that the amount of data with which people deal
with on a day to day basis is about 1000 times greater than what it
was 20 years ago. It now takes a megabyte to say what used to take a
kilobyte.

And the only time when people throw data away is when they upgrade
computers. New desktop computer systems come with half a terabyte of
storage capacity. And maybe a floppy drive for backups. :-)
--
/"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia
\ / ASCII ribbon campaign | If builders built buildings the way programmers
X against HTML mail | wrote programs, then the first woodpecker that
/ \ and postings | came along would destroy civilization.
From: George Neuner on 23 Mar 2010 22:25
On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 07:57:07 +0800, Bernd Felsche
<berfel(a)innovative.iinet.net.au> wrote:

>George Neuner <gneuner2(a)comcast.net> wrote:
>>On Tue, 23 Mar 2010 06:55:38 -0400, Peter Flass
>><Peter_Flass(a)Yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>>where can I buy a 680x0 system today?
>
>>There are industrial rack systems - VMEbus, BCN, BLN, etc. - that have
>>68K family processor boards available. Apart from utterly ridiculous
>>cost, the only real impediment is their snail-like performance ... the
>>fastest 68060 chips are 75MHz and I've never seen faster than 60MHz
>>from any CPU board vendor.
>
>Industrial computers will always be at what domestic users consider
>to be "utterly ridiculous cost". They are nevertheless built for a
>far more harsh operating environment and with reliability as the
>priority.

Agreed. But my impression was Peter was asking for personal use ...
else he'd already know such things were available.


>I wouldn't call a 68060 at 50 MHz "snail-like", having an Amiga
>powered by one. It is more than adequate in the right system for an
>application.

I had 000 and 020 Macs and I worked with 040 and 060 in embedded
VMEbus systems. 68Ks are very nice chips to work with and I still
like them for embedded use. But for general computing they are now
woefully underpowered.


>The real problem is that the amount of data with which people deal
>with on a day to day basis is about 1000 times greater than what it
>was 20 years ago. It now takes a megabyte to say what used to take a
>kilobyte.
>
>And the only time when people throw data away is when they upgrade
>computers. New desktop computer systems come with half a terabyte of
>storage capacity. And maybe a floppy drive for backups. :-)

Yup.

George
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