The Definition of Points
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From: Lester Zick on 17 Mar 2007 14:47 On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 17:47:49 +0100, "SucMucPaProlij" <mrjohnpauldike2006(a)hotmail.com> wrote: >> Intuitive notions are useful guides for finding logical proofs, but they have >> not probatory or logical standing. >> > >Can you define a difference between intuitive point and real apple? >How matematikers handle reality? Geometric figures are boundaries not physical entitities. They're more like shadows than physical things (an anology, shudder!!!). Physical or material things behave according to f=ma etc. Geometric figures interact and behave according to laws of the calculus, derivation, and integration. No mystery here. They're both real and both exist. ~v~~
From: Lester Zick on 17 Mar 2007 14:48 On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 11:00:04 -0600, "nonsense(a)unsettled.com" <nonsense(a)unsettled.com> wrote: >SucMucPaProlij wrote: > > >> Can you define a difference between intuitive point and real apple? >> How matematikers handle reality? > >Sometimes even a troll asks a good question. > >A point and an apple are self defining. We only >get to report about them. > >Please refer to Clinton's comment about the meaning >of "is". Good question, bad answer. ~v~~
From: Lester Zick on 17 Mar 2007 14:51 On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 13:52:02 -0400, Bob Kolker <nowhere(a)nowhere.com> wrote: >nonsense(a)unsettled.com wrote: >> >> Sometimes even a troll asks a good question. >> >> A point and an apple are self defining. We only >> get to report about them. > >Apples are defined by ostention. One points to an apple and says >"apple". That is how babies learn what basic words mean. Not true, Bob. Babies certainly learn words by ostention, but what the words refer to is defined by the way it behaves and the properties inherent in it. Mathematical objects behave one way and physical or material objects another. They're both real; they're just different. >Many of the basic worlds we use are defined by pointing to objects and >attaching the word to the object. Logical definitions occur at a higher >level of abstraction. > >Bob Kolker ~v~~
From: Lester Zick on 17 Mar 2007 14:51 On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 13:47:21 -0400, Bob Kolker <nowhere(a)nowhere.com> wrote: >SucMucPaProlij wrote: >> >> >> Can you define a difference between intuitive point and real apple? >> How matematikers handle reality? > >You can make apple sauce from an apple. You can't make point fritters. Nor can you make shadow fritters. ~v~~
From: Bob Kolker on 17 Mar 2007 15:00
Hero wrote: > > Left and right are geometrical concepts. > When You write down ( 3, 4 ) 3 is left in Your view and 4 is right. 'scuse me. That could be first and second which are temporaal concepts. The Left and Right refer to printing or writing conventions, not to something intrinsically geometric. Bob Kolker |