Very fast oscilloscopes
in [Design]
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From: tlbs101 on 7 May 2010 17:25 On Apr 30, 10:55 am, John Larkin <jjlar...(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote: > On Thu, 29 Apr 2010 09:52:59 -0700, "Joel Koltner" > > <zapwireDASHgro...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > >I bet Agilent wants a pretty penny for their new 32GHz real-time scopes: > >http://cp.literature.agilent.com/litweb/pdf/5990-5271EN.pdf > > >And to think that it was only ~20 years ago that a Tek 11802 with the SD-24 > >(24GHz) sampling head -- that samples at all of 100kHz -- was the hotest > >ticket... now available on eBay for some single-digit percentage of the > >original price... > > >---Joel > > I recently got this email from my friend Mark Kahrs, the > sampling-scope-history expert: > > ========================== > > Yes, the former Soviets did have a 7 GHz real time scope, and a 20 GHz > transient digitizer. They both used the same technique to get the > super high speed keep the deflection angle low. > > When I managed a design project in the transient digitizer group at > Tek, I went on a customer visit and met with engineers working for > EG&G at the Nevada Test Site. The time was after Glasnost, near the > end of the era of underground testing. A delegation of Soviet > scientists were actually invited over to witness a test shot (They did > the same, hosting a group of scientists from Livermore National Labs). > EG&G was using the new 3 GHz transient digitizer from Tek, and thought > its "leading edge" technology would impress their former foes. The > Soviets were not impressed, stating that they had a 20 GHz digitizer. > How did they do it? They way they surpassed many obstacles by not > placing needless restrictions on the technology. A design requirement > for the US made digitizers was that they must fit in a standard 19" > rack. The Soviets took a pragmatic approach, and avoded any size > restrictions. The CRT in their digitizer was just short of 10 m in > length! They used traveling wave distributed deflections plates as our > designs did, but the beam deflection angle was incredibly small, > allowing very high BW. Likewise, the 7 GHz real time scope had a CRT > over 3 meters long. > > The funny part of this true story is that the EG&G team, confident > that they had just showed what they thought was superior technology, > asked if the Soviet scientists had any questions about it. They did. > They asked "How do you get the walls so smooth in the tunnels?" The > shot monitoring tunnels at NTS were drilled with diamond tipped tunnel > boring machines, leaving a relatively smooth wall. The Soviets simply > blasted their tunnels with dynamite. > > ================= > > John I remember that. You probably passed me, in the tunnels. The Soviet admission may be what prompted the EG&G Woburn group to hire the electron LINAC guy so they could make an even faster 'scope. Tom Pounds
From: John Larkin on 7 May 2010 19:05
On Fri, 7 May 2010 14:25:29 -0700 (PDT), tlbs101 <tlbs101(a)excite.com> wrote: >On Apr 30, 10:55�am, John Larkin ><jjlar...(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote: >> On Thu, 29 Apr 2010 09:52:59 -0700, "Joel Koltner" >> >> <zapwireDASHgro...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >> >I bet Agilent wants a pretty penny for their new 32GHz real-time scopes: >> >http://cp.literature.agilent.com/litweb/pdf/5990-5271EN.pdf >> >> >And to think that it was only ~20 years ago that a Tek 11802 with the SD-24 >> >(24GHz) sampling head -- that samples at all of 100kHz -- was the hotest >> >ticket... �now available on eBay for some single-digit percentage of the >> >original price... >> >> >---Joel >> >> I recently got this email from my friend Mark Kahrs, the >> sampling-scope-history expert: >> >> ========================== >> >> Yes, the former Soviets did have a 7 GHz real time scope, and a 20 GHz >> transient digitizer. They both used the same technique to get the >> super high speed � keep the deflection angle low. >> >> When I managed a design project in the transient digitizer group at >> Tek, I went on a customer visit and met with engineers working for >> EG&G at the Nevada Test Site. The time was after Glasnost, near the >> end of the era of underground testing. A delegation of Soviet >> scientists were actually invited over to witness a test shot (They did >> the same, hosting a group of scientists from Livermore National Labs). >> EG&G was using the new 3 GHz transient digitizer from Tek, and thought >> its "leading edge" technology would impress their former foes. The >> Soviets were not impressed, stating that they had a 20 GHz digitizer. >> How did they do it? They way they surpassed many obstacles � by not >> placing needless restrictions on the technology. A design requirement >> for the US made digitizers was that they must fit in a standard 19" >> rack. The Soviets took a pragmatic approach, and avoded any size >> restrictions. The CRT in their digitizer was just short of 10 m in >> length! They used traveling wave distributed deflections plates as our >> designs did, but the beam deflection angle was incredibly small, >> allowing very high BW. Likewise, the 7 GHz real time scope had a CRT >> over 3 meters long. >> >> The funny part of this true story is that the EG&G team, confident >> that they had just showed what they thought was superior technology, >> asked if the Soviet scientists had any questions about it. They did. >> They asked "How do you get the walls so smooth in the tunnels?" The >> shot monitoring tunnels at NTS were drilled with diamond tipped tunnel >> boring machines, leaving a relatively smooth wall. The Soviets simply >> blasted their tunnels with dynamite. >> >> ================= >> >> John > >I remember that. > >You probably passed me, in the tunnels. > >The Soviet admission may be what prompted the EG&G Woburn group to >hire the electron LINAC guy so they could make an even faster 'scope. > >Tom Pounds This is a scan-conversion scope http://www.greenfieldtechnology.com/-Data-aquisition-system-.html that my friend Bernard still makes. He sort of copied my company/products/logo, except that he has three seagulls and I have a moon. Tek used to sell this scope under their name, too. I think it was developed by In-Snec for the French atom bomb program. Modern digital scopes are up to 32 GHz single-shot. People are doing stuff like digitizing x-band radar pulses right at the antanna. John |