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From: GT on 12 Oct 2009 06:48
"GT" <ContactGT_rem_ov_e_(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:0001bc82$0$2226$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com...
[snip]
> Ideally I would like to have used the screen as a second desktop monitor,
> but research suggests that this is more trouble than its worth! Any
> thoughts on adapters etc for this?

I take it the lack of comment on this point reflects my googlings - ie.
forget it?!?


From: Paul on 12 Oct 2009 06:58
GT wrote:
> "philo" <philo(a)privacy.net> wrote in message
> news:FsidnfVq08R8x0_XnZ2dnUVZ_vednZ2d(a)ntd.net...
>> GT wrote:
>>> I have an old Multivision N251C1 laptop. I think the graphics card has
>>> gone as the laptop screen is just colourful noise. An external monitor
>>> displays the same. I am going to break it and ebay the parts. I know the
>>> screen is a good one, I just can't exactly remember the resolution. Can
>>> anyone help me?? It was something like 1400x1080, but I want to be sure
>>> before listing it.
>>>
>>> The company (multivision) went into liquidation many years ago and the
>>> only thing I can find on google is replacement batteries.
>>>
>>> Ideally I would like to have used the screen as a second desktop monitor,
>>> but research suggests that this is more trouble than its worth! Any
>>> thoughts on adapters etc for this?
>>>
>>> Incidentally, anyone want to buy a broken laptop? 15.4" 1450x1080 screen
>>> (I think ). Athlon 2500. 512MB DDR Ram. 80GB hd. All working except
>>> GPU.... Ah, OK, thought not!
>> First off, can you read the bios message?
>
> No, the graphics have definitely blown. Noise immediately from power on. Can
> hear the hard disk working etc, so everything else is probably OK. Can ebay
> the RAM etc.
>
> Anyone know what core voltage should be for the Athlon 2500 mobile CPU? I
> have put the processor in my 'living room' socket A shuttle box, but its
> clocked it (automatically) at 1.65. Sure this is too high. Probably have to
> pin mod it down - I seem to remember 1.4 or 1.5 volts??
>

I have an AthlonXP-M 2600 and I ran it at 1.65V while using it
at 3200+ settings (2200MHz or 200x11). It seemed to be happy there,
running on settings used by desktop processors. My processor
didn't like higher voltages. And I didn't really spend any time
"playing the limbo" with it, and seeing how low it would go.
I just wanted it to remain stable.

The coding a mobile uses, and a desktop uses, is apparently different.
Scroll down to the L11 "Code to CORE Voltage Definition" section here.
My processor was a "Q", with mobile coding of 1.45V, and when plugged
into my Nforce2 desktop board, asks for 1.575V. I set it manually
to 1.65V. So I was running it at a different clock rate, and a different
voltage, than whatever its defaults were. The main reason I got the
mobile, is so I could dial it all over the place (and do things
like benchmark how low a frequency could be used on a game, before
it would stutter). When I overclocked it (ran it higher than 3200+),
it really didn't seem to be improving things much, so there was
no point leaving it there. It wasn't completely stable at 2400MHz,
and I was running out of room to use more voltage (it won't post
at about 1.75V). And I didn't want to ruin it for nothing.

http://fab51.com/cpu/barton/athlon-e23.html

So read the code off the top of the processor, and you should be
able to figure out what voltage it is officially. All I can remember,
is that mine was a "Q".

Paul
From: Paul on 12 Oct 2009 09:02
GT wrote:
> "GT" <ContactGT_rem_ov_e_(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:0001bc82$0$2226$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com...
> [snip]
>> Ideally I would like to have used the screen as a second desktop monitor,
>> but research suggests that this is more trouble than its worth! Any
>> thoughts on adapters etc for this?
>
> I take it the lack of comment on this point reflects my googlings - ie.
> forget it?!?
>

A laptop panel is just a panel.

An LCD monitor equals "I/O board" plus panel.

You need to do some of the functions of the I/O board.
And that isn't trivial.

http://www.molex.com/chinese/AppIn/images/dataPeri/LCDMonitor.jpg

There is a sample panel datasheet here, if you want to have a
look.

http://www.datasheetcatalog.org/datasheet/nec/NL10276BC28-05D.pdf

The LVDS panel interface is simple bit transmission, but the
bits are packed a bit funny. 21 bits of data appear to be
sent per pixel on screen, with the DE being a "data enable"
bit. It tells the panel when the visible display data is present.
That sample panel is a 6 bit type. DVI is 8 bit data per pixel
and 2 overhead bits (stripped off), for a total of 10 bits for
each color signal. I assume dithering is used, to go from an
8 bit code to 6 bit code, but I don't know the details. 7 bits
at a pixel rate of 65MHz equals a bit clock for this pattern
of 455MHz. (And the reason that frequency is so low, is because
the sample datasheet is a 1024x768 panel. DVI runs at 1650MHz max,
for comparison.)

"R" R0 R1 R2 R3 R4 R5 G0
"G" G1 G2 G3 G4 G5 B0 B1
"B" B2 B3 B4 B5 Hsync Vsync DE

So, forget it.

As for commercial solutions, yes, they exist. But the price charged
is totally out of line with the cost of the chips inside. Now, this
one is for driving an SGI 1600SW, but you'd be crazy to spend this
much, to be able to continue using it. The 1600SW was a monitor
with a pre-DVI interface on it, of LVDS flavor. So this is
functionally a little closer to what you want to do, but
still isn't going to be right. (The 1600SW may not do things
the way current panels do. I'm only mentioning this, as
an example of how much you can gouge people for.)

http://www.hdtvsupply.com/dvi-3180a.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SGI_1600SW

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenLDI

The thing is, an I/O board is dirt cheap, when you consider
what we pay for LCD monitors at the low end. So the chips
on there aren't that expensive. But the thing is, the chips
have to be programmed to the characteristics of the panel
being used, so some EEPROM on the I/O board has the
"personality" to make the panel work. Arbitrarily
ripping an I/O board out of some monitor, doesn't
instantly solve your problem. There are bound to be
other details. And with any luck, all the datasheets
for the chips in the monitor, will be written in
Chinese :-)

HTH,
Paul
From: GT on 12 Oct 2009 09:26
"Paul" <nospam(a)needed.com> wrote in message
news:hav24c$dbb$1(a)news.eternal-september.org...
> GT wrote:
>> "philo" <philo(a)privacy.net> wrote in message
>> news:FsidnfVq08R8x0_XnZ2dnUVZ_vednZ2d(a)ntd.net...
>>> GT wrote:
>>>> I have an old Multivision N251C1 laptop. I think the graphics card has
>>>> gone as the laptop screen is just colourful noise. An external monitor
>>>> displays the same. I am going to break it and ebay the parts. I know
>>>> the screen is a good one, I just can't exactly remember the resolution.
>>>> Can anyone help me?? It was something like 1400x1080, but I want to be
>>>> sure before listing it.
>>>>
>>>> The company (multivision) went into liquidation many years ago and the
>>>> only thing I can find on google is replacement batteries.
>>>>
>>>> Ideally I would like to have used the screen as a second desktop
>>>> monitor, but research suggests that this is more trouble than its
>>>> worth! Any thoughts on adapters etc for this?
>>>>
>>>> Incidentally, anyone want to buy a broken laptop? 15.4" 1450x1080
>>>> screen (I think ). Athlon 2500. 512MB DDR Ram. 80GB hd. All working
>>>> except GPU.... Ah, OK, thought not!
>>> First off, can you read the bios message?
>>
>> No, the graphics have definitely blown. Noise immediately from power on.
>> Can hear the hard disk working etc, so everything else is probably OK.
>> Can ebay the RAM etc.
>>
>> Anyone know what core voltage should be for the Athlon 2500 mobile CPU? I
>> have put the processor in my 'living room' socket A shuttle box, but its
>> clocked it (automatically) at 1.65. Sure this is too high. Probably have
>> to pin mod it down - I seem to remember 1.4 or 1.5 volts??
>
> I have an AthlonXP-M 2600 and I ran it at 1.65V while using it
> at 3200+ settings (2200MHz or 200x11). It seemed to be happy there,
> running on settings used by desktop processors. My processor
> didn't like higher voltages. And I didn't really spend any time
> "playing the limbo" with it, and seeing how low it would go.
> I just wanted it to remain stable.
>
> The coding a mobile uses, and a desktop uses, is apparently different.
> Scroll down to the L11 "Code to CORE Voltage Definition" section here.
> My processor was a "Q", with mobile coding of 1.45V, and when plugged
> into my Nforce2 desktop board, asks for 1.575V. I set it manually
> to 1.65V. So I was running it at a different clock rate, and a different
> voltage, than whatever its defaults were. The main reason I got the
> mobile, is so I could dial it all over the place (and do things
> like benchmark how low a frequency could be used on a game, before
> it would stutter). When I overclocked it (ran it higher than 3200+),
> it really didn't seem to be improving things much, so there was
> no point leaving it there. It wasn't completely stable at 2400MHz,
> and I was running out of room to use more voltage (it won't post
> at about 1.75V). And I didn't want to ruin it for nothing.
>
> http://fab51.com/cpu/barton/athlon-e23.html
>
> So read the code off the top of the processor, and you should be
> able to figure out what voltage it is officially. All I can remember,
> is that mine was a "Q".
>
> Paul

Brilliant, thanks. I'm not looking to overclock, but run as quietly as
possible. Its just a basic PC connected to the TV for the kids to run
CBeebies and silly little games on. No power required, but silence would be
perfect!


From: kony on 12 Oct 2009 15:03
On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 14:26:04 +0100, "GT"
<ContactGT_rem_ov_e_(a)hotmail.com> wrote:


>Brilliant, thanks. I'm not looking to overclock, but run as quietly as
>possible. Its just a basic PC connected to the TV for the kids to run
>CBeebies and silly little games on. No power required, but silence would be
>perfect!
>


You may have a lot of latitude with that CPU, depending on
what voltage, bus and multiplier settings your board
supports.

Generally keeping in mind that it may boost performance
keeping a 1:1 FSB to memory bus ratio, it would be better
performance to set FSB and memory to the max your memory and
chipset revision supports, then set the multiplier depending
on what speed you want (you could even desire underclocking
it to reduce power/heat... and use lower speed fan for less
noise, the most possible), and give it enough voltage to
POST, and run Prime95's Torture Test stabily.

That voltage can vary quite a bit on mobile chips. I expect
you can run stock speed at around 1.5V, but don't recall if
that might be under the stock voltage. Odds are good that
you can run the stock speed stabily at lower than the stock
voltage, but the heatsink you want to use factors in at some
point, this was an era when plain cheap all aluminum
extruded types started to not do so well anymore at full
load unless they had pretty large or high RPM fans.
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