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From: 123Jim on 12 Mar 2010 04:22
Hi all,
Does an Intel (r) q45/q43 express graphics card have two output sockets for
monitor/projectors or just one?

I can't find a photo of it out there.


From: Paul on 12 Mar 2010 05:36
123Jim wrote:
> Hi all,
> Does an Intel (r) q45/q43 express graphics card have two output sockets for
> monitor/projectors or just one?
>
> I can't find a photo of it out there.
>

Q45 is a chipset. You're referring to "integrated graphics" support on
a motherboard. That is a way of driving the monitor, using connector(s)
on the back of the computer in the I/O plate area of the motherboard.
In other words, you're using the motherboard with no add-in video card,
to build a computer.

*******

Intel sells motherboards, and would be a place to look for pictures.
You would want something from their "Executive" series. The Executive
series uses the Q45, amongst others.

http://www.intel.com/products/motherboard/index.htm?iid=subhdr+prod_boards

DQ45CB has a DVI-D and an DVI-I connector, in a stack. You'll notice
the DVI-D (digital only) connector, doesn't even have room for the
little blades of a DVI-I connector to fit. The DVI-I carries DVI-D and
VGA signals. The DVI-D connector is digital only.

http://www.8anet.com/prodimg/DQ45CB_back.jpg

Spec for the system from Intel.

http://downloadmirror.intel.com/16958/eng/DQ45CB_TechProdSpec.pdf

"1.6.1.1 Intel Graphics Media Accelerator 4500 Graphics Controller

- Dual independent display support"

And that means, you could drive two DVI digital monitors, or you could drive a
DVI monitor and a VGA monitor, by using a DVI-I to VGA adapter. The DVI-I to
VGA adapter won't plug into the DVI-D connector, but it will fit into the
DVI-I connector.

DVI-I digital signals -----> DVI-D capable
analog signals -----> VGA capable (via passive adapter plug)

DVI-D digital signals -----> DVI-D capable only (for DVI LCD monitor)

There is no requirement, that all motherboard designs include the same
set of connectors on the back. That example I picked, does appear to be
able to drive two monitors. Other manufacturers, building Q45 based
systems, can do whatever they want. They might even have only one
connector on the back. So if you bought something other than the example
I picked above, do your research carefully.

HTH,
Paul
From: 123Jim on 14 Mar 2010 20:31

"Paul" <nospam(a)needed.com> wrote in message
news:hnd5eo$2hf$1(a)news.eternal-september.org...
> 123Jim wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> Does an Intel (r) q45/q43 express graphics card have two output sockets
>> for monitor/projectors or just one?
>>
>> I can't find a photo of it out there.
>>
>
> Q45 is a chipset. You're referring to "integrated graphics" support on
> a motherboard. That is a way of driving the monitor, using connector(s)
> on the back of the computer in the I/O plate area of the motherboard.
> In other words, you're using the motherboard with no add-in video card,
> to build a computer.
>
> *******
>
> Intel sells motherboards, and would be a place to look for pictures.
> You would want something from their "Executive" series. The Executive
> series uses the Q45, amongst others.
>
> http://www.intel.com/products/motherboard/index.htm?iid=subhdr+prod_boards
>
> DQ45CB has a DVI-D and an DVI-I connector, in a stack. You'll notice
> the DVI-D (digital only) connector, doesn't even have room for the
> little blades of a DVI-I connector to fit. The DVI-I carries DVI-D and
> VGA signals. The DVI-D connector is digital only.
>
> http://www.8anet.com/prodimg/DQ45CB_back.jpg
>
> Spec for the system from Intel.
>
> http://downloadmirror.intel.com/16958/eng/DQ45CB_TechProdSpec.pdf
>
> "1.6.1.1 Intel Graphics Media Accelerator 4500 Graphics Controller
>
> - Dual independent display support"
>
> And that means, you could drive two DVI digital monitors, or you could
> drive a
> DVI monitor and a VGA monitor, by using a DVI-I to VGA adapter. The DVI-I
> to
> VGA adapter won't plug into the DVI-D connector, but it will fit into the
> DVI-I connector.
>
> DVI-I digital signals -----> DVI-D capable
> analog signals -----> VGA capable (via passive adapter plug)
>
> DVI-D digital signals -----> DVI-D capable only (for DVI LCD
> monitor)
>
> There is no requirement, that all motherboard designs include the same
> set of connectors on the back. That example I picked, does appear to be
> able to drive two monitors. Other manufacturers, building Q45 based
> systems, can do whatever they want. They might even have only one
> connector on the back. So if you bought something other than the example
> I picked above, do your research carefully.
>
> HTH,
> Paul


Many thanks Paul for your comprehensive reply, as always!
I'll be taking a look at the computer tomorrow. We need to connect up a
Smartboard so that in the absence of a freeze function for the projector we
can use the computer independently of what is displayed on the Smartboard.
Its already connected, but I'm told there is no freeze function, and no
extended desktop option. This means the Smart board ties up the only
networked computer. ... if true, not so Smart* ..



From: 123Jim on 15 Mar 2010 13:49

"Paul" <nospam(a)needed.com> wrote in message
news:hnd5eo$2hf$1(a)news.eternal-september.org...
> 123Jim wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> Does an Intel (r) q45/q43 express graphics card have two output sockets
>> for monitor/projectors or just one?
>>
>> I can't find a photo of it out there.
>>
>
> Q45 is a chipset. You're referring to "integrated graphics" support on
> a motherboard. That is a way of driving the monitor, using connector(s)
> on the back of the computer in the I/O plate area of the motherboard.
> In other words, you're using the motherboard with no add-in video card,
> to build a computer.
>
> *******
>
> Intel sells motherboards, and would be a place to look for pictures.
> You would want something from their "Executive" series. The Executive
> series uses the Q45, amongst others.
>
> http://www.intel.com/products/motherboard/index.htm?iid=subhdr+prod_boards
>
> DQ45CB has a DVI-D and an DVI-I connector, in a stack. You'll notice
> the DVI-D (digital only) connector, doesn't even have room for the
> little blades of a DVI-I connector to fit. The DVI-I carries DVI-D and
> VGA signals. The DVI-D connector is digital only.
>
> http://www.8anet.com/prodimg/DQ45CB_back.jpg
>
> Spec for the system from Intel.
>
> http://downloadmirror.intel.com/16958/eng/DQ45CB_TechProdSpec.pdf
>
> "1.6.1.1 Intel Graphics Media Accelerator 4500 Graphics Controller
>
> - Dual independent display support"
>
> And that means, you could drive two DVI digital monitors, or you could
> drive a
> DVI monitor and a VGA monitor, by using a DVI-I to VGA adapter. The DVI-I
> to
> VGA adapter won't plug into the DVI-D connector, but it will fit into the
> DVI-I connector.
>
> DVI-I digital signals -----> DVI-D capable
> analog signals -----> VGA capable (via passive adapter plug)
>
> DVI-D digital signals -----> DVI-D capable only (for DVI LCD
> monitor)
>
> There is no requirement, that all motherboard designs include the same
> set of connectors on the back. That example I picked, does appear to be
> able to drive two monitors. Other manufacturers, building Q45 based
> systems, can do whatever they want. They might even have only one
> connector on the back. So if you bought something other than the example
> I picked above, do your research carefully.
>
> HTH,
> Paul

Turns out there is only one vga connector at the back of the computer (
System Model HP Compaq dc7900 Ultra-Slim Desktop)

This computer is connected to a splitter (Rextron Video splitter vsa12) the
outputs from it are connected to the monitor and to the Smartboard's
projector.

The problem is the computer does not seem to know there are two video
displays, and so there is no option for extended desktop on the Intel
graphics controller software.

and as I mentioned previously there is no freeze function on this board's
projector.

What is the solution?

cheers




From: Paul on 15 Mar 2010 19:15
123Jim wrote:

>
> Turns out there is only one vga connector at the back of the computer (
> System Model HP Compaq dc7900 Ultra-Slim Desktop)
>
> This computer is connected to a splitter (Rextron Video splitter vsa12) the
> outputs from it are connected to the monitor and to the Smartboard's
> projector.
>
> The problem is the computer does not seem to know there are two video
> displays, and so there is no option for extended desktop on the Intel
> graphics controller software.
>
> and as I mentioned previously there is no freeze function on this board's
> projector.
>
> What is the solution?
>
> cheers

The manual for the VSA12, indicates it is an active buffer device.
It is a distribution amp, that runs off a 9V wall adapter.
And what that should do, is make two identical copies of the
original video signal. If the smartboard and the monitor don't share
a common resolution, then one of them may indicate "out of range".

http://www.rextron.jp/products/manual_e/REXTRON_VSA248.pdf

Another small detail, is the connection of DDC. There is a serial
clock and data interface on the VGA cable. Computer monitors have
a table of resolutions stored in them, which can be read out. That
is how the computer figures out what resolutions to use (in theory).
When there are two devices connected, you'd hope that one of the
ports is the one that has the DDC connected. If you look in the
Display control panel, maybe you'll see one of the devices named
by its Plug and Play information. And that would tell you that
the computer is able to see the serial data on the DDC interface.
In any case, you'd still have to select a resolution and refresh
rate they both like.

This program allows you to see whether any Plug and Play is coming
across or not. It might tell you which device is providing DDC
info, if any is actually coming across. Not all VGA devices have
such an interface. For example, a projector might not have DDC
on it, just the RGBHV signals.

http://www.entechtaiwan.com/util/moninfo.shtm

If you only have the one VGA output on the computer, you can produce
just the one signal with that. You can feed identical copies to both
display devices, but you won't have "extended desktop", "clone" or
any other video driver functions like that to work with.

What you need, is a video card. You mentioned the words "ultra-slim"
above - eek! That severely limits what you can do with that computer.

And page 1 here, shows the bad news. This is almost a laptop, in terms
of expansion capabilities.

http://h18000.www1.hp.com/products/quickspecs/13029_div/13029_div.PDF

But don't despair. There is still hope. They make USB2 video display
devices. You won't be playing 3D games on it, but for mostly static
display output, it'll be fine. I believe these things use a degree
of data compression on the USB cable, which helps compensate for the
30MB/sec or so you might expect to get on a USB2 cable.

I like the reviews on this site, because they can give some background
on the device in question. The chip inside this one is made by
DisplayLink. It is possible an earlier version had a VGA output. This
one is DVI (and I didn't notice if it said DVI-D or DVI-I).

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.aspx?Item=N82E16815101001

There are more examples here. This is the company that makes the chip,
and this page has some other suggestions of hardware that uses the
chip.

http://www.displaylink.com/shop/index.php?product=5

Perhaps if you can find something like that, where you are, you
can set up a second independent video output on your ultra-slim
that way. Just don't expect to be playing 3D games on it.

Not all the devices of that type, use data compression or incremental
update techniques, to drive the display. Some of the earlier devices,
would be relatively dumb, and a bit slower. Also, the output
resolutions of earlier attempts at this kind of technology, may be
lacking (like 1024x768). The DisplayLink may be one of the first
"barely acceptable" solutions, while some of the earlier designs
are only fit for the nearest garbage dumpster.

There was one LCD computer monitor, that offered a USB connection
on the monitor for video purposes. It uses a DisplayLink chip
and one other neat feature it had, was the monitor had a copy
of the driver stored in flash memory. When you plugged the monitor
into the computer, an Autorun in the flash memory, would be automatically
run by the computer, and within a few seconds, you'd have a video
output on the screen. But that only worked for perhaps one OS,
and what was stored in flash didn't satisfy all possible OSes.
Still, it is an example of trying to integrate the function,
right into a monitor.

http://www.everythingusb.com/samsung_syncmaster_940ux_11970.html

Here, you can see that Samsung monitor has two functions on the
USB cable. "Ubisync" is the video display interface in the monitor,
while the other one is the USB Mass Storage (flash) that holds
the driver code.

http://www.everythingusb.com/images/list/samsung940uxusbdevmgmt.jpg

Once you get something like that set up, that should give you an
independent display.

*******

There is yet another solution, but it relies on the characteristics
of the GPU in the computer. Matrox makes a number of different models
of display splitting devices. For example, imagine the computer had
the ability to drive 2560x1024 out on the VGA cable. The Matrox device
splits the output down the center, sending the left half to one VGA
output (1280x1024) and the right half to a second VGA output (1280x1024).
It means the two display devices should like the same kind of signal,
but at least in that case, you have an "extended" desktop of sorts.

+------------------+ +-----------+ +-----------+
| 2560x1024 | ===> | 1280x1024 | + | 1280x1024 |
| | | | | |
+------------------+ +-----------+ +-----------+

You can start checking compatibility here.

http://matrox.com/graphics/en/support/gxm_main/

I think this one might be a (wide) VGA in, to two VGA out.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.aspx?Item=N82E16815106015

This article, shows a picture of what is inside the box.

http://www.anandtech.com/displays/showdoc.aspx?i=2621&p=2

And this article, is for the triple-head version, which
requires the computer to drive out an even wider signal
to make it work.

http://www.anandtech.com/printarticle.aspx?i=2806

Have fun,
Paul
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