jQuery vs. My Library
in [JavaScript]
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From: Matt Kruse on 24 Jan 2010 22:43 On Jan 24, 6:38 pm, RobG <rg...(a)iinet.net.au> wrote: > No one's perfect. But subjective criteria like "is the architect a > nice guy" don't rate too highly in my selection criteria. I think it is important (although perhaps not MOST important) because it gives a good idea of what kind of adoption the library will have, whether it will become widely used, what the support/user community will be like, how the library will respond to criticism, whether it will take suggestions, etc. And that stuff matters. So I think it's important to weigh that in with other criteria. And this is, I think, critical for this library because currently it has virtually no acceptance, few examples, poor documentation, a bad web site, no support community, and a bad name. Having an architect who behaves like a child is just another reason why the library will be ignored, IMO. Personally, I don't see "My Library" gaining any acceptance or having much impact on the scripting library space. But I suspect that something may rise out of it (perhaps by someone other than DM, perhaps several people here) and be something influential. That's my prediction. Regardless of personalities, I think it is important for anyone who is interested in js and scripting libraries to be informed about this discussion and to be watching where this goes. Matt Kruse
From: Andrew Poulos on 25 Jan 2010 02:34 On 25/01/2010 2:43 PM, Matt Kruse wrote: > On Jan 24, 6:38 pm, RobG<rg...(a)iinet.net.au> wrote: >> No one's perfect. But subjective criteria like "is the architect a >> nice guy" don't rate too highly in my selection criteria. > > I think it is important (although perhaps not MOST important) because Did you also check the personalities of Bill Gates, Steve Jobs and Linus Torvald before deciding on an OS? > it gives a good idea of what kind of adoption the library will have, > whether it will become widely used, what the support/user community > will be like, how the library will respond to criticism, whether it > will take suggestions, etc. And that stuff matters. So I think it's > important to weigh that in with other criteria. > > And this is, I think, critical for this library because currently it > has virtually no acceptance, few examples, poor documentation, a bad > web site, no support community, and a bad name. Having an architect > who behaves like a child is just another reason why the library will > be ignored, IMO. > > Personally, I don't see "My Library" gaining any acceptance or having > much impact on the scripting library space. But I suspect that > something may rise out of it (perhaps by someone other than DM, > perhaps several people here) and be something influential. That's my > prediction. Regardless of personalities, I think it is important for > anyone who is interested in js and scripting libraries to be informed > about this discussion and to be watching where this goes. I've asked for people to post a defence of the *factual* criticisms that David Mark has made of various js libraries. So far the postings have been along the lines of: - I don't like him - He's not a nice person and now - His library won't get used Andrew Poulos
From: Scott Sauyet on 25 Jan 2010 06:26 On Jan 25, 2:34 am, Andrew Poulos <ap_p...(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > On 25/01/2010 2:43 PM, Matt Kruse wrote: > >> On Jan 24, 6:38 pm, RobG<rg...(a)iinet.net.au> wrote: >>> No one's perfect. But subjective criteria like "is the architect a >>> nice guy" don't rate too highly in my selection criteria. > >> I think it is important (although perhaps not MOST important) because > > Did you also check the personalities of Bill Gates, Steve Jobs and Linus > Torvald before deciding on an OS? I rather doubt he did. But I'll bet he knew something about the support offered by Microsoft, Apple, and the Linux community. >> it gives a good idea of what kind of adoption the library will have, >> whether it will become widely used, what the support/user community >> will be like, how the library will respond to criticism, whether it >> will take suggestions, etc. And that stuff matters. So I think it's >> important to weigh that in with other criteria. > [ ... ] >> Personally, I don't see "My Library" gaining any acceptance or having >> much impact on the scripting library space. But I suspect that >> something may rise out of it (perhaps by someone other than DM, >> perhaps several people here) and be something influential. That's my >> prediction. Regardless of personalities, I think it is important for >> anyone who is interested in js and scripting libraries to be informed >> about this discussion and to be watching where this goes. > > I've asked for people to post a defence of the *factual* criticisms that > David Mark has made of various js libraries. So far the postings have > been along the lines of: > - I don't like him > - He's not a nice person > and now > - His library won't get used Excuse me, but you seem to have stepped into the wrong discussion here. I haven't seen anyone trying to defend any other library here, only discussing My Library and David Mark's promotion of it. And even the critique of his abrasiveness has been tempered, as Matt did here, as one consideration among many. -- Scott
From: Matt Kruse on 25 Jan 2010 09:44 On Jan 25, 2:34 am, Andrew Poulos <ap_p...(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > > I think it is important (although perhaps not MOST important) because > Did you also check the personalities of Bill Gates, Steve Jobs and Linus > Torvald before deciding on an OS? That's a bad analogy. If I had an interest in analyzing and predicting the success of different OS options back at the time those were being created, then looking at the personality of the people in charge would certainly have been important. In retrospect, their personalities have been a very important factor in the overall success. Often in history, the success of one product or technology over another has had little to do with the technical and factual qualities of each, but rather the marketing and branding and people behind them. There are countless examples. If a person is going to invest heavily into one technology in terms of time, money, training, development, support, etc then it's important to figure out if the technology is going to be widely accepted for years to come, or obsolete in 6 months. If you were convinced of the technical superiority of HD-DVD over Blu-Ray, and invested heavily into that technology because of the technical issues alone, you would have found yourself in a lot of trouble as the market went the other way. It is often a better choice to go with the market leader rather than a technically superior solution that has no support. > I've asked for people to post a defence of the *factual* criticisms that > David Mark has made of various js libraries. Those discussions have been going for years. Most of the time, his factual criticisms are valid. Sometimes not. Sometimes they are valid but miss the bigger picture. Opinions differ. But that isn't the point of this thread or my post. > So far the postings have > been along the lines of: > - I don't like him > - He's not a nice person > and now > - His library won't get used David is throwing himself out there in a very rude and abrasive manner, as usual. That's fine. That's who he wants to be. He is offering up his library as the best library ever and trashing everyone else. So he is opening himself up to criticism and opinions, and I think that's what this thread is about. In discussing whether his library will gain acceptance or make any real challenge to the "major" libraries, I think his personality and how he "markets" his product are indeed very important. That's independent of the quality of the code, but it's still a discussion that many people here might be interested in. If nothing else, it's way more interesting than discussing yet again how stupid he thinks John Resig is. Matt Kruse
From: D.Campagna on 25 Jan 2010 19:05
Scott Sauyet ha scritto: > > Face it. I called your bluff. > > You started this off with the following: > > | And take a guess which is faster. Rather, don't guess but try the > | the Speed Test. The "do everything" cross-browser script that > | doesn't need dozens of dubious plug-ins is much faster than the > | "optimized" (more like lobotomized) script. > > I went and looked at your speed test, which pairs old versions of the > other libraries with your latest and greatest. When I compare yours > with the recent versions of these scripts, your claims were not > substantiated. Or -- excuse me, maybe I misunderstood -- did you > perhaps mean to imply that My Library is the lobotomized script? > > Trying to bury this in post after post of results that don't reinforce > your claims only serves to obfuscate.the issue. If there is something > wrong with these two slickspeed tests, please let us know: Scott, thanks for the time you invested in this review. We all know the way DM tries to promote himself and his work and how he is used to argue with the unfortunates who try to exchange opinions with him. So, no need to waste your time discussing with a person that in fact probably has never had a genuine exchange of opinions in his life, conceiving discussions as an exercice of one-way communication and total distortion of what others say. I knew the man is somewhat obfuscated by his attitude and his presumption, but this stupid thing to compare old versions of the major libraries is so ridicolous I was really laughing while reading. The entire thing is so pathetic and ridicolous that should never have been even discussed in a serious technical forum. Strange enough, nobody here ever noticed such biased tests were in place, even if Mr. Mark often bragged about the speed of his library et. al. Sometimes I have the feeling that a lot of people here are very tolerant to Mr. Mark. I come back to my habit to lurk this NG; I suppose many other do the same. I oly wanted to make it clear, I appreciate this thread... > > Bluff called. > > -- Scott He'll never become rich with poker, I think :-) Dan |