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From: Tom Anderson on 28 Apr 2010 08:39
On Wed, 28 Apr 2010, Thufir wrote:

> On Tue, 27 Apr 2010 18:58:47 +0100, Tom Anderson wrote:
>
>> It's possible to do much or all of that portably - ant was made to do
>> this (more or less), and what you can't do in ant, you can do in java
>> (perhaps by writing an ant task).
>
> There are other build scripts besides ant, most notably maven.

Maven's not an alternative to ant, AIUI, it's more of a wrapper - it does
a lot of standardised donkey work (fetching dependencies, compiling,
building JARs, running tests etc) for you, as long as you submit to its
rules for laying out packages, but if you want to do something that isn't
standardised donkey work (and i'm not certain how far that goes, but i
think things like loading databases, starting app servers etc are not
covered), you're back to writing your own ant job.

> In java, there's groovy. I've used ruby & rake, and there are a variety
> of java build projects based upon ruby and rake which simplify things.
>
> Would any of those solve that problem, I wonder?

Yes, if you're willing to use one of those. I would absolutely love to
move our build process over to groovy (and gant, which is a groovy API to
ant's tasks, which are themselves often pretty useful), but that would
involve adding a new language to the project - a language which nobody in
our office knows, and which our clients don't know (so far, at least). At
least with the bash-ant-java hybrid we have at the moment, when we hand a
system over to a client they have a hope in hell of understanding it based
on their existing knowledge.

Yes, groovy is easy to learn. But that doesn't really matter, because when
a project manager or a less-inquisitive developer sees the bullet point
that says 'build system written in groovy', they go ballistic.

That's the argument that's stopped us moving to groovy so far, anyway.
There is a faction here which does not believe it, and continues to
agitate for groovy, but so far he hasn't won out.

tom

--
IMPORTANCE MEMO: >>> WHEN YOU BUY AN N-GAGE QD <<< PLEASE, please CONTINUE
TO TALK ON THE SIDE!!$ Note: the other party will not be able to hear you,
BUT WHO REALLY CRAPS A THING, SIDETALKIN' 2009++!!!
From: Tom Anderson on 28 Apr 2010 08:40
On Tue, 27 Apr 2010, Lew wrote:

> Lew wrote:
>>> Fortunately you can use bash on Windows if you install Cygwin, which
>>> restores your portability.
>
> Tom Anderson wrote:
>> It's not just bash. It's bash and all the other unix utilities the scripts
>> use, and the existence of /tmp, the ability to ssh to another machine and
>> run commands on it, etc. It would be interesting to see if it could be
>> ported, but i'd [sic] very much prefer that someone other than me tried it!
>
> All of that is in the Cygwin suite. I've been doing it for a decade,
> including port-forwarding X-Windows over SSH, database connections,
> using "scp", whatever.

Your brain may know all that, but my gut tells me otherwise.

Okay, sounds like i should give cygwin a shot. Or rather, get one of the
contractors who has a windows laptop to give cygwin a shot.

tom

--
IMPORTANCE MEMO: >>> WHEN YOU BUY AN N-GAGE QD <<< PLEASE, please CONTINUE
TO TALK ON THE SIDE!!$ Note: the other party will not be able to hear you,
BUT WHO REALLY CRAPS A THING, SIDETALKIN' 2009++!!!
From: mr_wu on 5 May 2010 19:50
Thanks for all replies which are very informative.

Ideally I would like to develop on git + Ubuntu and push to a redhat
server.
But I'm currently using Netbeans on Mac to learn jee since
virtualization
on this Mac isn't acceptably fast.

My other question is what packages must be installed on linux live
server
if I am not doing most development on there? In principle I don't
need to install
jdk right? I make jar or war or ear on development box and then push
these to live server where JRE there would take care of serving pages
and app?

Learning with IDE makes these issues not very obvious. Is there any
learning trail out there
which involves only shell and on linux?
From: Roedy Green on 6 May 2010 18:52
On Wed, 5 May 2010 16:50:43 -0700 (PDT), mr_wu <mr.z.m.wu(a)gmail.com>
wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said :

>My other question is what packages must be installed on linux live
>server
>if I am not doing most development on there? In principle I don't
>need to instal

You want to run your IDE/editor on a local desktop. You might consider
setting up a LAN with some old machines to do things like testing.
You will want your JDK on whatever machine you do your editing.
--
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
http://mindprod.com

What is the point of a surveillance camera with insufficient resolution to identify culprits?
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