Albert Einstein didn't accept black holes or the idea of totally collapsed stars
in [Physics]
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From: PD on 23 Apr 2010 17:31 On Apr 23, 4:29 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > On Apr 23, 2:14 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Apr 23, 4:07 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > On Apr 23, 2:03 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Apr 23, 3:35 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > On Apr 23, 1:29 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 3:15 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > Do you have trouble with the motion law that says time will stop if > > > > > > > you reach the speed of light? This is validated by black hole event > > > > > > > horizons. > > > > > > > There is no motion law that says that time will stop if you reach the > > > > > > speed of light, because nothing that ever went less than the speed of > > > > > > light can reach the speed of light, and therefore time never stops for > > > > > > those objects. > > > > > > > This is another case where you think you've read something, but you > > > > > > can't quite put your finger on it to check to see if it's right.. > > > > > > > > Mitch Raemsch > > > > > > Well then. Can you disprove the fact that Special Relativity spells > > > > > out the motion law I am refering to? I know now that you are not as > > > > > smart as you look. > > > > > Mitch, let me see if I have this right. You feel free to pull a dim > > > > recollection of something you think you saw somewhere, and you will > > > > insist that it is so until someone proves to you otherwise? This seems > > > > like an easy way to keep people busy, with you making half-assed > > > > conjectures and demanding rigorous and documented responses in return. > > > > > How about if I meet you halfway? In order to convince you that what I > > > > say is right, I will not expect you to believe anything I say, but > > > > instead I will have to refer to a place where it is printed in black > > > > and white. In return, you will have to actually go find the book or > > > > reference where I point to, and you will actually have to read what is > > > > written there. And if what I say is backed up in the documentation I > > > > say is there, then you will correct your dim recollection and withdraw > > > > your half-assed conjecture. > > > > > Does this seem fair? > > > > > PD- Hide quoted text - > > > > > - Show quoted text - > > > > That infinite red shift at an event horizon proves the fact that GR > > > predicts light speed fall there. > > > No sir. That is gravitational redshift, > > Is not fall gravitational? Yes, but infinite redshift due to gravitation does not mean infinite redshift due to reaching c. The two are different. The first can happen without the second happening. Need a recommendation on something to read? > > t speed-associated red- > > > shift. Two completely different phenomena. > > > You are making stuff up out of thin air, grabbing thin wisps and > > trying to put them together. How about actually reading something? > > > > What about the even greater gravity > > > inside? > > > > There is no way around it. > > > > Mitch Raemsch- Hide quoted text - > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > - Show quoted text - > >
From: BURT on 23 Apr 2010 17:38 On Apr 23, 2:31 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Apr 23, 4:29 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 2:14 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > On Apr 23, 4:07 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > On Apr 23, 2:03 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > On Apr 23, 3:35 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 1:29 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 3:15 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Do you have trouble with the motion law that says time will stop if > > > > > > > > you reach the speed of light? This is validated by black hole event > > > > > > > > horizons. > > > > > > > > There is no motion law that says that time will stop if you reach the > > > > > > > speed of light, because nothing that ever went less than the speed of > > > > > > > light can reach the speed of light, and therefore time never stops for > > > > > > > those objects. > > > > > > > > This is another case where you think you've read something, but you > > > > > > > can't quite put your finger on it to check to see if it's right. > > > > > > > > > Mitch Raemsch > > > > > > > Well then. Can you disprove the fact that Special Relativity spells > > > > > > out the motion law I am refering to? I know now that you are not as > > > > > > smart as you look. > > > > > > Mitch, let me see if I have this right. You feel free to pull a dim > > > > > recollection of something you think you saw somewhere, and you will > > > > > insist that it is so until someone proves to you otherwise? This seems > > > > > like an easy way to keep people busy, with you making half-assed > > > > > conjectures and demanding rigorous and documented responses in return. > > > > > > How about if I meet you halfway? In order to convince you that what I > > > > > say is right, I will not expect you to believe anything I say, but > > > > > instead I will have to refer to a place where it is printed in black > > > > > and white. In return, you will have to actually go find the book or > > > > > reference where I point to, and you will actually have to read what is > > > > > written there. And if what I say is backed up in the documentation I > > > > > say is there, then you will correct your dim recollection and withdraw > > > > > your half-assed conjecture. > > > > > > Does this seem fair? > > > > > > PD- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > - Show quoted text - > > > > > That infinite red shift at an event horizon proves the fact that GR > > > > predicts light speed fall there. > > > > No sir. That is gravitational redshift, > > > Is not fall gravitational? > > Yes, but infinite redshift due to gravitation does not mean infinite > redshift due to reaching c. The two are different. The first can > happen without the second happening. > > Need a recommendation on something to read? > > > > > > > t speed-associated red- > > > > shift. Two completely different phenomena. > > > > You are making stuff up out of thin air, grabbing thin wisps and > > > trying to put them together. How about actually reading something? > > > > > What about the even greater gravity > > > > inside? > > > > > There is no way around it. > > > > > Mitch Raemsch- Hide quoted text - > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - Infinite red shift means time has ended in theory and there is light fall gravity. They go hand in hand. Mitch Raemsch
From: PD on 23 Apr 2010 17:42 On Apr 23, 4:38 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > On Apr 23, 2:31 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Apr 23, 4:29 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > On Apr 23, 2:14 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Apr 23, 4:07 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > On Apr 23, 2:03 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 3:35 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 1:29 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 3:15 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Do you have trouble with the motion law that says time will stop if > > > > > > > > > you reach the speed of light? This is validated by black hole event > > > > > > > > > horizons. > > > > > > > > > There is no motion law that says that time will stop if you reach the > > > > > > > > speed of light, because nothing that ever went less than the speed of > > > > > > > > light can reach the speed of light, and therefore time never stops for > > > > > > > > those objects. > > > > > > > > > This is another case where you think you've read something, but you > > > > > > > > can't quite put your finger on it to check to see if it's right. > > > > > > > > > > Mitch Raemsch > > > > > > > > Well then. Can you disprove the fact that Special Relativity spells > > > > > > > out the motion law I am refering to? I know now that you are not as > > > > > > > smart as you look. > > > > > > > Mitch, let me see if I have this right. You feel free to pull a dim > > > > > > recollection of something you think you saw somewhere, and you will > > > > > > insist that it is so until someone proves to you otherwise? This seems > > > > > > like an easy way to keep people busy, with you making half-assed > > > > > > conjectures and demanding rigorous and documented responses in return. > > > > > > > How about if I meet you halfway? In order to convince you that what I > > > > > > say is right, I will not expect you to believe anything I say, but > > > > > > instead I will have to refer to a place where it is printed in black > > > > > > and white. In return, you will have to actually go find the book or > > > > > > reference where I point to, and you will actually have to read what is > > > > > > written there. And if what I say is backed up in the documentation I > > > > > > say is there, then you will correct your dim recollection and withdraw > > > > > > your half-assed conjecture. > > > > > > > Does this seem fair? > > > > > > > PD- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > > - Show quoted text - > > > > > > That infinite red shift at an event horizon proves the fact that GR > > > > > predicts light speed fall there. > > > > > No sir. That is gravitational redshift, > > > > Is not fall gravitational? > > > Yes, but infinite redshift due to gravitation does not mean infinite > > redshift due to reaching c. The two are different. The first can > > happen without the second happening. > > > Need a recommendation on something to read? > > > > t speed-associated red- > > > > > shift. Two completely different phenomena. > > > > > You are making stuff up out of thin air, grabbing thin wisps and > > > > trying to put them together. How about actually reading something? > > > > > > What about the even greater gravity > > > > > inside? > > > > > > There is no way around it. > > > > > > Mitch Raemsch- Hide quoted text - > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > - Show quoted text - > > Infinite red shift means time has ended in theory and there is light > fall gravity. They go hand in hand. No, time does not end at the event horizon, even though red shift gets infinite there. This is another misstatement on your part. Something that falls through the event horizon will have its clock continue ticking as though nothing happened. You can read Thorne's book on that. He explains it nicely. > > Mitch Raemsch
From: BURT on 23 Apr 2010 17:45 On Apr 23, 2:31 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Apr 23, 4:29 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 2:14 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > On Apr 23, 4:07 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > On Apr 23, 2:03 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > On Apr 23, 3:35 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 1:29 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 3:15 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Do you have trouble with the motion law that says time will stop if > > > > > > > > you reach the speed of light? This is validated by black hole event > > > > > > > > horizons. > > > > > > > > There is no motion law that says that time will stop if you reach the > > > > > > > speed of light, because nothing that ever went less than the speed of > > > > > > > light can reach the speed of light, and therefore time never stops for > > > > > > > those objects. > > > > > > > > This is another case where you think you've read something, but you > > > > > > > can't quite put your finger on it to check to see if it's right. > > > > > > > > > Mitch Raemsch > > > > > > > Well then. Can you disprove the fact that Special Relativity spells > > > > > > out the motion law I am refering to? I know now that you are not as > > > > > > smart as you look. > > > > > > Mitch, let me see if I have this right. You feel free to pull a dim > > > > > recollection of something you think you saw somewhere, and you will > > > > > insist that it is so until someone proves to you otherwise? This seems > > > > > like an easy way to keep people busy, with you making half-assed > > > > > conjectures and demanding rigorous and documented responses in return. > > > > > > How about if I meet you halfway? In order to convince you that what I > > > > > say is right, I will not expect you to believe anything I say, but > > > > > instead I will have to refer to a place where it is printed in black > > > > > and white. In return, you will have to actually go find the book or > > > > > reference where I point to, and you will actually have to read what is > > > > > written there. And if what I say is backed up in the documentation I > > > > > say is there, then you will correct your dim recollection and withdraw > > > > > your half-assed conjecture. > > > > > > Does this seem fair? > > > > > > PD- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > - Show quoted text - > > > > > That infinite red shift at an event horizon proves the fact that GR > > > > predicts light speed fall there. > > > > No sir. That is gravitational redshift, > > > Is not fall gravitational? > > Yes, but infinite redshift due to gravitation does not mean infinite > redshift due to reaching c. The two are different. The first can > happen without the second happening. > > Need a recommendation on something to read? > > > > > > > t speed-associated red- > > > > shift. Two completely different phenomena. How are they different? A black hole is always maximum gravity. You cannot get rid of light speed falling for it. This is the disproof of the extreme of gravity. Mitch Raemsch > > > > You are making stuff up out of thin air, grabbing thin wisps and > > > trying to put them together. How about actually reading something? > > > > > What about the even greater gravity > > > > inside? > > > > > There is no way around it. > > > > > Mitch Raemsch- Hide quoted text - > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text -
From: PD on 23 Apr 2010 17:57
On Apr 23, 4:45 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > On Apr 23, 2:31 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Apr 23, 4:29 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > On Apr 23, 2:14 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Apr 23, 4:07 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > On Apr 23, 2:03 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 3:35 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 1:29 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Apr 23, 3:15 pm, BURT <macromi...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Do you have trouble with the motion law that says time will stop if > > > > > > > > > you reach the speed of light? This is validated by black hole event > > > > > > > > > horizons. > > > > > > > > > There is no motion law that says that time will stop if you reach the > > > > > > > > speed of light, because nothing that ever went less than the speed of > > > > > > > > light can reach the speed of light, and therefore time never stops for > > > > > > > > those objects. > > > > > > > > > This is another case where you think you've read something, but you > > > > > > > > can't quite put your finger on it to check to see if it's right. > > > > > > > > > > Mitch Raemsch > > > > > > > > Well then. Can you disprove the fact that Special Relativity spells > > > > > > > out the motion law I am refering to? I know now that you are not as > > > > > > > smart as you look. > > > > > > > Mitch, let me see if I have this right. You feel free to pull a dim > > > > > > recollection of something you think you saw somewhere, and you will > > > > > > insist that it is so until someone proves to you otherwise? This seems > > > > > > like an easy way to keep people busy, with you making half-assed > > > > > > conjectures and demanding rigorous and documented responses in return. > > > > > > > How about if I meet you halfway? In order to convince you that what I > > > > > > say is right, I will not expect you to believe anything I say, but > > > > > > instead I will have to refer to a place where it is printed in black > > > > > > and white. In return, you will have to actually go find the book or > > > > > > reference where I point to, and you will actually have to read what is > > > > > > written there. And if what I say is backed up in the documentation I > > > > > > say is there, then you will correct your dim recollection and withdraw > > > > > > your half-assed conjecture. > > > > > > > Does this seem fair? > > > > > > > PD- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > > - Show quoted text - > > > > > > That infinite red shift at an event horizon proves the fact that GR > > > > > predicts light speed fall there. > > > > > No sir. That is gravitational redshift, > > > > Is not fall gravitational? > > > Yes, but infinite redshift due to gravitation does not mean infinite > > redshift due to reaching c. The two are different. The first can > > happen without the second happening. > > > Need a recommendation on something to read? > > > > t speed-associated red- > > > > > shift. Two completely different phenomena. > > How are they different? A black hole is always maximum gravity. You > cannot get rid of light speed falling for it. This is the disproof of > the extreme of gravity. Sorry, Mitch, but half-assed conclusions based on dim recollections and stringing together wisps of information don't make disproofs of anything. Try reading. You could try Thorne's book, since you tried citing it earlier. Do you have it? > > Mitch Raemsch > > > > > > > You are making stuff up out of thin air, grabbing thin wisps and > > > > trying to put them together. How about actually reading something? > > > > > > What about the even greater gravity > > > > > inside? > > > > > > There is no way around it. > > > > > > Mitch Raemsch- Hide quoted text - > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > - Show quoted text - > > |