C128 RGBI Electrical Characteristics
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From: MagerValp on 7 Oct 2006 09:43 >>>>> "a" == a7yvm109gf5d1 <a7yvm109gf5d1(a)netzero.com> writes: a> Then when the LCDs started getting popular, there was no real a> reason to sync down there, nobody was sourcing 15KHz that much, a> except for video. I do have a 3M LCD projector panel that syncs a> down to that, but it is a rare device. Actually, it's not rare at all. Many projector companies sell adapters that lets you hook up 15 kHz RGB video to the VGA or component inputs. They're probably only marketed in Europe, as RGB is common here, but the projectors are identical in US and Europe. LCD monitors and TVs use the same circuitry, so it often works with those as well. As Jukka said, it's just down to the firmware these days. -- ___ . . . . . + . . o _|___|_ + . + . + . Per Olofsson, arkadspelare o-o . . . o + MagerValp(a)cling.gu.se - + + . http://www.cling.gu.se/~cl3polof/
From: Joseph Fenn on 7 Oct 2006 16:15 On Sat, 7 Oct 2006, MagerValp wrote: >>>>>> "JA" == Jukka Aho <jukka.aho(a)iki.fi> writes: > > JA> The OP says he's not sure how to go about building such converter > JA> and if its output should be a) VGA, b) s-video, or c) component > JA> video. MagerValp comments on this by remarking that "RGB -> > JA> component video" (i.e. option "c", not option "b", which was > JA> s-video!) should be simple. > > S-video is called S-video or Y/C. I don't think I've ever seen anyone > refer to it as component video - not even the old video stuff in our > studio from the late 70s and early 80s. > > a> The main problem with that approach is that you are still driving a > a> television at the end of the day. > > JA> Depends. The OP said he'd like information about building "a color > JA> interface between C128 80 column RGBI output and a modern flat > JA> panel monitor." That sounds like a PC LCD/TFT monitor to me, not a > JA> TV. > > Indeed. > > JA> But admittedly, he then mentioned VGA signal, s-video signal, and > JA> component signal, of which the latter two are usually only > JA> available on tv sets, not PC monitors. > > Lots of PC monitors also have composite/s-video and even component > inputs. Not that it matters of course - it's the same technology, > regardless of if it's marketed as a TV or PC monitor. > > As for the original posters problem, I'll bet $5 that a simple RGBI -> > RGB adapter and a cheap scart to component adapter will give him a > nice, clear RGB picture on his monitor. > > I'll take that bet and raise you to $1000 it cant be done for a C128 80 Col NTSC. thats is C=vga!!!!! Its been dont in UK for Pal but no success in doing it with NTSC to date. Joe
From: Joseph Fenn on 7 Oct 2006 16:19 On Sat, 7 Oct 2006, MagerValp wrote: >>>>>> "J" == JohnH <john(a)jrcc.net> writes: > > J> In a perfect world, I'd like to get 80 Column RGBI (VDC) output in > J> color on this monitor. If component is the easiest way to go, I'm > J> all for it. Honestly, I probably don't know enough to grasp the > J> difficulties in this. > > Basically, it's most likely not difficult. > > J> Am I correct in under standing that I could convert the RGBI output > J> to SCART and then convert the SCART to Component (RGB, 3 RCA > J> Jacks)? > > SCART is just a connector, carrying sound, composite video, and analog > RGB (and possibly S-Video as well). The benefits of doing RGBI -> > SCART is that you can use a ready-made SCART -> Component adapter, > which will convert the sync signal from separate H+V to composite sync > for you. You could just do RGBI -> Component straight away, if you > don't doing a little extra work yourself (or your friend's self in > this case :) > > This is all based on the assumption that the Dell monitor will accept > an analog RGB signal on its component input connectors. My experience, > though limited, says it will, and google seems to agree with me > (there's a reason you can pick up RGB -> Component adapters in every > HiFi store :). > > If it doesn't work, the next thing I'd try is an RGBI -> VGA cable. > Not scan rate conversion mind you, just bring down the signals to 0.7 > Vpp. The monitor specs claim that it only handles 31 kHz and up, but > I've seen several monitors that happily accept a 15 kHz signal. > > Now if neither of these two work, things get complicated, and your > friend will have to work a bit for his money... :) > > J> BTW, the 2407WFP is an awesome monitor. It allows me to do split > J> screen and picture-in-picture views of 8-bits on the composite or > J> S-Video ports and my Wintel PC on the VGA port. This is useful for > J> referencing online docs while working with the 8-bit. > > Ooh, nice. No way can it be done with NTSC protocol. At least no one has succeeded to date! Pal yes it exists. NTSC negativeo Joe
From: silverdr on 8 Oct 2006 15:45 Jukka Aho wrote: >> Composite: Composed of two or more parts. >> Component: Composed of seperate parts. S-video is a component system. >> Please describe how the color is encoded. >> >> I think I was talking only about s-video. If I got confused, sorry. > > > Now you're just being silly. Hey, why so strong? > As far as common video terminology usage > goes, "component video" is generally only used for YPbPr, YUV, or YIQ > signals. RGB, for example, is every bit as "component" as YPbPr, but it > isn't usually called that in normal parlance. S-video is somewhere > halfway between "component video" and "composite video" since it sends > the luma part of the signal separately but both color components down > the same wire (and requires a color burst as a reference for separating > them from each other, which the "real" component video signal formats > don't need.) It's all true but I know many people (including myself) who often used the term "component" for Y/C aka s-video. Just to differentiante it from the "composite" and noone got confused about it as long as everyone knew what was being talked about. A matter of common frame of reference.
From: silverdr on 8 Oct 2006 16:03
Joseph Fenn wrote: >> >> J> BTW, the 2407WFP is an awesome monitor. It allows me to do split >> J> screen and picture-in-picture views of 8-bits on the composite or >> J> S-Video ports and my Wintel PC on the VGA port. This is useful for >> J> referencing online docs while working with the 8-bit. >> >> Ooh, nice. > > No way can it be done with NTSC protocol. At least no one has > succeeded to date! Pal yes it exists. NTSC negativeo Hm, interesting. Why? Both types of signals have to get very much "refactored" before they can get displayed on the LCD so one may wonder what's wrong with NTSC in that case. |