Canon i860 printer 3e ink empty in few hours
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From: Michael J Davis on 21 Nov 2008 06:14 IntergalacticExpandingPanda <intergalacticexpandingpanda(a)hotmail.com> was inspired to say >On Nov 20, 12:28 pm, " Amy Moore" <no.s...(a)microsoft.com> wrote: >> ">> I hate to break it to you but without test equipment, the best you can >> > do is throw replacement parts at it, until the problem is resolved. >> > Powersupply, logicboard, printhead, as well as a number of other misc >> > parts. You can talk to Canon if you wish to see if they can resolve >> > the issue, or if there is a warranty plan you can buy into to fix your >> > printer, but given you have an extra 120-150ml of ink in your printer >> > above and beyond what normally goes in there, 4 oz of extra liquid, >> > you're looking at the possiblity of an overflow. >> >> Our tach guys opened three i860 Canon printers and compare any differences. >> None found. They showed me the white ceramic pieces where the head parked. >> After watch these pads is clean. >> Our tech guys talk to Canon. Not much come of it. > >If you are losing ink where the ink pad is parked, then, near as I'm >aware it goes into the waste pad. You have to really disassemble the >i860 to get at the waste pads. >http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=308 > >It's designed to funnel ink to the waste pad. You print >borderless,ink goes to the foam which has holes which go to the waste >pad. You prime the head, waste ink goes to the pad. You clean your >heads, it goes to the waste pad. If you cartridgeThere are those who >estimate 500ml of ink in their pads, but I highly doubt if the waste >pad area can hold that much. I'd buy 250ml though most likely 170ml >which seems to be on par with Canon's 1700 number for waste pad >fullness. > >Obviously if your tech guys have the technical skill to replace the >waste pad, well, no worries. If they don't you have 120-150ml extra >ink in your waste pad, 120-150ml that is not detected in the printer's >memory. > >This is coming from a person who would keep that printer in service >even if maintenance cost was 1/2 the value of a new printer. > >The mp610 jumped up in price on the Canon E-store to $180-$200 but is >still available from Amazon.com for $130. The mp530, the low end fax >model, is $99 from amazon.com. Unless you can replace the waste pads >on your own, it's highly advisable you replace the unit if for nothing >else but the waste pads, but there is an unresolved issue with it >guzzling OEM ink, something that really shouldn't happen that quickly >since gravity doesn't work "that" quickly, not with a new OEM >cartridge, and not very likely with 6 OEM new cartridges. The ONLY >way this might happen is if it was refilled and the refiller botched >the job and left a large hole at the top. Then it might drain in 4 >hours, but you would be able to see the cartridge actually leak before >you put it in. Just to add that if it's anything like my Canon S9000, it will stop working when the wastepads are full. I had to search the internet for instructions to change it, couldn't then, find a replacement, so washed it out and dried it (even that took days - and I scorched it trying to speed it up!) - it was a really messy process and used lots of water! Subsequently I found a supplier on the internet and have bought two for next time. Frankly, for commercial use, I'd buy a new printer! Mike -- Michael J Davis <Please note that the Reply-To: address will remain in use for at least 30 days, but the sender and from addresses are not valid.> <><
From: Amy Moore on 21 Nov 2008 11:29 "IntergalacticExpandingPanda" <intergalacticexpandingpanda(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message news:4df39780-5860-40b1-aa5a-dd1c45447ba1(a)o4g2000pra.googlegroups.com... > If you are losing ink where the ink pad is parked, then, near as I'm > aware it goes into the waste pad. You have to really disassemble the > i860 to get at the waste pads. > http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=308 > > It's designed to funnel ink to the waste pad. You print > borderless,ink goes to the foam which has holes which go to the waste > pad. You prime the head, waste ink goes to the pad. You clean your > heads, it goes to the waste pad. If you cartridgeThere are those who > estimate 500ml of ink in their pads, but I highly doubt if the waste > pad area can hold that much. I'd buy 250ml though most likely 170ml > which seems to be on par with Canon's 1700 number for waste pad > fullness. Wow, thanks. That is an eye opener for our tech support people. Yes, you are right. Our techs never openned the bottom of the Canon printer units. Well, that pretty much tell us where all the ink went. Is there anyway to stop the ink from leaking? Should we remove the ink cartridges everything we stop printing?
From: Michael J Davis on 21 Nov 2008 12:08 Amy Moore <no.spam(a)microsoft.com> was inspired to say >"IntergalacticExpandingPanda" <intergalacticexpandingpanda(a)hotmail.com> >wrote in message >news:4df39780-5860-40b1-aa5a-dd1c45447ba1(a)o4g2000pra.googlegroups.com... >> If you are losing ink where the ink pad is parked, then, near as I'm >> aware it goes into the waste pad. You have to really disassemble the >> i860 to get at the waste pads. >> http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=308 >> >> It's designed to funnel ink to the waste pad. You print >> borderless,ink goes to the foam which has holes which go to the waste >> pad. You prime the head, waste ink goes to the pad. You clean your >> heads, it goes to the waste pad. If you cartridgeThere are those who >> estimate 500ml of ink in their pads, but I highly doubt if the waste >> pad area can hold that much. I'd buy 250ml though most likely 170ml >> which seems to be on par with Canon's 1700 number for waste pad >> fullness. > >Wow, thanks. That is an eye opener for our tech support people. >Yes, you are right. Our techs never openned the bottom of the Canon >printer units. > I already told you my experience re Canon S9000, but you may find some other answers on this site (my bookmark given as it's got some overlap with yours):- http://www.fixyourownprinter.com/forums/inkjet/15805 >Well, that pretty much tell us where all the ink went. >Is there anyway to stop the ink from leaking? >Should we remove the ink cartridges everything we stop printing? My ignorant guess is that the cap that stops the heads from leaking in the parked position isn't closing properly. If you remove the cartridges you may find all that happens is that the head dries out. Sorry. Mike -- Michael J Davis <Please note that the Reply-To: address will remain in use for at least 30 days, but the sender and from addresses are not valid.> <><
From: IntergalacticExpandingPanda on 21 Nov 2008 20:42 On Nov 21, 8:29 am, " Amy Moore" <no.s...(a)microsoft.com> wrote: > Wow, thanks. That is an eye opener for our tech support people. > Yes, you are right. Our techs never openned the bottom of the Canon printer > units. > > Well, that pretty much tell us where all the ink went. > Is there anyway to stop the ink from leaking? > Should we remove the ink cartridges everything we stop printing? The way canon manages the issue is it keeps track of everytime you swap printheads, every time you clean the cartridge, every time you do a borderless print and get "some" overspray. Even if you don't clean the heads your self, the ip4000 is on a timmer where the big black, if you don't print with in like 24 hours, it spews like a 1/14 a ml into the diaper. Color you can ignore for 3 days but that too spews like 1/30ml into the diaper. This all adds up. Canon isn't the "worst" nor the "best" in terms of waste. On the ip4000 this value is 1700, but I don't know what this means in terms of grams or ml, but obviously 1700 is an early warning before overflow is an issue. But whatever the current fullness of the printer is, you have an extra 120-150ml in the diaper that isn't on the printers odometer. The only resolution is to replace the diaper. You can find a i860 service manual to get instructions on how to do this. You can either order new waste pads, or clean the existing pads. If you have a support staff that can do this, great. Most cases the printer is simply replaced, and the old one ends up at Goodwill. On some printers, it's possible to fit an external waste tank. Epsons for example use a pump to get the ink from the printhead to the waste pad. It's trivial to take that tube and put it in a bottle. You will still have extra ink from borderless printing, but in contrast this is trivial. Epsons are more wasteful with ink. A Canon in contrast assuming normal operation, can go years without the waste pad warning, and even then you can often get away with ignoring the warning and resetting the printer once. You should NOT remove the cartridges on everything when you stop printing, not unless you are willing to also take out the printhead, cap it, bag it with a piece of wet paper towel, and store it. on the ip4000 you lose .45g black and 1.5g color priming the head. This is roughly equal to the automatic cleaning cycle on the ip4000 after you don't print for 14-45 days, though only 1g of color is used. After 90 days black auto cleaning uses 1.58g. Color cleaning does not exceed 1g on the ip4000 unless you replace the head. If this is a standard office environment where printing is daily during the week, you only lose .14g/week directly into the pad, or 7.28g/year, and that's not using the printer on the weekends. This could be higher if you skip days without printing, but this value will not exceed 25.2g for black, that presumes you print once every two days though out the year. A greater loss would be printing only once every 2 weeks, where you lose 16.2black and 26g color / year. AFAIK this is the highest rate of waste ink, as the next step up is 45 days where .78g black and 1g color are used per cleaning, where a max of 6.24g black and 8 g color could be used. You see where I'm going with this. Normal use results in some waste, use only twice a month results in high waste, less than once a month results in medium waste. 120-150ml , presuming 1g=1ml, we talking 3-5 years of medium to high waste, not measured on the odometer. Waste ink is normal, and the printer gives more than adequate warning when the waste tank is full. By the time it is full, under normal conditions, you've enjoyed years of faithful service and have to ask if you want to service the printer or replace it, or ignore the error and you might be able to get away with it. The printer needs its waste pad changed at this point, plus there is the existing issue yearly waste daily. You need test equipment or field replacements to troubleshoot the issue, and failure to troubleshoot results in $15 of waste ink going to the diaper, presuming you lose 20-25ml every 4 hours. [mp530] http://www.amazon.com/Canon-Pixma-Office-Inkjet-Printer/dp/B000GUO4L0/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1227317294&sr=8-1# $100 shipped from Amazon.com An all in one fax unit with the same text resolution and higher photo resolution will be cheaper. CD printing optional. [mp610] http://www.amazon.com/Canon-Pixma-Inkjet-Printer-2180B002/dp/B000V2MK00/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1227317342&sr=1-1# $130 will get you an all in one unit that's only 17.7 inches wide, card slots, larger print head, color LCD screen, and a whole ton of features odds are you won't use. CD printing optional. This printer is more quiet, and faster in most operations except 4x6 printing, and cheaper to operate then the new ip4600. [mx700] http://estore.usa.canon.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CategoryDisplay?catalogId=10051&storeId=10051&categoryId=12153&langId=-1&parent_category_rn=12054&top_category=12054&pageView= $130 shipped from Canon. This is a beast but does sport network. Color resolution would be on par with your current i860, as with text. There is NO improvement with this model, except it's a good deal larger and has a network jack and fax support. CD printing is not an option. [mp960] http://estore.usa.canon.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CategoryDisplay?catalogId=10051&storeId=10051&categoryId=17251&langId=-1&parent_category_rn=12054&top_category=12054&pageView=&subCat=Y This printer takes 7 cartridges and isn't really recommended if your application is just text printing. Photo printing it offers an edge over the the current ip4600, and well is only $100 shipped. It's a referb, only a 3 month warranty, but at 1/3 the price many can live with that. Unless you are willing to service the printer, which might include buying an extended warranty from Canon, paying for service by someone who has a clue about canons, replacement is recommended.
From: IntergalacticExpandingPanda on 21 Nov 2008 20:53
On Nov 21, 9:08 am, Michael J Davis <mjduse...(a)trustsof.co.uk> wrote: > My ignorant guess is that the cap that stops the heads from leaking in > the parked position isn't closing properly. If you remove the cartridges > you may find all that happens is that the head dries out. Sorry. That's a good guess, but IIRC the cartridge drains in under a day. If you take your average canon tank, open it, and leave it exposed to air, it doesn't drain that quickly on it's own, and putting it on a printhead with 320 20-30pl holes (6.4 nano liters per drip). If the rate of ink loss is greater with the print cartridge not installed, odds are high it's an electronic problem where the ink is firing away while the printer is not printing. But obviously the cartridge is designed to not leak, and they typically don't unless the vent holes are enlarged. But in all honesty I've never tried to ignore a full print cartridge to see how fast it leaks without being installed. |