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From: Lew on 14 Feb 2010 18:39
Lew wrote:
>> Clearly Java must be feminine, as she's the one who changed her family
>> name when the marriage happened.

Tom Anderson wrote:
> Now there's an assumption and a half! Java could well be feminine and
> traditional, but could also be masculine and modern. A male friend of
> mine is planning to adopt his fiancee's surname when they marry.

You could call it an assumption. I call it playing the odds. Your
(putatively) male friend is in a decided minority.

If you find out that someone changed their family name to their spouse's upon
marriage, without any further information, and had to place a bet on the
gender of that person, you are far, far more likely to win if you bet that the
person is female.

So until you provide evidence to the contrary, I'll go with Java née Sun.

Although the Oracle of Delphi was female. Hmm.

--
Lew
From: Alessio Stalla on 16 Feb 2010 06:24
On Feb 15, 12:39 am, Lew <no...(a)lewscanon.com> wrote:
> Lew wrote:
> >> Clearly Java must be feminine, as she's the one who changed her family
> >> name when the marriage happened.
> Tom Anderson wrote:
> > Now there's an assumption and a half! Java could well be feminine and
> > traditional, but could also be masculine and modern. A male friend of
> > mine is planning to adopt his fiancee's surname when they marry.
>
> You could call it an assumption.  I call it playing the odds.  Your
> (putatively) male friend is in a decided minority.
>
> If you find out that someone changed their family name to their spouse's upon
> marriage, without any further information, and had to place a bet on the
> gender of that person, you are far, far more likely to win if you bet that the
> person is female.
>
> So until you provide evidence to the contrary, I'll go with Java née Sun.
>
> Although the Oracle of Delphi was female.  Hmm.

Italian has masculine/feminine gender distinctions for nouns and
adjectives, too.
Now Java is a programming language, and language ("linguaggio") is
male in Italian.
But Java is an island, too, and island ("isola") is female...
And Oracle ("oracolo") is male, even if there are female oracles, like
the Oracle of Delphi.

I wonder if in French it is so messy... ;)

> --
> Lew

From: Thomas Pornin on 16 Feb 2010 07:37
According to Alessio Stalla <alessiostalla(a)gmail.com>:
> Italian has masculine/feminine gender distinctions for nouns and
> adjectives, too.
> Now Java is a programming language, and language ("linguaggio") is
> male in Italian.
> But Java is an island, too, and island ("isola") is female...
> And Oracle ("oracolo") is male, even if there are female oracles, like
> the Oracle of Delphi.
>
> I wonder if in French it is so messy... ;)

In French, genders are the same than in Italian for these nouns. It does
not feel messy at all. French does not have a neutral gender, so every
single noun is either masculine or feminine (with a few odd idiomatic
exceptions such as "gens" ["people"], which is feminine on the left and
masculine on the right, and "amour" ["love"], which switches gender when
made plural -- an everlasting source of jokes for bored linguists after
too alcoholic a meal). When all inanimate objects have a gender, the
endless american debates on how to avoid sexism in speach tend to look a
bit ridiculous.

In everyday talk between programmers, programming languages, including
Java, are masculine, and nobody finds it the slightest odd.

Also, French law makes it legal for the husband to use his wife's name,
if he wishes so.


--Thomas Pornin
From: Robert Klemme on 19 Feb 2010 12:32
On 16.02.2010 13:37, Thomas Pornin wrote:
> According to Alessio Stalla<alessiostalla(a)gmail.com>:
>> Italian has masculine/feminine gender distinctions for nouns and
>> adjectives, too.
>> Now Java is a programming language, and language ("linguaggio") is
>> male in Italian.
>> But Java is an island, too, and island ("isola") is female...
>> And Oracle ("oracolo") is male, even if there are female oracles, like
>> the Oracle of Delphi.
>>
>> I wonder if in French it is so messy... ;)
>
> In French, genders are the same than in Italian for these nouns. It does
> not feel messy at all. French does not have a neutral gender, so every
> single noun is either masculine or feminine (with a few odd idiomatic
> exceptions such as "gens" ["people"], which is feminine on the left and
> masculine on the right, and "amour" ["love"], which switches gender when
> made plural -- an everlasting source of jokes for bored linguists after
> too alcoholic a meal). When all inanimate objects have a gender, the
> endless american debates on how to avoid sexism in speach tend to look a
> bit ridiculous.
>
> In everyday talk between programmers, programming languages, including
> Java, are masculine, and nobody finds it the slightest odd.
>
> Also, French law makes it legal for the husband to use his wife's name,
> if he wishes so.

May I throw in another language? In German we have masculine, feminine
and neuter. Also, I believe not the oracle was male or female: the
voices of the oracle were female. Which gives a certain indication as
to the gender of Python. But what does it tell us about the gender of
PL/SQL? In German coffee is male so Java might be male as well...

robert

--
remember.guy do |as, often| as.you_can - without end
http://blog.rubybestpractices.com/
From: Mike Schilling on 19 Feb 2010 12:36
Robert Klemme wrote:
> May I throw in another language? In German we have masculine,
> feminine and neuter. Also, I believe not the oracle was male or
> female: the voices of the oracle were female. Which gives a certain
> indication as to the gender of Python. But what does it tell us
> about the gender of PL/SQL? In German coffee is male so Java might
> be male as well...

Though if you created a subset of Java, say for teaching children to
program, it would be neuter, assuming it's called Javalein or Javachen.


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