Discharging a lithium-ion battery, what is the third wire for?
in [Basics]
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From: John Doe on 19 Dec 2009 19:23 I have some Bosch BAT411 lithium-ion 10.8 V batteries. One of the tools is a flashlight. It includes a small circuit board between the battery and the light bulb. The battery plug has three wires. I realize that lithium-ion batteries use regulation when charging, but what is the third contact for when the battery is being used? Thanks.
From: larwe on 19 Dec 2009 21:40 On Dec 19, 7:23 pm, John Doe <j...(a)usenetlove.invalid> wrote: > I realize that lithium-ion batteries use regulation when charging, > but what is the third contact for when the battery is being used? Thermal sensor, most likely.
From: krw on 20 Dec 2009 11:43 On Sat, 19 Dec 2009 18:40:15 -0800 (PST), larwe <zwsdotcom(a)gmail.com> wrote: >On Dec 19, 7:23�pm, John Doe <j...(a)usenetlove.invalid> wrote: > >> I realize that lithium-ion batteries use regulation when charging, >> but what is the third contact for when the battery is being used? > >Thermal sensor, most likely. With a LIon battery it's likely an HDQ interface port.
From: Clint Sharp on 22 Dec 2009 04:19 In message <00ac1a4d$0$12992$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com>, John Doe <jdoe(a)usenetlove.invalid> writes >Clint Sharp <clint clintsmc.demon.co.uk> wrote: >> First hit on Google for HDQ interface tells you. JFGI. > >In other words, you do not know either... Well, frankly, no, I didn't but 10 seconds work with Google and I'd found a document that explained enough for me to have a good idea what HDQ meant in the context of Lithium batteries. Took less time to find out than it did for you to start a flame war. > >The only chip in the small circuit between the battery and the >light bulb is a voltage reference (TL431 I think). Doubt it's a TL431. Doubt it's a voltage reference at all. More likely a temperature sensor or even a simple fuel gauge IC. > So the output >of that third pin is not some streaming data signal. It must be >either a simple voltage level or a digital 1/0. Or, perhaps, if it's a digital I/O it could be a streaming data signal? > >Here is the first paragraph from the first "HDQ interface" hit >on Google. > >TI: HDQ communication basics This report compares the >communication timing specifications for the different battery gas >gauge and battery monitor products. It discusses some of the >interface requirements necessary for robust HDQ communication, >such as the need for a break prior to each communication, how to >reliably read 16bit dynamic values over the 8bit bus, and the need >for some noise filtering on the HDQ line. It also discusses the >firmware strategy required for implementing the HDQ interface >using a discrete I/O port and describes the popular option of >using a UART to handle the HDQ bit timing requirement... Good oh, so you do know how to use Google. Perhaps next time instead of spending time abusing people trying to help you, you might consider trying it out. FWIW, that paragraph tells you enough about HDQ for you to realise it's likely not what's on your battery unless it's got a *very* smart charger. Season's greetings, perhaps you could let some of the spirit of the season infuse you with some goodwill towards fellow men? -- Clint Sharp
From: John Doe on 22 Dec 2009 05:33
Clint Sharp <clint clintsmc.demon.co.uk> wrote: > John Doe <jdoe usenetlove.invalid> writes >> Clint Sharp <clint clintsmc.demon.co.uk> wrote: >>> First hit on Google for HDQ interface tells you. JFGI. >> In other words, you do not know either... > Well, frankly, no, I didn't but 10 seconds work with Google and > I'd found a document that explained enough for me to have a good > idea what HDQ meant in the context of Lithium batteries. And did you figure out that it has nothing to do with this thread? > Took less time to find out than it did for you to start a flame > war. Your mother started a flame war, Linthead. >> The only chip in the small circuit between the battery and the >> light bulb is a voltage reference (TL431 I think). > Doubt it's a TL431. Doubt it's a voltage reference at all. More > likely a temperature sensor or even a simple fuel gauge IC. More likely you are just a troll, Linthead. I used a digital microscope, it has "431" printed on it, it is a three pin surface mount device, and "Google" will tell you that they are used in current regulation circuits. >> So the output of that third pin is not some streaming data >> signal. It must be either a simple voltage level or a digital >> 1/0. > Or, perhaps, if it's a digital I/O it could be a streaming data > signal? On a common flashlight, between the battery and the bulb? But seriously, Linthead, apparently you did not read the original post either. I am not talking about a CHARGER, I am talking about a SMALL CIRCUIT BETWEEN THE BATTERY AND THE BULB. I spelled that out, you just didn't care to read it. And then there is that thing up there in the subject line that looks like this "DISCHARGING". >> Here is the first paragraph from the first "HDQ interface" hit >> on Google. >> >> TI: HDQ communication basics This report compares the >> communication timing specifications for the different battery >> gas gauge and battery monitor products. It discusses some of >> the interface requirements necessary for robust HDQ >> communication, such as the need for a break prior to each >> communication, how to reliably read 16bit dynamic values over >> the 8bit bus, and the need for some noise filtering on the HDQ >> line. It also discusses the firmware strategy required for >> implementing the HDQ interface using a discrete I/O port and >> describes the popular option of using a UART to handle the HDQ >> bit timing requirement... > Good oh, so you do know how to use Google. Probably better than you, Linthead, and I am grown up enough to call it something other than "Google". Please stop, you sound like a cave dweller. > Perhaps next time instead of spending time abusing people trying > to help you, You and he might act like babies, but you do not have the same excuse... If you run around carelessly spewing half-baked misinformation, trying to send people you do not know on wild goose chases, you should not be surprised when you are abruptly questioned by someone who recognizes a wild goose chase. > FWIW, that paragraph tells you enough about HDQ for you to > realise it's likely not what's on your battery unless it's got a > *very* smart charger. If you had read my original post, Linthead, you would know that I am not talking about a charger. You are much safer talking about anything but the subject, Linthead, since you are defending someone who did not read the original post. > Season's greetings, perhaps you could let some of the spirit of > the season infuse you with some goodwill towards fellow men? Happy Holidays. -- > -- > Clint Sharp > > > Path: news.astraweb.com!border1.newsrouter.astraweb.com!nntp.club.cc.cmu.edu!195.114.241.69.MISMATCH!feeder.news-service.com!cyclone01.ams2.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!npeersf01.ams.highwinds-media.com!newsfe13.ams2.POSTED!7564ea0f!not-for-mail > Message-ID: <PWzTo0DZ8IMLFw3C clintsmc.demon.co.uk> > From: Clint Sharp <clint clintsmc.demon.co.uk> > Newsgroups: sci.electronics.basics > Subject: Re: Discharging a lithium-ion battery, what is the third wire for? > References: <009ebaad$0$8091$c3e8da3 news.astraweb.com> <50365384-d376-48fb-abd3-2eacc598735d l2g2000vbg.googlegroups.com> <8nksi5lsapcibnmb6g6mnlt7serlvh9e2m 4ax.com> <00e7e03a$0$6590$c3e8da3 news.astraweb.com> <716uwSQgx$LLFwb+ clintsmc.demon.co.uk> <00ac1a4d$0$12992$c3e8da3 news.astraweb.com> > Lines: 45 > Organization: Little > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed > User-Agent: Turnpike/6.07-S (<K17L$tWvcv7h$K872l5LbGSW8j>) > NNTP-Posting-Host: 62.49.16.63 > X-Complaints-To: abuse demon.net > X-Trace: newsfe13.ams2 1261473566 62.49.16.63 (Tue, 22 Dec 2009 09:19:26 UTC) > NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 22 Dec 2009 09:19:26 UTC > Date: Tue, 22 Dec 2009 09:19:21 +0000 > |