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From: John G Harris on 2 Jun 2010 15:30 On Wed, 2 Jun 2010 at 13:30:05, in comp.lang.javascript, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >John G Harris wrote: > >> a) "ECMAScript is part of the JavaScript language". >> >> b) "the core scripting language is specified in this document" >> >> Clearly (b) logically implies (a). > >Most certainly it doesn't. Your logic is flawed. > >> If you disagree you have to explain your reasoning otherwise no sensible >> person will believe you. > >JavaScript is an implementation of ECMAScript. It implements this Language >Specification, and extends it as the Specification allows. That does not >mean that ECMAScript is a part of JavaScript, that is just nonsense. So that's where the problem lies. I'm afraid Netscape's idea of what JavaScript is differs from your idea. Here are three quotes from NN4's online manuals. The first two come from the online JavaScript Reference, the third from the online JavaScript Guide. "Client-Side JavaScript Reference This book is a reference manual for the JavaScript language, including both core and client-side JavaScript for version 1.3. JavaScript is Netscape's cross-platform, object-based scripting language for client and server applications." "About this Book JavaScript is Netscape's cross-platform, object-based scripting language for client and server applications. This book is a reference manual for the JavaScript language, including both core and client-side JavaScript." "JavaScript and ECMA Terminology The ECMA specification uses terminology and syntax that may be unfamiliar to a JavaScript programmer. Although the description of the language may differ in ECMA, the language itself remains the same. JavaScript supports all functionality outlined in the ECMA specification." Points to note : 1 Netscape defined JavaScript to be a language, not an implementation of some (unnamed) language. 2 Netscape declared that ECMA 262 specifies part of JavaScript. Thus the set of all ECMAScript's legal productions (code strings) is a subset of JavaScript's, and their behaviour is the same. Also, any objects required in an ECMAScript execution environment are also required in a JavaScript execution environment. You could say that ECMAScript is a subset of JavaScript but that would be a mild abuse of language. You can certainly say that ECMAScript is the core language of JavaScript. <snip> John -- John Harris
From: Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn on 2 Jun 2010 17:33 John G Harris wrote: > Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >> John G Harris wrote: >>> a) "ECMAScript is part of the JavaScript language". >>> >>> b) "the core scripting language is specified in this document" >>> >>> Clearly (b) logically implies (a). >> >> Most certainly it doesn't. Your logic is flawed. >> >>> If you disagree you have to explain your reasoning otherwise no sensible >>> person will believe you. >> >> JavaScript is an implementation of ECMAScript. It implements this >> Language Specification, and extends it as the Specification allows. >> That does not mean that ECMAScript is a part of JavaScript, that is >> just nonsense. > > So that's where the problem lies. I'm afraid Netscape's idea of what > JavaScript is differs from your idea. I am not afraid, I am certain now that you still don't know what you are talking about. > Here are three quotes from NN4's online manuals. You do realize that this documentation is seriously flawed, that NN4 is obsolete, that JavaScript 1.5 as of Mozilla 1.0 is a conforming ECMAScript implementation, and that JavaScript since 1.4 no longer includes NN's host objects, don't you? You do realize that the "core scripting language" being specified is the language without regard to the host environment, don't you? You do realize that the host environment provides the implementation, don't you? PointedEars -- Prototype.js was written by people who don't know javascript for people who don't know javascript. People who don't know javascript are not the best source of advice on designing systems that use javascript. -- Richard Cornford, cljs, <f806at$ail$1$8300dec7(a)news.demon.co.uk>
From: John G Harris on 3 Jun 2010 10:34 On Wed, 2 Jun 2010 at 23:33:34, in comp.lang.javascript, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: <snip> >You do realize <snip> I do realise that this next quote is going to upset you. It appears in the Mozilla Development Centre, at <https://developer.mozilla.org/en/About_JavaScript> "What is JavaScript? JavaScript is the Netscape-developed object scripting language used in millions of web pages and server applications worldwide. Netscape's JavaScript is a superset of the ECMA-262 Edition 3 (ECMAScript) standard scripting language, with only mild differences from the published standard." John -- John Harris
From: Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn on 3 Jun 2010 11:13 John G Harris wrote: > I do realise that this next quote is going to upset you. It appears in > the Mozilla Development Centre, at > <https://developer.mozilla.org/en/About_JavaScript> I realize that you have still no clue what you are talking about. PointedEars -- Prototype.js was written by people who don't know javascript for people who don't know javascript. People who don't know javascript are not the best source of advice on designing systems that use javascript. -- Richard Cornford, cljs, <f806at$ail$1$8300dec7(a)news.demon.co.uk>
From: John G Harris on 3 Jun 2010 15:13
On Thu, 3 Jun 2010 at 17:13:31, in comp.lang.javascript, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >John G Harris wrote: > >> I do realise that this next quote is going to upset you. It appears in >> the Mozilla Development Centre, at >> <https://developer.mozilla.org/en/About_JavaScript> > >I realize that you have still no clue what you are talking about. I predicted that the quote would annoy you. I was right. You have failed to make a convincing case. You deny that ECMAScript is the core language. The several owners of the technologies say it is. ETX John -- John Harris |