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From: Rosa on 9 Mar 2010 23:49
Hi Ken,

Thanks for taking the time to provide me with some insight.

Regarding your four numbered answers to my six numbered questions:

Answer-1, That's why I suggested we cut to the chase in my original post
and address the questions I specifically posted.

Answer-2, Same as answer-1.

Answer-3, In my original post, I stated I was not interested in any form or
internet based, or web-based email. You suggested "Windows Live Mail". Is
that "client" based, or an "internet/web based" email set up?

Answer-4, In business, I need to be efficient when it comes to the baisics.
Rarely that means experimenting myself with all the possible options that may
be available, but most the time it means I seek the advice of those who have
experience and can cut the chase with the pros and cons, leaving the ultimate
decision to me. I don't have the time to experiement with all that's out
there. That's why I was trying to be as explicit as possible when I posted
that I'm not trying to waste people's time, just looking for the the pros and
cons between the "emailing" aspects of Outlook vs Outlook Express.

I was hoping that somebody at this forum was going to be able to present the
"facts", the "pros & cons" and provide unbiased factually answers to my
questions, based on the "experience" of those that have realistically
compared Outlook vs Outlook Express, and then can comment as I origianlly
posted on the "email aspects" of both. Not all the other addon I specificed
I was not interested in.

But I appreciate the effort Ken. Thanks again,

Rosa

"Ken Blake, MVP" wrote:

> On Tue, 9 Mar 2010 16:54:01 -0800, Rosa
> <Rosa(a)discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>
> > Hi forum members,
> >
> > This is the first time I've posted at this forum, and probably the best
> > place for me to start to look for answers to my qustions.
> >
> > I want to completely switch from my web based email, to an excellent
> > "client" based email program, with the emphasis on "client" based, not
> > internet/web based email.
> >
> > With Microsoft, it appears I have two choices, Outlook, or Outlook Express.
> >
> > Up front I'm stating, not interested in all the bells and whistles that may
> > or may not be added on to what I'm looking for in an excellent email program,
> > I.E. calendar, scheduling, and whatever may be available. I'm simply looking
> > for the best darn client based email program that exists, whether it's free,
> > or, I have to pay for it.
> >
> > So, between Outlook and Outlook Express, what are the pros and cons about
> > one versus the other?
> >
> > Please don't waste your time or mine tellilng me about the stuff I've stated
> > I'm not interested in. Simply want to compare Outlook vs Outlook Express's
> > email program and how either will serve me best.
>
>
> You may not like my answer, but here's my view:
>
> 1. Some people will prefer Outlook and others will prefer Outlook
> Express. When you get people telling you their preferences, it's very
> hard to get enough good enough information to make up your own mind.
>
> 2. You're asking in an Outlook newsgroup. Almost everybody here (me,
> for example) is in *this* newsgroup because they prefer Outlook to
> Outlook Express.
>
> 3. You are asking about two Microsoft products. Those aren't the only
> two Microsoft products to choose from (Windows Live Mail is another),
> but even more important is that there are other *non*-Microsoft
> products to also consider.
>
> 4. My recommendation is to ignore my preferences and everybody else's.
> Try them both, as well as other e-mail programs, and decide for
> yourself which works best for *you*.
>
> --
> Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP (Windows Desktop Experience) since 2003
> Please Reply to the Newsgroup
> .
>
From: Rosa on 10 Mar 2010 00:21
Hi VanguardLH,

Thank you for your answers, let me get into them below.

Regarding your answers to my original post:

The fact that OE will not be supported as the Microsoft Op Systems progress
over the upcoming years, is a very valid point, and probably the best answer
I've received on specifically why Outlook will be a better choice for me.
Good one!

Point taken on my use of the word "BEST", true it's very subjective. So let
me get more specific to your specific follow up questions.

No Exchange Server / Yes, POP email server / For immediate and foreseable
future, just email, possibly in the future the calendar, no journaling, no
tasks, no notes / Currently running XP on all machines, not interested in
Vista, will upgrade to Win-7 on all machines at some point in the future / As
posted, I want only a client based email program.

You had mentioned WM and WLM. Are those "client" based programs?

Regarding your "usenet" comments, have you ever been the person that signs
the paychecks for several dozen emloyees? If so, you can then begin to
understand my comments about not wanting to waste peoples time and vice
versa. Just a bad business habit I formed over the years.

Regarding your comments on "if google wave takes off", you have a good point
about the future, but I never said I had a "new" business, or a "new business
requirement". I have had my current business since 1993, and started to use
email in 1994.

How long have your viably been communicating with email, in business that
is? or otherwise? If pre 1994, my follow up question is, what email program
were you specifically using back then?

Thanks,

Rosa



"VanguardLH" wrote:

> Rosa wrote:
>
> > With Microsoft, it appears I have two choices, Outlook, or Outlook Express.
>
> You'll only get Outlook Express if you stay with Windows XP as your latest
> version of Windows (whether as a stand-alone install of Windows XP or as the
> XP mode available in Windows 7). OE went dead back in 2006 and is
> unsupported. In Vista, Windows Mail (WM) replaced OE. In Windows 7, no
> e-mail client is included. Windows Live Mail (WLM) is Microsoft's replaced
> for both OE and WM.
>
> > Up front I'm stating, not interested in all the bells and whistles that may
> > or may not be added on to what I'm looking for in an excellent email program,
> > I.E. calendar, scheduling, and whatever may be available. I'm simply looking
> > for the best darn client based email program that exists, whether it's free,
> > or, I have to pay for it.
>
> "Best" is subjective even if money is no object. I know many users that
> won't use Outlook because it is the monster swiss knife of an e-mail client
> when they want just a 2-blade version that they can understand and handle.
>
> > So, between Outlook and Outlook Express, what are the pros and cons about
> > one versus the other?
>
> - Will you be connecting to an MS-Exchange mail server which is required for
> all the enterprise-level functions in Outlook?
> - The what types of e-mail servers will you connect (POP, IMAP,
> HTTP/Deltasync, Exchange, SMTP)?
> - Are you going to use the Journal and Notes features of Outlook? Or just
> e-mail and possibly calendaring?
>
> > Please don't waste your time or mine tellilng me about the stuff I've stated
> > I'm not interested in.
>
> But you haven't stated the "stuff you're not interested in".
>
> > Simply want to compare Outlook vs Outlook Express's
> > email program and how either will serve me best.
>
> That depends on which version of Windows you are using and will be using.
> You do realize, right, that OE doesn't have a calendar which was one the
> requirements you asked for and which immediately disqualifies OE.
>
> > My needs:
> >
> > 1 - I will want to set up a minimum of three email addreses, for business
> > and personal uses.
>
> Outlook, OE, WM, and WLM will all handle that.
>
> > 2 - Will need an address/conact book that can handle the details of each
> > contact.
>
> Outlook, OE, WM, and WLM will all handle that.
>
> > 3 - Will need to back-up the emails and contact data fairly easily so if my
> > hard drives crash or the program becomes corrupt somehow I have my info that
> > can be quickly, easily and confidently restored to the email program for easy
> > "up and running use again".
>
> Any backup or imaging program of your choice can handle backing up the data
> files for Outlook, OE, WM, and WLM.
>
> > 4 - Must have reputable security in place.
>
> Outlook, OE, WM, and WLM will all handle that by defaulting to the
> Restricted Sites security zone when rendering HTML-formatted e-mails. Not
> an issue with plain-text e-mails (or if you configure the e-mail client to
> read only in plain text mode). Outlook 2003, and up, OE, WM, and WLM can
> all block externally linked images (to eliminate web beacons in
> HTML-formatted e-mails). Beyond that you will have to define what you mean
> by "security".
>
> > 5 - Must be able to handle allot of daily email to each email address where
> > I can separate, sort, and organize the incoming and outgoing email in a
> > manner I choose, such as a tree lilke structure with folders I choose to set
> > up and arrange.
>
> Outlook, OE, WM, and WLM will all handle that via rules.
>
> > 6 - Must have "average or above" email formatting abilities, with the
> > ability to add attachments of "most all"common types.
>
> Outlook, OE, WM, and WLM will all handle that. In Outlook, you can elect to
> use Word as your new-mail editor (only necessary for HTML-formatted
> e-mails); however, Word is not the best HTML editor and inserts code usable
> only by a recipient that also happens to use Word to view their received
> e-mails. All of them have an embedded new-mail editor that lets you create
> HTML-formatted e-mails (except Outlook 2007 which forces users to use Word).
> None of them can generate as complicated an HTML page as can an HTML editor
> designed to compile web pages; however, there are many objects in HTML which
> are usable in e-mails, like scripts (as that is a security risk that e-mail
> clients will disable).
>
> > Again, please don't waste anybody's time with stuff that's not relevant to
> > my question.
>
> This is Usenet. It is an anarchy. You cannot command anyone with regards
> to who or how they reply. You will get whatever they want to post. In
> fact, being deliberately blind to alternate choices makes you look stubborn
> and foolish, especially when there might be equal but free solutions. I
> know of an Outlook look-alike that is free -- but then you don't want to
> hear about it.
>
> > Outlook or Outlook Express? For EMAIL PURPOSES. One or the other, Why vs
> > Why Not?
>
> You never mentioned WHICH version of Windows that you already have. If it
> is Windows XP (or Windows 7 with XP Mode and VirtualPC 2007 installed) then
> you can already trial Outlook Express for yourself. You can get a trial of
> MS Office to see what Outlook is like (and even run it inside of a virtual
> machine).
>
> In the beginning, you mentioned calendaring and scheduling which is not
> available in OE. Yet in your delineated list of requirements, you never
> mentioned the need for calendaring and scheduling. Outlook has a calendar
> and journal. OE does not.
>
> > After all, successful business is about making things simpler, not more
> > complicated, when it comes to getting the job at hand done! Email that is.
>
> If Google Wave takes off, and because they are defining an open standard so
> there can be non-Google Wave providers (and why a *protocol* for e-mail
> allowed anyone to establish an e-mail service rather than using a
> proprietary product controlled by one source), e-mail might go the way of
> the fax. E-mail is 30 years old. You're "new" business requirement is
> coming on the tail end of e-mail's era.
>
> (http://wave.google.com)
>
> > Thanks for any help with info that will help me make my decision when it
> > comes to Outlook vs Outlook Express.
>
> Lots here:
> http://www.google.com/search?q=%2Boutlook+%2B%22outlook+express%22+%2Bdifference
>
> Bye.
> .
>
From: Leonid S. Knyshov // SBS Expert on 10 Mar 2010 02:28
On 3/9/2010 8:29 PM, Rosa wrote:
> Thank you Leonid,
>
> As I requested, specific answers, and you gave me two.
>
>
>> "Outlook is also far more advanced as far as folder management is
>> concerned. You can drag messages between folders easily and you can drag
>> folders easily as well"
>
> Thanks Leonid, I'm assuming your answer is in the context of my original
> post, as in a direct comparison to OE, meaning the "folder management" and
> the "dragging messages between folders" is performed easier, or in a more
> efficient manner than in Outlook Express?
>
> I appreciate your direct answers to my questions. Since you are a SBS, I
> can tell you know how to provide good straight answers.
>
In OE, you can drag messages between folders, but you can't drag folders.

In Outlook, this is much easier and there are no limits.

In my opinion, everything is simply easier in Outlook. I used OE for
many years.

It has extremely powerful features, such as mail merge integration with
Microsoft Word. It also has gotchas. For example, the automatic archive
feature and the highly customizable views that can hide messages.

Get in the habit of dragging with the right button. There are no
confirmation prompts if you drag with the left button, which can lead to
misplacement of information.

Microsoft has free training on Outlook 2007 on http://office.microsoft.com
--
Leonid S. Knyshov
Crashproof Solutions
510-282-1008
Twitter: @wiseleo
http://crashproofsolutions.com
Microsoft Small Business Specialist
Try Exchange Online http://bit.ly/free-exchange-trial
Please vote "helpful" if I helped you :)
From: Gordon on 10 Mar 2010 03:35

"Leonid S. Knyshov // SBS Expert"
<LeonidSKnyshovSBSExpert(a)discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:#Wgxs4#vKHA.2436(a)TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>
> Outlook. For one reason - you can extend its capabilities with add-ons.
>
And there are FAR more add-ins written for Mozilla Thunderbird than there
are for Outlook.
Plus Thunderbird handles IMAP email far better then Outlook...and you can
choose whether to have a Calendar or not...with Outlook you have it whether
you want it or like it or not...

From: eam on 10 Mar 2010 05:55
On 3/9/2010 5:54 PM, Rosa wrote:
> Hi forum members,
>
> This is the first time I've posted at this forum, and probably the best
> place for me to start to look for answers to my qustions.
>
> I want to completely switch from my web based email, to an excellent
> "client" based email program, with the emphasis on "client" based, not
> internet/web based email.
>
> With Microsoft, it appears I have two choices, Outlook, or Outlook Express.
>
> Up front I'm stating, not interested in all the bells and whistles that may
> or may not be added on to what I'm looking for in an excellent email program,
> I.E. calendar, scheduling, and whatever may be available. I'm simply looking
> for the best darn client based email program that exists, whether it's free,
> or, I have to pay for it.
>
> So, between Outlook and Outlook Express, what are the pros and cons about
> one versus the other?
>
> Please don't waste your time or mine tellilng me about the stuff I've stated
> I'm not interested in. Simply want to compare Outlook vs Outlook Express's
> email program and how either will serve me best.
>
> My needs:
>
> 1 - I will want to set up a minimum of three email addreses, for business
> and personal uses.
>
> 2 - Will need an address/conact book that can handle the details of each
> contact.
>
> 3 - Will need to back-up the emails and contact data fairly easily so if my
> hard drives crash or the program becomes corrupt somehow I have my info that
> can be quickly, easily and confidently restored to the email program for easy
> "up and running use again".
>
> 4 - Must have reputable security in place.
>
> 5 - Must be able to handle allot of daily email to each email address where
> I can separate, sort, and organize the incoming and outgoing email in a
> manner I choose, such as a tree lilke structure with folders I choose to set
> up and arrange.
>
> 6 - Must have "average or above" email formatting abilities, with the
> ability to add attachments of "most all"common types.
>
>
> Again, please don't waste anybody's time with stuff that's not relevant to
> my question.
>
> Outlook or Outlook Express? For EMAIL PURPOSES. One or the other, Why vs
> Why Not?
>
> After all, successful business is about making things simpler, not more
> complicated, when it comes to getting the job at hand done! Email that is.
>
> Thanks for any help with info that will help me make my decision when it
> comes to Outlook vs Outlook Express.
>
> best to all,
>
> Roas
Hi Rosa,
Following in order my favorites:
Mozilla Thunderbird
Microsoft Outlook 2010
Zimbra Desktop
The Bat!
Windows Live Mail

I now use Mozilla Thunderbird 3.0.3 with:
1 GMail account
4 Google Apps Business accounts
1 Microsoft Live account
1 GMX account (pop3 for testing)
1 Usenet account
37 RSS
1 Calendar fully synchronized with Google Calendar (personal)
2 Calendars fully synchronized with Google Apps Calendar (business)
1 Google Contacts full sync with Personal Address Book
1 Google Contacts full sync with Business Address Book

I am a network engineer and I have an IT company, I can even remote
connect and help you with the configuration you prefer.
Just let me know.
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