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From: glee on 14 Jun 2010 16:12
I'm not a fan of toolbars, and many are foisted upon the user without
their realizing it, during an installation (see Sun Java's
already-checked option to install the Bing bar during a Java update, or
the Yahoo toolbar and Companion and whatever else they add to a system
now). But many users do consciously install certain toolbars because
they do provide options the user wants.....I suspect a large number of
Google toolbar installations are conscious decisions, or at least they
were a few years ago....

It's debatable whether Java serves a useful purpose...it runs Java
applets in the browser, but there are others ways to accomplish what
Java does. I can go months without ever using Java in my browsers, and
there's considerably more risk involved with Java than with many
toolbars. {shrug}

....glen


"Anteaus" <Anteaus(a)discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:8BACEB33-9F2F-4C0F-9303-759CC73C62FB(a)microsoft.com...
> 99% of users have no need for Java, and it does pose a measurable
> security
> problem. That said, Java has a legitimate purpose, it's just that its
> days of
> being used by websites are largely over. If you use OpenOffice you may
> need
> Java, but even so you can disable the browser plugin in the settings,
> or by
> editing the FF config file greprefs\all.js if you want to stop people
> re-enabling it.
>
> As opposed to toolbars which are an attempt to foist stuff onto the
> user,
> and almost always for reasons which are not in the user's interest.
>
> "98 Guy" wrote:
>
>> glee wrote:
>>
>> > Although it would be nice if no updates were installed by any
>> > company to any software but their own, it can't work out that
>> > way.
>>
>> Yes, it can work that way. Microsoft wanted to do what-ever it could
>> to
>> insure that Firefox users might at least stumble upon Bing as a
>> search
>> option as they used their browser, thereby increasing there market
>> share
>> of the search market and increase their advertizing revenue.
>>
>> Give me one example of how any of Sun's wayward or inappropiate
>> updates
>> were designed to accomplish the same end.
>>
>> > It amazes me that people get up in arms over a browser add-on that
>> > supports an installed toolbar from Microsoft,
>>
>> How can you say that, when Microsoft is now admitting that they made
>> a
>> mistake as to how the update applied itself?
>>
>> Of course we should be up-in-arms about these instances, because if
>> we
>> are not, Microsoft will become accustomed to doing them more often.
>>
>> ---------------
>> Microsoft explains mystery Firefox extension, "fixes" update:
>>
>> http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/news/2010/06/microsoft-explains-mystery-firefox-extension-fixes-update-1.ars
>>
>> "In other words, the update will no longer be distributed to toolbars
>> that it shouldn't be added to."
>> ---------------
>>
>> It's too late for those systems that have already performed the last
>> WU
>> session. This particular "update" does not show up in Control Panel
>> =>
>> Programs and Features => Installed Updates. Furthermore, the
>> Uninstall
>> button for the extension is greyed out in Firefox.
>>
>> Ya sure, you say that it could have been a simple configuration
>> mistake
>> for it to apply itself to Firefox when firefox has NO
>> previously-installed msn or bing tool bar (who cares if the user's IE
>> has such a tool bar - that doesn't mean the update should also
>> install
>> itself on Firefox if the user did not install an MS-based tool bar or
>> add-on for Firefox).
>>
>> But when the update intentionally removes the mechanism to allow the
>> user to delete or uninstall it, and when MS classifies the update as
>> "important", then all together this points to intent to plant a Bing
>> search option on the Firefox settings panel that Microsoft hopes for
>> casual users to stumble upon it and turn it on. Their motive was
>> purely
>> financial. Microsoft's mindset surrounding this update came purely
>> from
>> their sales and marketing divisions. It was no mistake the way this
>> was
>> rolled out by Macro$haft.
>> .
>>

From: Dan on 14 Jun 2010 23:31
<snipped for length concerns>


> Thanks for the link, Dan.....at least it gives a little more info on
> what the update is for.
>
> Although it would be nice if no updates were installed by any company to
> any software but their own, it can't work out that way. If Sun Java is
> installed, components have to be added to the installed web browsers,
> because Java will be implemented in those browsers. In this case, a
> toolbar is installed in the browser, and updates to that toolbar may add
> components to the browser.
> The two most prevalent browser toolbars, Google Toolbar and Yahoo
> Toolbar, add items not only to the browsers but also to Windows startup
> axis, run regular updaters, and if enabled send info back to Google or
> Yahoo....and no one finds this intrusive?
> It amazes me that people get up in arms over a browser add-on that
> supports an installed toolbar from Microsoft, but ignore similar or
> worse behavior from Sun, Google or Yahoo.
> --
> Glen Ventura, MS MVP Oct. 2002 - Sept. 2009
> A+
> http://dts-l.net/
>

Your welcome, Glen. Well, I removed the update manually from Mozilla
Firefox by removing the extension pack from Vista. Anyway, I searched
through the registry as well and did not see anything amiss.
From: T Shadow on 15 Jun 2010 02:30
"glee" <glee29(a)spamindspring.com> wrote in message
news:hv62f9$ckm$1(a)news.eternal-september.org...
> I'm not a fan of toolbars, and many are foisted upon the user without
> their realizing it, during an installation (see Sun Java's already-checked
> option to install the Bing bar during a Java update, or the Yahoo toolbar
> and Companion and whatever else they add to a system now). But many users
> do consciously install certain toolbars because they do provide options
> the user wants.....I suspect a large number of Google toolbar
> installations are conscious decisions, or at least they were a few years
> ago....
>

Most of the people I ask about the tool bars on thier computer don't know
what a tool bar is let alone how they(plural) got on thier system. Of course
they also don't know about all the junk, running for years, that the OEM
burdened them with either. Not talking about the kind of people that follow
newsgroups though. The people that don't know greatly out number those that
do. Probably legal for car mfg to taxi people around in the trunk of cars
they've sold without the owner knowing too. :^b


From: 8os.8 on 15 Jun 2010 11:25
14 Jun 2010,"T Shadow" <None(a)void.com> in
news:uMgac8FDLHA.420(a)TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl:

> Probably legal for car mfg to taxi people around in the trunk of
> cars they've sold without the owner knowing too. :^b


don't think that would work for long unless they seal the bags really well :-)
From: Dan on 16 Jun 2010 21:22
<snip>

BTW, here is the official Microsoft website on removing the add-on.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/2237744
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