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From: Bruce on 27 Dec 2009 11:47
On Sun, 27 Dec 2009 11:21:57 -0500, Bowser <Canon(a)Nikon.Panny> wrote:
>
>I'm surprised it took Nikon all this time to learn what Canon learned
>by going to the EOS/EF mount.


It's true that Nikon was slow to adopt AF. Initially, Nikon chose the
screwdriver drive system that was slow and heavy.

But it was not very long before the first AF-I Nikkors were
introduced, and these were soon followed by AF-S lenses with the
"Silent Wave" focusing motors that were fast and near-silent in
operation - very much the equal of Canon's USM range.

The problem was, Nikon did not have access to the technology other
than by paying expensive royalties to the patent holders, who in this
case happened to be Canon. That was a disincentive to the wider and
cheaper availability of AF-S lenses. Now those patents have expired,
Nikon is moving more rapidly to an all-AF-S lens line, including
inexpensive entry-level lenses.


>But hey, if their latest DSLRs are any
>indication, they learn slow, but they learn good.


After years of dominance, it is strange to see Canon playing catch-up.

From: Rich on 27 Dec 2009 14:27
Chris H <chris(a)phaedsys.org> wrote in
news:4x1YK4F2nyNLFALy(a)phaedsys.demon.co.uk:

> In message <c0695b63-992a-460a-bd61-d13498137dda(a)e37g2000yqn.googlegroup
> s.com>, RichA <rander3127(a)gmail.com> writes
>>With some manufacturers even providing adapters (Panasonic) to use
>>other brand lenses (Leica) on their products and others allowing focus
>>confirmation and image stabilization with any lens brand, Nikon seems
>>to be going the opposite way, making it as hard to use legacy Nikon
>>lenses on new products as possible. Note the specs on this new one.
>>No AF motor. Which means it likely won't meter with the old manual
>>lenses either. Only newer Nikkors will function.
>
> Given that Nikon have used the same mount for 50 years and AFAIK all the
> Nikon Lenses fit all Nikon Cameras. They have a greater or lesser amount
> of electrical capability and are only a couple of exceptions where it
> should not be done.
>
> Nikon have such a wide range of lenses and are brining out new ones
> (with VR, greater ranges, faster, lighter etc) to work with the newer
> bodies I am not sure you need full compatibility with all the Nikon
> lenses of the last century.
>

Need? No. Desire? Yes. It's a "class" thing. Own a D300 or better, no
problem, own a lesser Nikon, you are prevented from using 90% of the glass
they've ever produced.
From: Rich on 27 Dec 2009 14:34
nospam <nospam(a)nospam.invalid> wrote in news:271220090833327860%
nospam(a)nospam.invalid:

> In article
> <c0695b63-992a-460a-bd61-d13498137dda(a)e37g2000yqn.googlegroups.com>,
> RichA <rander3127(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> With some manufacturers even providing adapters (Panasonic) to use
>> other brand lenses (Leica) on their products and others allowing focus
>> confirmation and image stabilization with any lens brand, Nikon seems
>> to be going the opposite way, making it as hard to use legacy Nikon
>> lenses on new products as possible. Note the specs on this new one.
>> No AF motor. Which means it likely won't meter with the old manual
>> lenses either. Only newer Nikkors will function.
>
> wrong. almost all nikon lenses will work, and any lens with a cpu in it
> will meter. few people who buy a new dslr care about using old manual
> focus lenses. the d40 was the first to drop the internal motor and it
> was one of the best selling dslrs ever.
>

Work? Sure. But how well? No metering with most Nikon glass existing
out there, and no AF on AF lenses made before a specific time. The
average buyer of an entry level Nikon may well find out about old glass,
but they are unlikely to want to deal with the use restrictions imposed
by the body. Meanwhile, Canon, Pentax, Olympus and even Sony to a degree
can use old glass, from MANY manufacturers whereas Nikon users are stuck
with only new, Nikon glass and some mediocre aftermarket sources like
Sigma. I've used manual Nikkors on a D40/50, no metering, but I can live
with it by guestimating the exposure, taking a shot, them compensating
after seeing the initial image on the LCD, the effort doesn't bother me
because I know how to deal with it. How many users of entry-level Nikons
would put up with that?
From: J�rgen Exner on 27 Dec 2009 14:49
Rich <none(a)nowhere.com> wrote:
> Meanwhile, Canon, Pentax, Olympus and even Sony to a degree
>can use old glass,

Canon? Really? That will be news to most people. Did you ever try
mounting a Canon FD lens on a Canon dSLR?

> from MANY manufacturers whereas Nikon users are stuck
>with only new, Nikon glass and some mediocre aftermarket sources like
>Sigma.

Actually you can use virtually _any_ Nikon F-mount with aperture index
on a modern Nikon dSLR camera. Maybe not on the entry-level bodies, but
opposite to Canon at least there is some way to use your old Nikkor
glass with full functionality if you really want to.

> I've used manual Nikkors on a D40/50, no metering, but I can live
>with it by guestimating the exposure, taking a shot, them compensating
>after seeing the initial image on the LCD, the effort doesn't bother me
>because I know how to deal with it. How many users of entry-level Nikons
>would put up with that?

The real question is: how many would possibly care about it?

jue
From: Bruce on 27 Dec 2009 16:50
On Sun, 27 Dec 2009 13:27:40 -0600, Rich <none(a)nowhere.com> wrote:

>Chris H <chris(a)phaedsys.org> wrote in
>news:4x1YK4F2nyNLFALy(a)phaedsys.demon.co.uk:
>
>> In message <c0695b63-992a-460a-bd61-d13498137dda(a)e37g2000yqn.googlegroup
>> s.com>, RichA <rander3127(a)gmail.com> writes
>>>With some manufacturers even providing adapters (Panasonic) to use
>>>other brand lenses (Leica) on their products and others allowing focus
>>>confirmation and image stabilization with any lens brand, Nikon seems
>>>to be going the opposite way, making it as hard to use legacy Nikon
>>>lenses on new products as possible. Note the specs on this new one.
>>>No AF motor. Which means it likely won't meter with the old manual
>>>lenses either. Only newer Nikkors will function.
>>
>> Given that Nikon have used the same mount for 50 years and AFAIK all the
>> Nikon Lenses fit all Nikon Cameras. They have a greater or lesser amount
>> of electrical capability and are only a couple of exceptions where it
>> should not be done.
>>
>> Nikon have such a wide range of lenses and are brining out new ones
>> (with VR, greater ranges, faster, lighter etc) to work with the newer
>> bodies I am not sure you need full compatibility with all the Nikon
>> lenses of the last century.
>>
>
>Need? No. Desire? Yes. It's a "class" thing. Own a D300 or better, no
>problem, own a lesser Nikon, you are prevented from using 90% of the glass
>they've ever produced.


Prevented from using? Nonsense!

All AF Nikkors will work in all exposure modes. You need to focus
them manually, that's all.

Probably 90% of buyers will buy the camera with one or two new kit
lenses, all of which are AF-S Nikkors and therefore 100% compatible.

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