RF Generated FTL Event Horizon
in [Design]
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From: Louis Marsh on 14 Jun 2010 21:00 I once read of someone who was experimenting with simulated event horizons utilizing the tangential velocity generated by a circular array of coils energized by RF ... around 2M diameter and 150MHz as I recall rotates in excess of C. Is this a realistic proposition for achieving faster-than-light (FTL) conditions? Irrespective of this, what would the effect of such a high speed CP field be upon intersecting radio waves? Thanks for any insights. Louis Marsh
From: Bill Sloman on 14 Jun 2010 21:53 On Jun 15, 3:00 am, louisma...(a)enerdyne.com (Louis Marsh) wrote: > I once read of someone who was experimenting with simulated event > horizons utilizing the tangential velocity generated by a circular > array of coils energized by RF ... around 2M diameter and 150MHz as I > recall rotates in excess of C. > > Is this a realistic proposition for achieving faster-than-light (FTL) > conditions? Only if you don't believe in relativity. > Irrespective of this, what would the effect of such a high speed CP > field be upon intersecting radio waves? Most likely none. -- Bill Sloman, Nijmegen
From: Dave Platt on 15 Jun 2010 01:58 In article <4c16cde5.11152546(a)news.tpg.com.au>, Louis Marsh <louismarsh(a)enerdyne.com> wrote: >I once read of someone who was experimenting with simulated event >horizons utilizing the tangential velocity generated by a circular >array of coils energized by RF ... around 2M diameter and 150MHz as I >recall rotates in excess of C. > >Is this a realistic proposition for achieving faster-than-light (FTL) >conditions? If my mental picture of this experimental setup is anywhere near correct, you're talking about an effect similar to that of phase velocity. This isn't really creating a "faster than light" transmission system. Yes, it's true that a setup like this can create the *appearance* of a wave of change propagating faster than C. However, it isn't possible to use this effect to actually transmit information from one end to the other (or around the circumference of this sort of circle) faster than light could carry it. The reason (to oversimplify it quite a bit) is that the "phase wave" that you see propagating, at any particular instant, is actually the result of a stimulus of some sort which was generated some time ago. In the case I think you're talking about, the "phase wave" is created by the RF field which is exciting the coils, and this is necessarily some distance away, roughly perpendicular to the coils. From one side of the circular array, you can't alter the exciting field as seen at the other side of the array without either signalling all the way across the array (at C speed) or by signalling back down to whatever generated the field in the first place, and waiting for the altered field of the generator to propagate back up to to the other side of the array (and this will take even longer than direct C-speed signalling from one side of the array to the other). >Irrespective of this, what would the effect of such a high speed CP >field be upon intersecting radio waves? I don't think that the effect would be any different than for any two ordinary electromagnetic waves interacting. It's going to depend very much on the material in which they interact (whether it's electrically conductive, magneticially permeable, linear or nonlinear, etc.). In a vacuum, the waves wouldn't interact in any significant way, or so it seems to me. -- Dave Platt <dplatt(a)radagast.org> AE6EO Friends of Jade Warrior home page: http://www.radagast.org/jade-warrior I do _not_ wish to receive unsolicited commercial email, and I will boycott any company which has the gall to send me such ads!
From: baron on 15 Jun 2010 06:59 Louis Marsh Inscribed thus: > I once read of someone who was experimenting with simulated event > horizons utilizing the tangential velocity generated by a circular > array of coils energized by RF ... around 2M diameter and 150MHz as I > recall rotates in excess of C. > > Is this a realistic proposition for achieving faster-than-light (FTL) > conditions? No ! > Irrespective of this, what would the effect of such a high speed CP > field be upon intersecting radio waves? You would just have an antenna radiating the energy that you put into it. So no effect on intersecting radio waves at all. > Thanks for any insights. > > Louis Marsh -- Best Regards: Baron.
From: nuny on 15 Jun 2010 07:45
On Jun 14, 6:00 pm, louisma...(a)enerdyne.com (Louis Marsh) wrote: > I once read of someone who was experimenting with simulated event > horizons utilizing the tangential velocity generated by a circular > array of coils energized by RF ... around 2M diameter and 150MHz as I > recall rotates in excess of C. Where did you read about this? How were the coils arranged, exactly? > Is this a realistic proposition for achieving faster-than-light (FTL) > conditions? No. As has been said, there's a difference between group velocity (which is the speed information travels at, always slower than c) and phase velocity (which is the resultant of other fields, and can have any velocity). The "near field" of two closely spaced dipoles *nearly* in-phase, for instance, can be described as a set of waves sloshing back and forth much faster than the speed of light in free space. But, the near field is *not* free space, it's constrained by the antennae. Similar effects occur in waveguides, or more prosaic coax cable. People have been playing with this idea for a long time, and so far nobody has come up with any system of EM radiators (AKA antennae) that can propagate *signals* faster than light. > Irrespective of this, what would the effect of such a high speed CP > field be upon intersecting radio waves? What does "CP" stand for? Why should intersecting radio waves do anything of interest? Again, as mentioned elsewhere, EM waves do not interact except in nonlinear media, which vacuum and air are not. What sort of medium was used in the setup you will (hopefully) cite for us, and/or did you have another specific medium in mind? Mark L. Fergerson |