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From: Brian Cryer on 6 May 2010 05:01
"-Draino-" <randyd123(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a8fa634f-0244-479c-a7b3-9b101b7b71c7(a)24g2000yqy.googlegroups.com...
> On May 6, 12:00 am, "Cliff Galiher - MVP" <cgali...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> > There are a couple of things worth mentioning here:
> >
> > 1) the "page.html" has me very nervous. You should NOT be hosting web
> > content on your SBS server. Just need to mention that.
> > 2) A direct IP address (173.191.14.188) will cause the machine you are
> > testing from to try to contact that IP directly. It won't go to DNS
> > therefore your DNS record is doing nothing. This is expected behavior.
> > If
> > you couldn't access the IP address before, you probably won't now.
> > 3) The problem likely lies with your router. Many routers do not do
> > loopback connections. In other words, it expects connections to the
> > public
> > IP only from the external interface. It will ignore and drop traffic to
> > the
> > public IP from the internal interfaces, thus when you are attempting to
> > access your machine with a public IP from within your LAN, the public IP
> > is
> > causing the local machine to contact the default gateway (your router)
> > and
> > your router is not forwarding that traffic back to your SBS machine.
> > This
> > isn't an SBS issue, but a router issue. To resolve it, you'll need to
> > refer
> > to your router documentation or contact their support staff. Each router
> > is
> > different.
> >
> > -Cliff
> >
> > "-Draino-" <randyd...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
> >
> > news:55a3d697-1b4b-421f-b826-69e1526268ce(a)l28g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
> >
> >
> >
> > > When I access my server from outside my LAN I use something like
> > >http://173.191.14.188/page.html
> >
> > > When I access my serer from inside my LAN I use something like
> > >http://servername/page.html
> >
> > > I want to be able to accesshttp://173.191.14.188/page.htmlfrom
> > > INSIDE my LAN but I can't. I have added a forward lookup A record in
> > > DNS but it still doesn't work.
> >
> > > What do I need to do?- Hide quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> We host a web application on our SBS2003 server. It's a package
> tracking app that the drivers log into for real time package tracking.
> It's not really "page.html" but it is a software app from Xcelerator
> that our Mobile-Tek handheld devices dial into. We use a "Dock
> Scanner" in the early AM to scan the load and all the packages go into
> the Xcelerator program. As the drivers scan their packages for loading
> they come off the database to show they are on the truck. When they
> are delivered the handhelds send that info to the server to show the
> package has been delivered. Something like UPS or FedEx.
>
> Our server has an IP address of 192.168.16.2 the router is
> 192.168.16.1. All our workstation use the SBS server for DNS. So all
> internal address get resolved using something like
> http://servername/Xcelerator/Mobile/..... what ever, to access the
> Xcelerator program. Outside the handhelds use
> http://173.181.14.188/Xcelerator/Mobile/......what
> ever.
>
> So I guess this is a router issue, I was just wondering if there was a
> way to resolve it differently when accessing Xcelerator internally.

No its not a router issue, its how you've set it up. You said that (quote):

"Outside the handhelds use http://173.181.14.188/Xcelerator/Mobile/.....
what ever."

There is your problem. You are using your IP address. If you use an explicit
IP address then the same address won't work both internally and externally.
Use a DNS name instead and point that to your public ip address. I'd suggest
either creating a sub-domain of your main domain-name just for that purpose,
but the choise is yours. You can then re-map that name internally to point
to your server allowing you to use the same name both internally and
externally.
--
Brian Cryer
www.cryer.co.uk/brian


From: -Draino- on 6 May 2010 08:27
On May 6, 5:01 am, "Brian Cryer" <not.here(a)localhost> wrote:
> "-Draino-" <randyd...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:a8fa634f-0244-479c-a7b3-9b101b7b71c7(a)24g2000yqy.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > On May 6, 12:00 am, "Cliff Galiher - MVP" <cgali...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> > > There are a couple of things worth mentioning here:
>
> > > 1) the "page.html" has me very nervous. You should NOT be hosting web
> > > content on your SBS server. Just need to mention that.
> > > 2) A direct IP address (173.191.14.188) will cause the machine you are
> > > testing from to try to contact that IP directly. It won't go to DNS
> > > therefore your DNS record is doing nothing. This is expected behavior..
> > > If
> > > you couldn't access the IP address before, you probably won't now.
> > > 3) The problem likely lies with your router. Many routers do not do
> > > loopback connections. In other words, it expects connections to the
> > > public
> > > IP only from the external interface. It will ignore and drop traffic to
> > > the
> > > public IP from the internal interfaces, thus when you are attempting to
> > > access your machine with a public IP from within your LAN, the public IP
> > > is
> > > causing the local machine to contact the default gateway (your router)
> > > and
> > > your router is not forwarding that traffic back to your SBS machine.
> > > This
> > > isn't an SBS issue, but a router issue. To resolve it, you'll need to
> > > refer
> > > to your router documentation or contact their support staff. Each router
> > > is
> > > different.
>
> > > -Cliff
>
> > > "-Draino-" <randyd...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> > >news:55a3d697-1b4b-421f-b826-69e1526268ce(a)l28g2000yqd.googlegroups.com....
>
> > > > When I access my server from outside my LAN I use something like
> > > >http://173.191.14.188/page.html
>
> > > > When I access my serer from inside my LAN I use something like
> > > >http://servername/page.html
>
> > > > I want to be able to accesshttp://173.191.14.188/page.htmlfrom
> > > > INSIDE my LAN but I can't. I have added a forward lookup A record in
> > > > DNS but it still doesn't work.
>
> > > > What do I need to do?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > We host a web application on our SBS2003 server. It's a package
> > tracking app that the drivers log into for real time package tracking.
> > It's not really "page.html" but it is a software app from Xcelerator
> > that our Mobile-Tek handheld devices dial into. We use a "Dock
> > Scanner" in the early AM to scan the load and all the packages go into
> > the Xcelerator program. As the drivers scan their packages for loading
> > they come off the database to show they are on the truck. When they
> > are delivered the handhelds send that info to the server to show the
> > package has been delivered. Something like UPS or FedEx.
>
> > Our server has an IP address of 192.168.16.2 the router is
> > 192.168.16.1. All our workstation use the SBS server for DNS. So all
> > internal address get resolved using something like
> >http://servername/Xcelerator/Mobile/..... what ever, to access the
> > Xcelerator program. Outside the handhelds use
> >http://173.181.14.188/Xcelerator/Mobile/......what
> > ever.
>
> > So I guess this is a router issue, I was just wondering if there was a
> > way to resolve it differently when accessing Xcelerator internally.
>
> No its not a router issue, its how you've set it up. You said that (quote):
>
> "Outside the handhelds usehttp://173.181.14.188/Xcelerator/Mobile/.....
> what ever."
>
> There is your problem. You are using your IP address. If you use an explicit
> IP address then the same address won't work both internally and externally.
> Use a DNS name instead and point that to your public ip address. I'd suggest
> either creating a sub-domain of your main domain-name just for that purpose,
> but the choise is yours. You can then re-map that name internally to point
> to your server allowing you to use the same name both internally and
> externally.
> --
> Brian Cryerwww.cryer.co.uk/brian- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Brian,

That's the info I am looking for but it's been so long since I've done
that I'm not sure of how to do it with DNS
From: Brian Cryer on 6 May 2010 09:25
"-Draino-" <randyd123(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
news:44af4d5c-d754-4ed7-b411-9cfa831c4dc0(a)q32g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
> On May 6, 5:01 am, "Brian Cryer" <not.here(a)localhost> wrote:
> > "-Draino-" <randyd...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
<snip>
> > No its not a router issue, its how you've set it up. You said that
> > (quote):
> >
> > "Outside the handhelds usehttp://173.181.14.188/Xcelerator/Mobile/.....
> > what ever."
> >
> > There is your problem. You are using your IP address. If you use an
> > explicit
> > IP address then the same address won't work both internally and
> > externally.
> > Use a DNS name instead and point that to your public ip address. I'd
> > suggest
> > either creating a sub-domain of your main domain-name just for that
> > purpose,
> > but the choise is yours. You can then re-map that name internally to
> > point
> > to your server allowing you to use the same name both internally and
> > externally.
> > --
> > Brian Cryer www.cryer.co.uk/brian - Hide quoted text -
>
> Brian,
>
> That's the info I am looking for but it's been so long since I've done
> that I'm not sure of how to do it with DNS

There are two parts to it: 1. setting up an external DNS name and 2.
redefining the same name internally.

1. Setting up an external DNS name. Assuming you have a company website and
you want to set up a sub-domain name which will be used for your application
to point to your website, then you will need to edit the DNS settings
assocaited with your domain name. How you do this will depend on the domain
name registrar you use, but somewhere there will be a control panel which
will let you configure DNS settings. You need to create a new "A Record"
which points to your IP address. Remember that it can take hours or even the
best part of a day for a change to filter through to clients. So try
something, but if it isn't right first time then expect to have to wait for
the update to take effect. Remember that this will only affect the name
visible to people external to your network.

2. Redefining the internal DNS name is much easier. Under Administrative
tools you should find "DNS". Start that, and under "Forward Lookup Zones"
create a new zone for the full dns name and a new A-record under that to
point to your server's internal ip address OR a C-record which names your
server (the latter is possibly better). If you already have an entry for
your main domain name then just create a record under that for your new
sub-domain. Remember that this will only affect the name visible internally
to your network.

I know this is a bit sketchy, but hopefully it will give you enough to go
on.
--
Brian Cryer
www.cryer.co.uk/brian

From: "Gregg Hill" greggmhill at please do not spam me at yahoo dot on 6 May 2010 11:24
Brian,

You stated that, "If you use an explicit IP address then the same address
won't work both internally and externally." That is because his router is
not set up for loopback or won't do loopback at all.

Your workaround to have a DNS name mapped differently internally than
externally is precisely a router issue.

My WatchGuard firewall does loopback, and I can hit my mail server from
inside or outside using the public FQDN or its public IP address, with zero
internal DNS modifications.

If he has a router with loopback working, he will be able to use
http://173.181.14.188/Xcelerator/Mobile/whatever both externally and
internally, and if he sets up public DNS pointing to that address, it will
work the same inside and outside without internal DNS changes.

Gregg Hill




"Brian Cryer" <not.here(a)localhost> wrote in message
news:exsKvqP7KHA.5848(a)TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
> "-Draino-" <randyd123(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:a8fa634f-0244-479c-a7b3-9b101b7b71c7(a)24g2000yqy.googlegroups.com...
>> On May 6, 12:00 am, "Cliff Galiher - MVP" <cgali...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>> > There are a couple of things worth mentioning here:
>> >
>> > 1) the "page.html" has me very nervous. You should NOT be hosting web
>> > content on your SBS server. Just need to mention that.
>> > 2) A direct IP address (173.191.14.188) will cause the machine you are
>> > testing from to try to contact that IP directly. It won't go to DNS
>> > therefore your DNS record is doing nothing. This is expected behavior.
>> > If
>> > you couldn't access the IP address before, you probably won't now.
>> > 3) The problem likely lies with your router. Many routers do not do
>> > loopback connections. In other words, it expects connections to the
>> > public
>> > IP only from the external interface. It will ignore and drop traffic to
>> > the
>> > public IP from the internal interfaces, thus when you are attempting to
>> > access your machine with a public IP from within your LAN, the public
>> > IP is
>> > causing the local machine to contact the default gateway (your router)
>> > and
>> > your router is not forwarding that traffic back to your SBS machine.
>> > This
>> > isn't an SBS issue, but a router issue. To resolve it, you'll need to
>> > refer
>> > to your router documentation or contact their support staff. Each
>> > router is
>> > different.
>> >
>> > -Cliff
>> >
>> > "-Draino-" <randyd...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
>> >
>> > news:55a3d697-1b4b-421f-b826-69e1526268ce(a)l28g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > > When I access my server from outside my LAN I use something like
>> > >http://173.191.14.188/page.html
>> >
>> > > When I access my serer from inside my LAN I use something like
>> > >http://servername/page.html
>> >
>> > > I want to be able to accesshttp://173.191.14.188/page.htmlfrom
>> > > INSIDE my LAN but I can't. I have added a forward lookup A record in
>> > > DNS but it still doesn't work.
>> >
>> > > What do I need to do?- Hide quoted text -
>> >
>> > - Show quoted text -
>>
>> We host a web application on our SBS2003 server. It's a package
>> tracking app that the drivers log into for real time package tracking.
>> It's not really "page.html" but it is a software app from Xcelerator
>> that our Mobile-Tek handheld devices dial into. We use a "Dock
>> Scanner" in the early AM to scan the load and all the packages go into
>> the Xcelerator program. As the drivers scan their packages for loading
>> they come off the database to show they are on the truck. When they
>> are delivered the handhelds send that info to the server to show the
>> package has been delivered. Something like UPS or FedEx.
>>
>> Our server has an IP address of 192.168.16.2 the router is
>> 192.168.16.1. All our workstation use the SBS server for DNS. So all
>> internal address get resolved using something like
>> http://servername/Xcelerator/Mobile/..... what ever, to access the
>> Xcelerator program. Outside the handhelds use
>> http://173.181.14.188/Xcelerator/Mobile/......what
>> ever.
>>
>> So I guess this is a router issue, I was just wondering if there was a
>> way to resolve it differently when accessing Xcelerator internally.
>
> No its not a router issue, its how you've set it up. You said that
> (quote):
>
> "Outside the handhelds use http://173.181.14.188/Xcelerator/Mobile/.....
> what ever."
>
> There is your problem. You are using your IP address. If you use an
> explicit IP address then the same address won't work both internally and
> externally. Use a DNS name instead and point that to your public ip
> address. I'd suggest either creating a sub-domain of your main domain-name
> just for that purpose, but the choise is yours. You can then re-map that
> name internally to point to your server allowing you to use the same name
> both internally and externally.
> --
> Brian Cryer
> www.cryer.co.uk/brian
>
>
From: Brian Cryer on 6 May 2010 11:33
"Gregg Hill" <greggmhill at please do not spam me at yahoo dot com> wrote in
message news:eziLsAT7KHA.2292(a)TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
> Brian,
>
> You stated that, "If you use an explicit IP address then the same address
> won't work both internally and externally." That is because his router is
> not set up for loopback or won't do loopback at all.
>
> Your workaround to have a DNS name mapped differently internally than
> externally is precisely a router issue.
>
> My WatchGuard firewall does loopback, and I can hit my mail server from
> inside or outside using the public FQDN or its public IP address, with
> zero internal DNS modifications.
>
> If he has a router with loopback working, he will be able to use
> http://173.181.14.188/Xcelerator/Mobile/whatever both externally and
> internally, and if he sets up public DNS pointing to that address, it will
> work the same inside and outside without internal DNS changes.
>
> Gregg Hill

I wish my router supported that as it would save me a lot of time. Certainly
if the OP's router supports it then I agree that that would be an easy fix
for him.
--
Brian Cryer
www.cryer.co.uk/brian

A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?

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