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From: Bill Ward on 29 Nov 2008 00:49 On Fri, 28 Nov 2008 19:35:59 -0800, bill.sloman wrote: > On 28 nov, 14:20, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelati...(a)hotmail.com> wrote: >> z wrote: >> > and the fact that water vapor partial pressure rises with temperature, >> > thereby making it an amplifier of other effects, such as CO2. >> >> An unproven hypothesis. i.e random noise. > > There's nothing unproven about the "hypothesis" that the partial pressure > of water vapour in contact with liquid water rises with temperature. It's > up there with Newton's law of gravity as one of the fundamental theories > of science. > > And more water vapour does mean more pressure broadening in the carbon > dioxide absorbtion spectrum. > > Carbonic acid (H2CO3) may not be stable in the vapour phase at room > temperature, but it is stable enough that any collision between a water > molecule and a carbon dioxide molecule lasts qute a bit longer than you'd > calculate from a billiard-ball model. > > Eeyore's response isn't random noise either, though it's information > content isn't any more useful - we already knew that Eeyore knows squat > about physics, and he's long since made it clear than he doesn't realise > how little he knows by posting loads of these over-confident and > thoroughly absurd assertions. He may also be aware that increased water vapor lowers the condensation altitude, raising the radiation temperature, and increasing the emitted IR energy by the 4th power radiation law. IOW, it's a negative feedback, not positive.
From: Bill Ward on 29 Nov 2008 01:14 On Fri, 28 Nov 2008 20:10:33 -0800, bill.sloman wrote: > On 28 nov, 23:24, Bill Ward <bw...(a)REMOVETHISix.netcom.com> wrote: >> On Fri, 28 Nov 2008 15:16:14 -0500, Whata Fool wrote: >> > bill.slo...(a)ieee.org wrote: >> >> >>On 28 nov, 04:27, Whata Fool <wh...(a)fool.ami> wrote: >> >>> Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelati...(a)hotmail.com> wrote: >> >> >>> >Whata Fool wrote: >> >> >>> >> bill.slo...(a)ieee.org wrote: >> >> >>> >> >The oxygen and nitrogen molecules exchange energy with carbon >> >>> >> >dioxide molecules whenever they collide, so the carbon dioxide >> >>> >> >radiates for them. >> >> >>> >> Ignoring water vapor again? Is that a mental >> >>> >> problem, or an order from control? >> >> >>> >LMFAO ! >> >> >>> >I though it was an acknowledged fact that water vapour is the big >> >>> >factor in climate. >> >> >>> >Graham >> >> >>> I should not have been flippant, the last couple of replies >> >>> seem to suggest that the atmosphere would get hotter without any >> >>> GHGs, and you know what that means to GreenHouse Theory and >> >>> Anthropogenic Global Warming. >> >> >>That suggestion is generated by your own inadequate understanding of >> >>the subject under discussion. You clearly don't know enough elementary >> >>physics to undertand what I'm telling you, and this forum isn't a >> >>suitalbe place for me to take you through a beginner's course in the >> >>subject. >> >> > Why, do you usually teach kindergarten? >> >> He wouldn't last 10 minutes. Kids that age always ask "Why?". It >> usually takes until 6th or 7th grade to brainwash that curiosity out of >> them. Then he might do OK. > > I did and do okay with my nieces and nephews. My grandnieces and > grandnephews don't yet know me well enough to use me as a databank. My own > parents primed me pretty well as a kid, so I don't usually have to work > too hard to find an answer to the usual "why" questions. It's not the "usual" ones that cause trouble.
From: z on 29 Nov 2008 04:50 On Nov 28, 8:20 am, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelati...(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > z wrote: > > and the fact that water vapor partial pressure rises with temperature, > > thereby making it an amplifier of other effects, such as CO2. > > An unproven hypothesis. i.e random noise. > > Graham well if that's your opinion, i'm never going to ask you to boil water for me.
From: z on 29 Nov 2008 05:02 On Nov 28, 8:25 am, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelati...(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > z wrote: > > bill.slo...(a)ieee.org wrote: > > > > > > > Besides, models only model LINEAR systems ! > > > > > > Oh really? Then the Spice models of transistors (which exhibit an > > > > > expotential - not linear - relationship between base voltage and > > > > > collector current) don't exist. > > > > > That IS a linear system as we describe them now. > > > > This is a minority opinion. Any student sharing it with their examiner > > > would fail that aspect of their exam, but since you clearly exercise > > > your mind by believing six impossible things before breakfast I > > > suppose we can write this off as part of the price you pay to maintain > > > your genius-level IQ. > > > well to be fair, he only said "linear"; could be he didn't mean the > > usual sense of "straight line" > > Quite so. A LINEAR equation can contain power, log, exp terms etc. "A linear equation is an algebraic equation in which each term is either a constant or the product of a constant and (the first power of) a single variable." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_equation "A linear equation is an algebraic equation of the form y=ax+b involving only a constant and a first-order (linear) term. " http://mathworld.wolfram.com/LinearEquation.html "A Linear Equation is an equation of the form m * X + c = 0 where X is the unknown. The name "linear" stems from the fact that the graph of this equation is a straight line." http://cs.gmu.edu/cne/modules/dau/algebra/equations/linear1_frm.html "Linear Equation An equation that can be written in the form ax + b = 0 where a and b are constants Note that the exponent (definition found in Tutorial 2: Integer Exponents) on the variable of a linear equation is always 1. " http://www.wtamu.edu/academic/anns/mps/math/mathlab/col_algebra/col_alg_tut14_lineareq.htm > But it CANNOT model CHAOS. And that's what weather and climate are. the chaos here seems to be your connection with the rest of the world via the medium of a shared language.
From: z on 29 Nov 2008 05:07
On Nov 28, 8:23 am, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelati...(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > > > take home exam: model the current vs voltage through a 1 ohm resistor > > which bunrns out at 1 watt of power dissipation, as the voltage goes > > from 0.5 volts to 1.5 volts, then explain how this is or isn't linear. > > You have a very limited view of the word LINEAR. I doubt you did much > math. > > Not unexpected really. LINEAR equations may contain power, logarithmic, > exponential terms etc. What they CANNOT do is model CHAOS. "A linear equation is an algebraic equation in which each term is either a constant or the product of a constant and (the first power of) a single variable." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_equation "A linear equation is an algebraic equation of the form y=ax+b involving only a constant and a first-order (linear) term. " http://mathworld.wolfram.com/LinearEquation.html "A Linear Equation is an equation of the form m * X + c = 0 where X is the unknown. The name "linear" stems from the fact that the graph of this equation is a straight line." http://cs.gmu.edu/cne/modules/dau/algebra/equations/linear1_frm.html "Linear Equation An equation that can be written in the form ax + b = 0 where a and b are constants Note that the exponent (definition found in Tutorial 2: Integer Exponents) on the variable of a linear equation is always 1. " http://www.wtamu.edu/academic/anns/mps/math/mathlab/col_algebra/col_alg_tut14_lineareq.htm and you get zero on the takehome exam as well. |