Through Hole vs. Surface Mount
in [Design]
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From: krw on 31 Mar 2010 23:56 On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 22:17:05 -0500, "Tim Williams" <tmoranwms(a)charter.net> wrote: ><krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote in message >news:n0l7r5tcr38eknf3iifg41gpb0gfq47tif(a)4ax.com... >> For small hacks I solder wire to components on perf board. > >Now that I've got PCBs down fairly well, I'm more inclined to make a proper >PCB than wire up perf board. We have a "prototype machine" for PCBs where I work now but it's never been used. ;-/ I really don't do much prototyping but there are some tools I'd like to build. The wire and perf board isn't very rugged. I hate debugging my test fixtures every time I use them. >It's hard to beat the density of perf board, though. You can pack >components wherever you want, overlapping as much as you want. DRC would >explode. > >Downside is, you have to place everything as you go, so you can end up >making some really awful circuits with way too many long jumpers, and it >takes forever when you've got a big circuit to wire up. I did say "small hacks". ;-)
From: JosephKK on 1 Apr 2010 00:40 On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 09:59:19 +0100, John Devereux <john(a)devereux.me.uk> wrote: >Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> writes: > >> Archimedes' Lever wrote: >>> On Tue, 30 Mar 2010 09:42:05 -0700, Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> All I can tell you is that there is no glop. I just did a few more >>>> solder joints and held them under a magnifier -> nada, zilch, >>>> clean. >>>> >>>> Maybe you used the wrong temperature? My Weller is running at 640F >>>> right now. >>> >>> >>> Most 'no-clean' hand operations I ever saw left the perfectly formed >>> solder joint encapsulated in a thin flux film. Are you sure that you are >>> not just too old or too non-detail oriented to 'see' it, even though it >>> is there? >>> >>> The flux does not evaporate, and is, by design, meant to remain, so it >>> *has* to be there... literally. >> >> >> Ok, but it hasn't corroded or otherwise tainted one lone solder joint >> in years. If it does cause a failure 300 years down the road I think I >> could live with that :-) > >We use it for everything, never had a problem either. > >I take "no-clean" to mean "do not clean". I have heard (here) of >problems when cleaning is attempted, the insulating component is washed >away leaving an ionic residue which can absorb water and conduct. Or >something. I have scant idea why i had a problem, but after a mod using "no clean", i had a bunch of conductive issues around the rework, and it seemed every thing i could think of would not clean it off, until i used abrasives. The board was never the same though. YMMV
From: JosephKK on 1 Apr 2010 00:41 On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:25:55 -0700, Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> wrote: >John Devereux wrote: >> Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> writes: >> >>> Archimedes' Lever wrote: >>>> On Tue, 30 Mar 2010 09:42:05 -0700, Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> All I can tell you is that there is no glop. I just did a few more >>>>> solder joints and held them under a magnifier -> nada, zilch, >>>>> clean. >>>>> >>>>> Maybe you used the wrong temperature? My Weller is running at 640F >>>>> right now. >>>> >>>> Most 'no-clean' hand operations I ever saw left the perfectly formed >>>> solder joint encapsulated in a thin flux film. Are you sure that you are >>>> not just too old or too non-detail oriented to 'see' it, even though it >>>> is there? >>>> >>>> The flux does not evaporate, and is, by design, meant to remain, so it >>>> *has* to be there... literally. >>> >>> Ok, but it hasn't corroded or otherwise tainted one lone solder joint >>> in years. If it does cause a failure 300 years down the road I think I >>> could live with that :-) >> >> We use it for everything, never had a problem either. >> >> I take "no-clean" to mean "do not clean". I have heard (here) of >> problems when cleaning is attempted, the insulating component is washed >> away leaving an ionic residue which can absorb water and conduct. Or >> something. >> > >Even then I had no problems. Many times in my lab I lash up jigs, on >Monday for example a tester to run transformers at 50Hz, 60Hz, 400Hz or >wherever. That stuff gets a beating over time, alligator clips are >attached to soldered areas over and over again so things become scraped. >Never a problem. Try it for high impedance circuits >> 1E7 Ohms.
From: Jim Yanik on 1 Apr 2010 09:41 "krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz" <krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote in news:n0l7r5tcr38eknf3iifg41gpb0gfq47tif(a)4ax.com: > On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 10:51:56 +0100, "Nial Stewart" ><nial*REMOVE_THIS*@nialstewartdevelopments.co.uk> wrote: > >>> I agree! >>> I personally don't understand why ANYONE would want to make their own >>> circuit boards. >>> There must be some level of satisfaction in rolling your own, but not >>> for me. Cost,for one. >> >> >>One advantage is being able to knock up a simple board to try something >>_now_ (or in a couple of hours) rather than in three days, but this is >>only really applicable to small hacks. >> >>Other than that it's not worth the hassle. > > For small hacks I solder wire to components on perf board. OTOH,I have a very small 7 component SMD IC project that I want to make a simple PCB for(.031 dbl clad) but don't have access to a laser printer to make the transfer(plus I don't have any CAD experience) and the IC pitch is too tiny to do it by hand.It's a power IC so it can't be breadboarded or dead-bug'd. I checked Express PCB,but their "cheap" way only does .062 and costs $51(for 3 boards). My parts only cost about $5 total for one unit. -- Jim Yanik jyanik at localnet dot com
From: Tim Williams on 1 Apr 2010 13:45
"Jim Yanik" <jyanik(a)abuse.gov> wrote in message news:Xns9D4D62B0AFA70jyaniklocalnetcom(a)216.168.3.44... > OTOH,I have a very small 7 component SMD IC project that I want to make a > simple PCB for(.031 dbl clad) but don't have access to a laser printer to > make the transfer(plus I don't have any CAD experience) and the IC pitch > is > too tiny to do it by hand.It's a power IC so it can't be breadboarded > or > dead-bug'd. > I checked Express PCB,but their "cheap" way only does .062 and costs > $51(for 3 boards). > My parts only cost about $5 total for one unit. I've heard rumors of ridiculously cheap PCB houses (e.g. under $20 for a regular ~4 x 6 board), but nobody ever gives names. I wonder if these shadow companies are only in business with the signed agreement that their customers cannot advertize them?! For a teensy board like that, though, you might look at BatchPCB. As for home production, I'm tempted to get photosensitive resist and inkjet transparency stock. That way I can print from my home inkjet without making a run to the library for toner copies, and that single copy will make hundreds of boards. Resolution is probably better too (plus, much less elbow grease!). Tim -- Deep Friar: a very philosophical monk. Website: http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms |