Bootable copy of XP partition.
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From: Paul on 22 Jun 2010 12:12 Bob Taylor wrote: > Paul wrote: >> >> Easeus Partition Master comes in a free version. No idea what feature >> set. >> > As I mentioned, this will not creat a bootable partition. I have been > assured by the support people that they cannot guarantee the copy will > be bootable. > > One can google and finds dozens, maybe hundreds, of programs which will > copy disks, but which one will do what I want, make a bootable xp > partition without reformating the entire target disk? > > I came to this newsgroup hoping you would know what google doesn't. > >> If you're going with a freebie, I recommend doing a backup >> first. All partitioning tools, even Partition Magic, have > > Pardon me! A bootable copy IS a backup. That's the point. > > > I use Partition Magic 7 here, for some of these operations. > As I mentioned, Partition Magic is no longer available. Again, I have > been so assured by support personel. I had the option of buying a newer > version of Partition Magic a few years ago and I much regret not doing so. > > > Thanks for your input. > > Bob Taylor OK, let's try this again. Does the Easeus tool copy a partition ? If not, I could create any partition type or size with Linux fdisk plus the variety of Linux formatting tools. Then, copy the files using the free Microsoft Robocopy. About the only thing I really need a partition tool for, is shrinking or expanding partitions. I suspect I can do the rest with other tools. These are some of the other needed ingredients: 1) A copy of all the OS files, and preferably the proper permissions on the files. Robocopy can not only copy files, but also preserve permissions. This is an example from my crib notes. I use version XP026 of Robocopy. robocopy C:\ F:\ /mir /copy:datso /dcopy:t /r:3 /w:2 /zb /np /tee /v /log:c_to_f.log This'll give a hint on how to get it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robocopy Of course, you can't copy OS files safely, while the OS is running, which is why I do that with a second Windows OS running (Win2K). But that is cheating. If Easeus can copy a partition, then that takes care of (1). I could probably copy the files with Linux, but I don't know whether permissions or ACLs would be handled properly or not in that case. Normally, I use Linux to get around permissions, which is why I wouldn't count on it. 2) Boot flag set in the MBR. This is 0x80 value, for the partition you want to be considered for boot. Note that, the MBR consists of 446 bytes of executable code, contains 4 sixteen byte primary partition entries, and a signature at the end of 0xAA55 . The "Fixmbr" command from the Windows Recovery Console, can write the proper 446 bytes onto a disk, without disturbing the rest of the MBR or trashing the partition entries. I use the fixmbr command, after an attempted Linux install left the wrong stuff in there for a subsequent Windows install. What I don't know, is if you can set the boot flag from Disk Management (OK, I see a "Mark partition as active" - maybe that is how you'd do it in Windows). I know I can set if from a Linux LiveCD, using their fdisk command to change the primary partition entries in the MBR. http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc749532(WS.10).aspx "Only one active partition can be set on a hard disk." On a data only hard disk, you don't need to have any partition with that 0x80 active flag present. The partition table can only have one entry with the flag, and if you're multibooting, the boot manager within that "prime" partition is responsible for bootstrapping any other partition via its menu entries. 3) Partition boot sector. This is inside the C: partition itself. If you copy files from the old C:, to the new C:, what will be missing, is the boot sector. I think it is actually 1536 bytes long (that is what TestDisk shows me). A duplicate copy is supposed to be at the end of the partition as well, but I've had partitions here with only one valid copy. The "fixboot" command from the Windows recovery console, can write the appropriate 1536 bytes. I've used this command, when moving my C: drive around. (I haven't investigated how to fix the partition boot stuff at the sector level, but it might be possible to just copy the correct offset and group of sectors, from one partition to the other. The Windows port of "dd" can do that. I've been using "fixboot" instead of doing it the hard way.) http://www.chrysocome.net/dd (takes a while to get comfortable with that one) You can look at the primary partition entries with this freebie. but it isn't doing anything more than show the numbers that are making the stuff in Disk Management for you. First link is a picture, second link is the download. You can see the boot flag of 0x80 marking the second partition. http://www.vistax64.com/attachments/vista-installation-setup/7308d1224108918-hidden-partiton-recovery-dell-xps-420-dell-tbl.gif ftp://ftp.symantec.com/public/english_us_canada/tools/pq/utilities/PTEDIT32.zip So, yeah, I think I could "bolt one together". While in theory, I could use GParted to shrink or expand a partition, I might instead investigate what utility it is calling underneath, and just use that tool instead. GParted is a GUI interface to some underlying set of utility programs. As far as I know, it is generating a script of commands to run. At the moment, since I have Partition Magic, I don't have much incentive to tear it apart and see how it works. HTH, Paul
From: Bob Taylor on 22 Jun 2010 12:33 dadiOH wrote: > > The simplest thing is to just install another (minimal) XP to the partition. Ok. > Doing so will create a boot menu from which you can boot should the > need/desire arise. To avoid confusion, you could rename the new XP install Ok. > to something like "XP - Basic" in the boot menu. OK But what about copying my existing OS? Do I just copy on top of this minimal partition? Not clear how this solves my problem. > > Alterntively, you can copy the existing XP and make a bootable CD. No way. My existing os is far from minimal, about 30gigs and growing. I have thought about using an external hard drive, but for some reason you can't boot XP from an external drive. > > You might also want to check out Paragon Hard Drive Manager, it will clone > one HD or partition to another. The same is true of the programs Yes, but will it clone a bootable partition without completely formating the target disk? Thanks for the help, Bob Taylor
From: Bob Taylor on 22 Jun 2010 13:05 Paul wrote: > > OK, let's try this again. > > Does the Easeus tool copy a partition ? Well, as I mentioned in my original message, it does, but the technical person assures me that they cannot guarantee it will be bootable. I think Partition Magic might do the job, but Norton assures me that they no longer sell it. I suppose one possibility would be to find a copy of partition magic on amazon or ebay. This I would do, if I were reasonably sure it would work. Of course there would be no support for it. Thanks again for your comments, Bob Taylor
From: bobster on 22 Jun 2010 14:08 Bob, Maybe I'm missing something here but it looks like you are making a fairly simple problem way too difficult. You definitely can boot from an externally mounted HD. For about 2 years I have been using an external HD enclosure with an HD that is physically identical to may main "C" drive HD. At first, I connected it via a USB2 port but discovered that it could be connected via one of my open SATA ports. I cloned my "C" drive to it and then was easily able to boot to it by selecting from the F12 boot menu on my Dell computer (all computers have this function available at boot but some use a different F key). The extra HD cost me about $50 and the VanTec enclosure about $35-40. Partitioning becomes irrelevant as everything that is on your "C" drive gets cloned to the external drive. So for less than $100 you can have a backup system that is bullet proof and ultra reliable that: 1) provides a bootable external HD that contains a clone of your "C" drive. 2) It can be selected during the boot cycle by pressing the appropriate Function key 3) It can be updated easily by making a new clone on a regular basis (I do it about once a week). Note, this a complete clone, not just a partition of your "C" drive By getting a SATA capable external enclosure and reliable cloning software (I use Casper 6.0) you can make a new clone in about six minutes (35Gigs) after an initial one-time "learning" pass of 20 or so minutes without the fuss and muss of Linux boot discs, etc. As a major side benefit, this configuration allows one unlimited freedom to "fool" around with potentially risky software changes to your "C" drive with the knowledge that a "clean" clone is just a click or two away. This feature has saved my bacon on many occasions. ============================================================= "Bob Taylor" <nospam(a)nospam.com> wrote in message news:eACQhiiELHA.1272(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... dadiOH wrote: > > The simplest thing is to just install another (minimal) XP to the > partition. Ok. > Doing so will create a boot menu from which you can boot should the > need/desire arise. To avoid confusion, you could rename the new XP > install Ok. > to something like "XP - Basic" in the boot menu. OK But what about copying my existing OS? Do I just copy on top of this minimal partition? Not clear how this solves my problem. > > Alterntively, you can copy the existing XP and make a bootable CD. No way. My existing os is far from minimal, about 30gigs and growing. I have thought about using an external hard drive, but for some reason you can't boot XP from an external drive. > > You might also want to check out Paragon Hard Drive Manager, it will clone > one HD or partition to another. The same is true of the programs Yes, but will it clone a bootable partition without completely formating the target disk? Thanks for the help, Bob Taylor
From: Paul on 22 Jun 2010 14:12
Bob Taylor wrote: > Paul wrote: > >> >> OK, let's try this again. >> >> Does the Easeus tool copy a partition ? > Well, as I mentioned in my original message, it does, but the technical > person assures me that they cannot guarantee it will be bootable. > > I think Partition Magic might do the job, but Norton assures me that > they no longer sell it. I suppose one possibility would be to find a > copy of partition magic on amazon or ebay. This I would do, if I were > reasonably sure it would work. Of course there would be no support for it. > > > Thanks again for your comments, > Bob Taylor Looking at this: http://www.partition-tool.com/easeus-partition-manager/comparison.html it says "Create bootable CD to manage partitions" is not offered in the Free edition. But that isn't the same thing as copying your bootable C: WinXP partition, to some other disk. I think that will work, and you have nothing to worry about. No "bolting" needed :-) If there was already a bootable partition on the other disk, that would be trouble. It would be the same issue if Partition Magic was involved. Only one partition can have the active flag set. So if the second disk is currently a "data" disk, and no partition is currently active (boot flag 0x80), then you should be able to copy the partition from the other disk. Other restrictions, are the number of partitions. You can have up to four primary partitions, or three primary and an extended. Within the extended, you can have a whole bunch of logical partitions. Primary partitions are the ones valued for their ability to be bootable, but only one at a time can have the flag set. I assume, but have never tried, to host two bootable partitions, and try flipping the boot flag back and forth between them. So give the Easeus thing a try. I couldn't see a reason for that restriction, because they'd have to go out of their way to break it. I mean, if they didn't want you to have it, it would be easier to simply not offer a free version. Paul |