ECMA-262-3 in detail. Chapter 8. Evaluation strategy.
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From: Ivan S on 12 Apr 2010 13:31 On Apr 12, 3:18 pm, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedE...(a)web.de> wrote: > Ivan S wrote: > > More fixed translation: > > "More fixed" is like "a bit pregnant" ;-) :) Ah, yes. I translated that literaly from my native language and it was supposed to mean: more translation fixes/corrections. > > "In Ruby, this strategy is named as by reference. Again, on (the) one > > "is named as by reference" is most certainly wrong. Perhaps "is named > 'by reference'" (to avoid the ambiguous "is called 'by reference'") was > meant. AFAIK the `the' must be omitted from the first part of the phrase. Should have been: "is named as 'by reference'". In original text, "by reference" is italic (as I remember), so I think it was supposed to be quotation. Ivan
From: Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn on 12 Apr 2010 14:56 Ivan S wrote: > Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >> Ivan S wrote: >> > "In Ruby, this strategy is named as by reference. Again, on (the) one >> >> "is named as by reference" is most certainly wrong. Perhaps "is named >> 'by reference'" (to avoid the ambiguous "is called 'by reference'") was >> meant. AFAIK the `the' must be omitted from the first part of the >> phrase. > > Should have been: "is named as 'by reference'". In original text, "by > reference" is italic (as I remember), so I think it was supposed to be > quotation. I figured as much. However, I am quite certain now that in this context the "as" does not belong: Something is named something else (in a specific context), _not_ "as something else". For the "as" changes the meaning: We named our son Charles, after his uncle. We name (i.e. call) this amazing property of our software "supercalifragilisticexpialidociousness". But: David Saker has been named as England bowling coach. M., 17, has been named as the suspect. Cancer has been named as the cause of her death. (from a quick Google search) Cf. <http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/british/name_2#name_2__3>, <http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/british/name_3#name_3__3>, <http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/name?view=uk> PointedEars -- realism: HTML 4.01 Strict evangelism: XHTML 1.0 Strict madness: XHTML 1.1 as application/xhtml+xml -- Bjoern Hoehrmann
From: Ivan S on 12 Apr 2010 15:11 On Apr 12, 8:56 pm, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedE...(a)web.de> wrote: > Ivan S wrote: > > Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: > >> Ivan S wrote: > >> > "In Ruby, this strategy is named as by reference. Again, on (the) one > > >> "is named as by reference" is most certainly wrong. Perhaps "is named > >> 'by reference'" (to avoid the ambiguous "is called 'by reference'") was > >> meant. AFAIK the `the' must be omitted from the first part of the > >> phrase. > > > Should have been: "is named as 'by reference'". In original text, "by > > reference" is italic (as I remember), so I think it was supposed to be > > quotation. > > I figured as much. However, I am quite certain now that in this context > the "as" does not belong: Something is named something else (in a specific > context), _not_ "as something else". For the "as" changes the meaning: > > We named our son Charles, after his uncle. > We name (i.e. call) this amazing property of our software > "supercalifragilisticexpialidociousness". > > But: > > David Saker has been named as England bowling coach. > M., 17, has been named as the suspect. > Cancer has been named as the cause of her death. > > (from a quick Google search) > > Cf. <http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/british/name_2#name_2__3>, > <http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/british/name_3#name_3__3>, > <http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/name?view=uk> Yes, I think you have a point, it should have been without "as". :) Ivan
From: Dmitry A. Soshnikov on 12 Apr 2010 16:28 On Apr 12, 5:18 pm, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedE...(a)web.de> wrote: > Ivan S wrote: > > More fixed translation: > > "More fixed" is like "a bit pregnant" ;-) > > > "In Ruby this strategy is named as by reference. Again, on the one > > hand it is passed not a copy of a big structure (i.e., seems, not by > > value), but on the other hand, we deal not with the original reference > > to object and cannot change it; consequently, this crossing in > > terminology again can confuse." > > > -> > > > "In Ruby, this strategy is named as by reference. Again, on (the) one > > "is named as by reference" is most certainly wrong. Perhaps "is named > 'by reference'" (to avoid the ambiguous "is called 'by reference'") was > meant. AFAIK the `the' must be omitted from the first part of the phrase. > > > hand it is not passed as a copy of a big structure (i.e., seems, not > > The predicate in the parenthesis is lacking a subject ("it"), and the > "i.e." does not seem to fit here. > Which fits better? > > by value), but on the other hand, we don't deal with the original > > Perhaps contractions should not be used in such texts, as it is more often > the case in writing than in speech. You have proposed "it is", not "it's", > so for consistency there should be "do not", not "don't" (except perhaps at > the end of a sentence). Another factor in favor of not using a contraction > here is that (as ISTM) the "not" is emphasized. > Yes, I need to know what is usually used in articles. What way is better? Not to use contractions? In Russian version I use more-less academical stylistics without (or decreasing) simple talking language phrases. So will it be better to write everywhere "do not" instead of "don't", "let us" instead of "let's" and so on? From the other hand, I of course, don't want to make the descriptions *too* pedantic; it isn't my objective. > > reference to object and cannot change it; consequently, this crossing > > in terminology again can be confusing." > > Either the em dash must be a comma, or both trailing punctuation marks must > be omitted from the phrase. So either: > > In Ruby, this strategy is named "by reference". Again, on one hand, it is > not passed as a copy of a big structure (i.e., it seems, not by value), > but on the other hand, we do not deal with the original ... > > Or: > > In Ruby, this strategy is named "by reference". Again, on one hand > it is not passed as a copy of a big structure (i.e., it seems, not by > value), but on the other hand we do not deal with the original ... > Ok, I'll take the last one, thanks. > <http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/on+the+one+hand...on+the+other+hand> > <http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/british/on-the-one-hand-on... > other-hand> > > The sentences are still overly long and complicated, which easily and > frequently happens in word-by-word translations (BTDT). One should try to > split them, and avoid the more complicated rhetorical figures, so that they > are better understood. Some commas might need to be omitted, too. > Yes, I know this, so that's why articles still open for wording and stylistics corrections. > Probably Michael Wojcik, of Rhetoric & Writing at Michigan State > University, who occasionally posts here, can provide further advice. > Yeah, he is welcome for help. Dmitry.
From: Dmitry A. Soshnikov on 12 Apr 2010 16:29
On Apr 12, 5:32 pm, Tim Down <timd...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Apr 12, 2:18 pm, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedE...(a)web.de> > wrote: > > > > "In Ruby, this strategy is named as by reference. Again, on (the) one > > > hand it is not passed as a copy of a big structure (i.e., seems, not > > > AFAIK the `the' must be omitted from the first part of the phrase. > > Not so. "on the one hand, ..." is perfectly good English. > Good to know ;) Dmitry. |