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From: Paul on 8 Jan 2007 02:46
biggy wrote:
> Hi Paul,
>
> Wow, great response just what I was looking for. I also went to Tom's
> website but I wasn't able to interpret the tests properly. Thanks to
> you I understand it better :-)
>
> As I have not used Intel processors for very long time (486DX2) and
> only been using AMD single processors, I find it difficult enough task
> comparing manufactures apples and oranges and with so many models of
> processors (Dou, Qua and more) and new ones coming out it can be mind
> boggling. Example the new Intel® Core™2 Duo E4300, 1.80-GHz @ 800Mhz
> w/ 2Mb Cache (Socket 775) which I am considering along with the Asrock
> MB. To make things worse getting the right balance between older
> components and new can be very challenging. With main objective of
> increasing the overall performance at minimal $$.
>
> I check the Asrock MB and it looks like it does support (Enhanced Halt
> State (C1E) and Enhanced Intel Speedstep® Technology
>
>>From the information you have provided to me it looks like I am on the
> right track. Here is some options I leaning towards.
>
> Motherboard:
>
> ASRock 775Dual-Vsta Socket 775, VIA PT880 Pro/Ultra Chipset w/ PCI
> Express x16 & 8x AGP (ATX) $79 CAN
>
> … Intel® Core™2 Duo E4300, 1.80-GHz @ 800Mhz w/ 2Mb Cache (Socket
> 775) $215
> I have to wait to see if the MB supports this CPU, but I am pretty sure
> it will. Looks like a good overclocker. Then again OClocking could be
> a problem I want could keep the stock cooling fan and keep the overall
> noise level low as possible.
>
> … Intel® Core™2 Duo E6300, 1.86-GHz @ 1066Mhz w/ 2Mb Cache (Socket
> 775) $215
>
> … Intel® Core™2 Duo E6600, 2.40-GHz @ 1066Mhz w/ 4Mb Cache (Socket
> 775) $380
> I am not sure if this worth it and can my older DDR PC3200 make use of
> the extra 2megs of cashe.
>
> Anymore comments would be appreciated.
>
> I like to thank everyone for their comments and a special thanks to
> Paul for his very informative reply.
>
> Jay
>

The E4300 may not be available just yet. And likely the BIOS files
will not be ready on time either.

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=36495

There are 196 reviews for the Asrock board here.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/CustratingReview.asp?item=N82E16813157092

One reviewer says:

"Pros: worked like a charm right out the box. forward and backward
compatability, runs e6400 without any modifications or problems.
fast standard shipping, of course

Cons: not a good overclocker, but i'm running 290 fsb on stock
cooler with no issues"

So they can go from 266MHz stock, to 290-300MHz. The board is not a
big overclocker, because the chipset is already overclocked to reach
266MHz. I don't think VIA has anything that is purpose-built for
FSB1066. Intel chipsets or perhaps an Nvidia or ATI recent chipset,
would have a better FSB. And ATI's latest may only be available on
a DFI board, whenever they finish it.

I'm not saying the Asrock board is all bad, it just isn't going to be
a lot of fun as an overclocker. It should be fine at stock speed.

The extra cache works and is not dependent on your memory. And as
for performance, it pays to find benchmarks, rather than rely on
theory. While I would hope a larger cache on a E6600 would help
with a slower memory subsystem, I'd rather see benchmarks for a
system as a whole, to see whether it delivers or not.

Paul
From: biggy on 8 Jan 2007 17:43
biggy wrote:
> Hi Paul,
>
> Wow, great response just what I was looking for. I also went to Tom’s
> website but I wasn’t able to interpret the tests properly. Thanks to
> you I understand it better :-)
>
> As I have not used Intel processors for very long time (486DX2) and
> only been using AMD single processors, I find it difficult enough task
> comparing manufactures apples and oranges and with so many models of
> processors (Dou, Qua and more) and new ones coming out it can be mind
> boggling. Example the new Intel® Core™2 Duo E4300, 1.80-GHz @ 800Mhz
> w/ 2Mb Cache (Socket 775) which I am considering along with the Asrock
> MB. To make things worse getting the right balance between older
> components and new can be very challenging. With main objective of
> increasing the overall performance at minimal $$.
>
> I check the Asrock MB and it looks like it does support (Enhanced Halt
> State (C1E) and Enhanced Intel Speedstep® Technology
>
>>From the information you have provided to me it looks like I am on the
> right track. Here is some options I leaning towards.
>
> Motherboard:
>
> ASRock 775Dual-Vsta Socket 775, VIA PT880 Pro/Ultra Chipset w/ PCI
> Express x16 & 8x AGP (ATX) $79 CAN
>
> … Intel® Core™2 Duo E4300, 1.80-GHz @ 800Mhz w/ 2Mb Cache (Socket
> 775) $215
> I have to wait to see if the MB supports this CPU, but I am pretty sure
> it will. Looks like a good overclocker. Then again OClocking could be
> a problem I want could keep the stock cooling fan and keep the overall
> noise level low as possible.
>
> … Intel® Core™2 Duo E6300, 1.86-GHz @ 1066Mhz w/ 2Mb Cache (Socket
> 775) $215
>
> … Intel® Core™2 Duo E6600, 2.40-GHz @ 1066Mhz w/ 4Mb Cache (Socket
> 775) $380
> I am not sure if this worth it and can my older DDR PC3200 make use of
> the extra 2megs of cashe.
>
> Anymore comments would be appreciated.
>
> I like to thank everyone for their comments and a special thanks to
> Paul for his very informative reply.
>
> Jay
>
Paul,

Thanks Again!

Since the Asrock is no such a good overclocker I leaning towards E6600
to hopfully get overall half decent speed at least 2.4Ghz and with some
luck a little more.

Just ran a test on my DDR PC3200

CPU CPU Clock Motherboard Chipset Memory CL-RCD-RP-RAS
AthlonXP 2133 MHz ECS 741(GX)-M SiS741(GX) Ext. PC3200 DDR

SDRAM 3-4-4-9 19 6.8 ns Latency

Definetly not the fastest ram :-( slowwww

At todays list price the min cost for this upgrade:

… E6600 $380
… Asrock MB $79
Tax $64.38

Total $523.38 It could go even higher if the ram has to be
upgraded. I was hope for something around $300.00 total, the E6300 or
the E4300 would be about that

I was having a look at Asrocks website over in Hong Kong, it looks like
they have another new board coming down the tube and I think it looks
pretty good. I have not found anyone selling it yet. It opens the door
for upgrading to Quad core and you can even keep some of your older
parts.

4CoreDual-VSTA

• LGA 775 for Intel® CoreTM 2 Extreme / CoreTM 2 Duo / Pentium® XE
/ Pentium® D / Pentium® 4 / Celeron® D, supporting Quad Core
Kentsfield processors
• VIA® PT880 Ultra Chipset
1. Supports FSB1066/800/533MHz processors and H-T Technology
2. Supports Dual Channel DDRII667 (DDRII x 2 DIMM slots) and DDR400
(DDR x 2 DIMM slots)
3. Untied Overclocking : During Overclocking, FSB enjoys better margin
due to fixed AGP/PCIE/ PCI Buses
4. 1 x PCI Express Graphics slot
5. 1 x AGP 8X slot
6. Hybrid Booster - Safe Overclocking Technology
7. 2 x SerialATA 1.5Gb/s connectors, support RAID 0, 1, JBOD functions
8. HDMI_SPDIF header, providing SPDIF audio output to HDMI VGA card,
allows the system to connect HDMI Digital TV/projector/LCD devices.
9. 7.1 CH Windows® Vista™ Premium Level HD Audio (ALC888 Audio
Codec)
10. Supports all features in Vista™ Premium
11. HD 8CH I/O: 4 ready-to-use USB2.0 ports, HD 7.1 channel audio jacks


Interesting eh!

Jay

From: Sylvain VAN DER WALDE on 8 Jan 2007 19:04

"biggy" <jpoy(a)sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:1168127847.766309.275090(a)i15g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Greetings!

I would like to upgrade my HTPC system lowest cost and get highest
performance and use as many components from my present system. Note I
am only look at upgrading my MB and CPU. Hopefully to tie me over for
total new system including Quad core blue ray etc. when the prices come
down in the future.

My present HTPC: Note: I am only using one CPU fan so my system is
nice and quiet and running cool. BTW. the MB and CPU combination is
max out.

CPU Type AMD Athlon XP,
2133 MHz (16 x 133) 2800+
Motherboard Name ECS 741(GX)-M
(3 PCI, 1 AGP, 1 CNR, 2 DDR DIMM, Audio, Video, LAN)
Motherboard Chipset SiS 741
System Memory 1024 MB
(PC3200 DDR SDRAM)

Duo Display:
Video Adapter ALL-IN-WONDER
9600 SERIES - Secondary (256 MB)
Video Adapter ALL-IN-WONDER
9600 SERIES (256 MB)
3D Accelerator ATI Radeon 9600
(RV350)

HDTV Wonder PCI

Here is the motherboard I was considering, ASRock 775Dual-Vsta Socket
775, VIA PT880 Pro/Ultra Chipset w/ PCI Express x16 & 8x AGP (ATX)

I've just bought this board, and am very pleased with it.
It runs happily with an Intel D930 3 GHz Dual Core CPU. I had to get that
board because the Asus P5P800 SE one wouldn't run with it (although Asus say
that they are compatible).

I selected this motherboard because it supports AGP, unfortunately this
board is not a real good OC. I would also like to use my PC3200 (400
Mhz.) Ram which would limit my OC potential.

Why do you want to overclock? Are you a "gamer"? If not, don't bother.
BTW, this board has tremendous overclocking facilities (particularly for the
Ram).
This board uses both DDR and DDR2 RAM (but not both at once).

What CPU would you select to get best performance at lowest overall
cost? I don't mind paying more money if I really can get the true
performance out of the 2 Duo core E6400 but something tell me that my
old components won't let it happen and it would be waste of $$?

That motherboard is Conroe ready: 533-800-1066 FSB.
It is suitable (according to Asrock) for most of the later Intel processors
(Dual Core, etc..).

2 Duo core
E4400 FSB 800MZ 9X mult, E6300 $215.
E6400 FSB1032 mult 8x $260
or E6600 $380

Pentium� 4 -524, 3.0-GHz @ 533Mhz w/ 1Mb EM64T (Socket 775) $99
Pentium� 4 -541, x64, 3.2-GHz @ 800Mhz w/ 1Mb (Socket 775) $125

Any other suggestions maybe there other options I overlooked?

What is an HTPC system? Are you talking about HyperThreading?

Sylvain.

Thanks!



From: biggy on 8 Jan 2007 20:09
Sylvain VAN DER WALDE wrote:
> "biggy" <jpoy(a)sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:1168127847.766309.275090(a)i15g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> > I've just bought this board, and am very pleased with it.
> It runs happily with an Intel D930 3 GHz Dual Core CPU. I had to get that
> board because the Asus P5P800 SE one wouldn't run with it (although Asus say
> that they are compatible).
>
>
> Why do you want to overclock? Are you a "gamer"? If not, don't bother.
> BTW, this board has tremendous overclocking facilities (particularly for the
> Ram).
> This board uses both DDR and DDR2 RAM (but not both at once).
>
> >
> That motherboard is Conroe ready: 533-800-1066 FSB.
> It is suitable (according to Asrock) for most of the later Intel processors
> (Dual Core, etc..).
>
> >
> Pentium® 4 -524, 3.0-GHz @ 533Mhz w/ 1Mb EM64T (Socket 775) $99
> Pentium® 4 -541, x64, 3.2-GHz @ 800Mhz w/ 1Mb (Socket 775) $125
>
> > What is an HTPC system? Are you talking about HyperThreading?
>
> Sylvain.
>
> Thanks!

Hi Sylvain,

A home theater PC, or HTPC for short, is a personal computer connected
to a television. It is often used as a digital photo, music, and video
player, or as a Computer and video games device. Adding a TV tuner card
allows an HTPC to record television as well. They may also be referred
to as media center systems or Media Server units. The general goal in a
HTPC is usually to combine many or all components of a home theater
setup into one box.
There are several "approaches and degrees" to building a HTPC. I
started mind about a year ago and it seems to keep on growing, from
sharing cable satilite OTA HDTV via networking many of PC's, dual
monitors, MS Media HD WMV file, PVR, TIVO, ipod, kareokee, video, photo
editing, gaming over entire network and much more. You can start by
simply connecting your TV to your computer.

Carrying to another level would tie in securritey system lighting etc
to the HTPC, but that's not my objective now.

All I want is a Quiet, Efficient Home Theater PC that suits my needs.
I would prefer not OC, but in order to keep the cost down for this
upgrade and get the Processing speed I need I would.

Jay

From: Sylvain VAN DER WALDE on 10 Jan 2007 10:38

"biggy" <jpoy(a)sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:1168304960.798722.244130(a)v33g2000cwv.googlegroups.com...
Sylvain VAN DER WALDE wrote:
> "biggy" <jpoy(a)sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:1168127847.766309.275090(a)i15g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> > I've just bought this board, and am very pleased with it.
> It runs happily with an Intel D930 3 GHz Dual Core CPU. I had to get that
> board because the Asus P5P800 SE one wouldn't run with it (although Asus
> say
> that they are compatible).
>
>
> Why do you want to overclock? Are you a "gamer"? If not, don't bother.
> BTW, this board has tremendous overclocking facilities (particularly for
> the
> Ram).
> This board uses both DDR and DDR2 RAM (but not both at once).
>
> >
> That motherboard is Conroe ready: 533-800-1066 FSB.
> It is suitable (according to Asrock) for most of the later Intel
> processors
> (Dual Core, etc..).
>
> >
> Pentium� 4 -524, 3.0-GHz @ 533Mhz w/ 1Mb EM64T (Socket 775) $99
> Pentium� 4 -541, x64, 3.2-GHz @ 800Mhz w/ 1Mb (Socket 775) $125
>
> > What is an HTPC system? Are you talking about HyperThreading?
>
> Sylvain.
>
> Thanks!

Hi Sylvain,

A home theater PC, or HTPC for short, is a personal computer connected
to a television. It is often used as a digital photo, music, and video
player, or as a Computer and video games device. Adding a TV tuner card
allows an HTPC to record television as well. They may also be referred
to as media center systems or Media Server units. The general goal in a
HTPC is usually to combine many or all components of a home theater
setup into one box.
There are several "approaches and degrees" to building a HTPC. I
started mind about a year ago and it seems to keep on growing, from
sharing cable satilite OTA HDTV via networking many of PC's, dual
monitors, MS Media HD WMV file, PVR, TIVO, ipod, kareokee, video, photo
editing, gaming over entire network and much more. You can start by
simply connecting your TV to your computer.

Carrying to another level would tie in securritey system lighting etc
to the HTPC, but that's not my objective now.

All I want is a Quiet, Efficient Home Theater PC that suits my needs.
I would prefer not OC, but in order to keep the cost down for this
upgrade and get the Processing speed I need I would.

Thanks for your nice comprehensive answer. It's nice to come across an
obviously nice person, after that _horribly self-opinionated_ idiot Rod.

Sylvain.

Jay


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