From: jmfbahciv on 3 Jan 2007 10:11 In article <engd0e$k5g$1(a)blue.rahul.net>, kensmith(a)green.rahul.net (Ken Smith) wrote: >In article <1167795024.451323.271660(a)n51g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, >Winfield Hill <hill(a)rowland.org> wrote: >>Ken Smith wrote: >>> Americans don't want to pick lettuce. So long as there is a strong market >>> for the labor with political clout, the fence won't be built or effective >>> if it is. >> >> Plenty of Americans DO pick lettuce. But they don't want to work for >> factory farms at $4 or $5 per hour doing it; they need $8 to $10 to >> make it reasonable. It's a bit surprising to realize that this labor >> cost difference would only modestly raise the final selling price. >> And, if all the growers had to live by the same wage rules, for the >> most part it wouldn't greatly affect their profits either. > >The "wouldn't greatly effect" seems to be the hard part of your argument. >The factory farmer operators are knowingly hiring people who have no right >to work in the country. They, at least, have the issue of the risks they >are taking pushing them away from doing this. The pay difference is the >only motive you have allowed for them to do this. This suggests that in >their opinion, the pay difference is significant. > >Perhaps you could argue along the "if any do it, they all must to remain >competitive" line, but I don't think that works either. These people work >against the US gaining control of its border. Since gaining control of >the border would effect all farmers, they would not see this as something >they need to do for competitive reasons. > Human labor is required. Now that people can't hire kids to do the work, there is a job market for people who can work cheaply. /BAH
From: jmfbahciv on 3 Jan 2007 10:13 In article <459B42B0.AF5E7A6B(a)hotmail.com>, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Ken Smith wrote: > >> unsettled <unsettled(a)nonsense.com> wrote: >> >> >Once the terrorism eventually drops into oblivion the >> >wiretaps will also cease. >> >> I doubt it. When did the honey bee subsidy end? It was needed encourage >> bee keeping to make wax for bullets. >> >> >All this assumes the terrorists lose. >> >> I am confident that the method to terrorism will remain in use for a long >> time. It will be new groups with new reasons. > >It's been with us at least since the time of the Roman Empire. > >I doubt that terrorism will suddenly cease to be an attractive option for those >who want to make a big impact with relatively few followers. You keep assuming that this mindset exists. That is what the mindset of moderates need to change to; but it hasn't yet. /BAH
From: jmfbahciv on 3 Jan 2007 10:14 In article <45999E2D.56197467(a)hotmail.com>, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Ken Smith wrote: > >> Until someone is found guilty of a crime, that person has the full rights >> under US law. > >Unless *suspected* of terrorism of course in which case their rights are voided. If you agree with Ken's statement, you are also agreeing to be a subject of the US Constitution. If that is the case, you can find your tax forms at irs.gov. /BAH
From: jmfbahciv on 3 Jan 2007 10:21 In article <45999D6B.96DDFDF1(a)hotmail.com>, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > > >jmfbahciv(a)aol.com wrote: > >> kensmith(a)green.rahul.net (Ken Smith) wrote: >> > >> >You should care. It is the very things that have made the US a free >> >country that are being lost. >> >> I see. You cannot list those who are denied their US Constituional >> rights. Perhaps those who are being monitored under this law >> are those who have no Constitutional rights? IOW, they are not >> of this country but are an enemy of this country. > >So who gets to decide if they're an enemy ? The Patriot Act specifies who. Actions demonstate who are enemies. Letters of intent give pointers to who is an enemy. > >What happens if someone denounces *YOU* for example. As you people have denounced me in this thread? Nothing happens to me. I do need to make a decision on whether it's useful to continue to educate and learn in order to prevent messes from happening. > >You can then be 'disappeared' I have no idea where you are getting this notion. You didn't happen to watch a certain "Law and Order" TV show, did you? Hint. Those stories are fiction and have started other urban myths. >and you'll simply officially cease to exist. I >believe this kind of thing was reputedly common in Communist Russia. I don't think I'll officially cease to exist. That means that I no longer have to pay property and income taxes. /BAH
From: unsettled on 3 Jan 2007 10:31
jmfbahciv(a)aol.com wrote: > In article <45999D6B.96DDFDF1(a)hotmail.com>, > Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > >> >>jmfbahciv(a)aol.com wrote: >> >> >>> kensmith(a)green.rahul.net (Ken Smith) wrote: >>> >>>>You should care. It is the very things that have made the US a free >>>>country that are being lost. >>> >>>I see. You cannot list those who are denied their US Constituional >>>rights. Perhaps those who are being monitored under this law >>>are those who have no Constitutional rights? IOW, they are not >>>of this country but are an enemy of this country. >> >>So who gets to decide if they're an enemy ? > > > The Patriot Act specifies who. Actions demonstate who are enemies. > Letters of intent give pointers to who is an enemy. > >>What happens if someone denounces *YOU* for example. > > > As you people have denounced me in this thread? Nothing happens to me. > I do need to make a decision on whether it's useful to continue > to educate and learn in order to prevent messes from happening. > > >>You can then be 'disappeared' > > > I have no idea where you are getting this notion. You didn't > happen to watch a certain "Law and Order" TV show, did you? > Hint. Those stories are fiction and have started other > urban myths. > > >>and you'll simply officially cease to exist. I >>believe this kind of thing was reputedly common in Communist Russia. > > > I don't think I'll officially cease to exist. That means that > I no longer have to pay property and income taxes. He's been watching reruns of "The Prisoner" TV series. LOL |