Laptop and an expansion box questions??????
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From: PeoplesChoice on 8 Jul 2010 12:01 This sounds like a good solution. Are you sure nothing will conflict? On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 19:47:52 -0600, "peter" <peter(a)nowhere.net> wrote: >Build 2 Desktops that are exactly the same..Mobo/RAM/Video/ Operating system >Use a Case that has removable HD bays...not necesary but it makes it easier >Set up one with OS and programs of your Choice. >Remove the HD and place it in the other Computer...since both have exactly >the same >hardware everything will function as if you were on the 1st computer. > >So when your in Rhode Island doing work on your system you would remove the >HD >and when you go to Texas you would insert that HD into the Texas computer >and >you would be right where you left off in RI > >peter > > > >If you find a posting or message from me offensive,inappropriate or >disruptive,please ignore it. If you dont know how to ignore a posting >complain to me and I will be only too happy to demonstrate :-) >wrote in message news:jq6a365h85ks3jdcoh9406rd8j076vkd9c(a)4ax.com... > >Thanks all for your comments. I would consider a desktop at each end - >but how do I move the hard drive from one to the other so that I'm always >current? Then there's the backup drive problem. A backup is a MUST!!! > > >On Wed, 07 Jul 2010 14:19:43 -0400, PeoplesChoice(a)Chicago.net wrote: > >>I live in two locations: Rhode Island & Texas. I intend to buy a high >>powered laptop (probably Lenovo) so that all my apps are on one computer. >>That way, I'll have the laptop at whichever location I'm at. My problem >>is that I would like something like an expansion box so that I can use >>and/or change some hardware (like a graphics card) when I choose. The >>laptop is not conducive to this. If I did this, I'd have a duplicate >>expansion box in both locations. I'm thinking: the best of both worlds: >>I can have my PC while traveling - and not have to travel with a desktop. >>Overall, I'm thinking this would be both practical and cheaper than a >>desktop. Lenovo doesn't have what I want. Does my idea have merit? If >>so, are there any limitations to what I can put in the expansion box and >>be able to connect to it? Please give me some ideas. Thanks......
From: PeoplesChoice on 8 Jul 2010 12:04 Also, I've never built a computer before - although I'd like to. My concern is: will everything I buy (all components) work with each other? Is there a way to find out? If I build, I would build a very high end desktop. BTW, what is the difference between a desktop and a workstation? That has always confused me. Thank you. Bob On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 19:47:52 -0600, "peter" <peter(a)nowhere.net> wrote: >Build 2 Desktops that are exactly the same..Mobo/RAM/Video/ Operating system >Use a Case that has removable HD bays...not necesary but it makes it easier >Set up one with OS and programs of your Choice. >Remove the HD and place it in the other Computer...since both have exactly >the same >hardware everything will function as if you were on the 1st computer. > >So when your in Rhode Island doing work on your system you would remove the >HD >and when you go to Texas you would insert that HD into the Texas computer >and >you would be right where you left off in RI > >peter > > > >If you find a posting or message from me offensive,inappropriate or >disruptive,please ignore it. If you dont know how to ignore a posting >complain to me and I will be only too happy to demonstrate :-) >wrote in message news:jq6a365h85ks3jdcoh9406rd8j076vkd9c(a)4ax.com... > >Thanks all for your comments. I would consider a desktop at each end - >but how do I move the hard drive from one to the other so that I'm always >current? Then there's the backup drive problem. A backup is a MUST!!! > > >On Wed, 07 Jul 2010 14:19:43 -0400, PeoplesChoice(a)Chicago.net wrote: > >>I live in two locations: Rhode Island & Texas. I intend to buy a high >>powered laptop (probably Lenovo) so that all my apps are on one computer. >>That way, I'll have the laptop at whichever location I'm at. My problem >>is that I would like something like an expansion box so that I can use >>and/or change some hardware (like a graphics card) when I choose. The >>laptop is not conducive to this. If I did this, I'd have a duplicate >>expansion box in both locations. I'm thinking: the best of both worlds: >>I can have my PC while traveling - and not have to travel with a desktop. >>Overall, I'm thinking this would be both practical and cheaper than a >>desktop. Lenovo doesn't have what I want. Does my idea have merit? If >>so, are there any limitations to what I can put in the expansion box and >>be able to connect to it? Please give me some ideas. Thanks......
From: Paul on 8 Jul 2010 15:49 PeoplesChoice(a)Chicago.net wrote: > Also, I've never built a computer before - although I'd like to. My > concern is: will everything I buy (all components) work with each other? > Is there a way to find out? If I build, I would build a very high end > desktop. BTW, what is the difference between a desktop and a > workstation? That has always confused me. Thank you. > > Bob At one time, the situation might have looked like this 1) Regular motherboard - desktop processor, two busses (PCI, video slot) 2) Workstation motherboard - desktop processor, three busses (PCI, PCI-X, video slot) or alternately, single server processor - occasionally, added disk interfaces like SAS (serial SCSI) The PCI-X might have been valued, for the addition of a plug in RAID controller. At one time, there was a better selection of PCI-X, and not as many choices for PCI Express. 3) Server motherboard - one, two, four processor sockets, gobs of RAM (up to 192GB), - pretty weird choices for expansion slots, crappy built-in video (because it isn't meant for gaming) If you look at the boards here, the distinction is getting blurred. I don't think the "WS" boards here have PCI-X, and seem to have more fully wired x16 PCI Express slots. http://usa.asus.com/ProductGroup2.aspx?PG_ID=mKyCKlQ4oSEtSu5m For high end, all you really need is LGA1366, and at least one PCI Express x16 slot for a video card, and voila, you're done. ASUS P6X58D Premium LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX $310 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131614 You check the web site, for what kind of processors are supported. http://support.asus.com.tw/cpusupport/cpusupport.aspx?SLanguage=en-us&model=P6X58D%20Premium You download the user manual (before buying anything), to study your purchase more carefully. For example, you'd learn it could benefit from a three stick kit of DDR3 memory as a minimum configuration. (The choice you make here, when queried about the OS, doesn't affect the offering of PDF manuals for download.) http://support.asus.com.tw/download/download.aspx?SLanguage=en-us&model=P6X58D%20Premium I study the picture of the motherboard pretty carefully, as the location and type of expansion slots is important. If we look at the picture here, a high end video card goes in the left-most dark blue expansion slot. Then, assume the cooler on the video card, covers the next two slots. That leaves room to use only one, powder-blue PCI slot, for a good sound card. So this layout barely satisfies my desired add-in cards. http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/13-131-614-Z03?$S640W$ In this example, I could use the left-most dark blue PCI Express slot for the good video card, leave two blank, use a white PCI slot for a sound card, and have a second white PCI slot for my favorite TV tuner card. You have to plan ahead, and think of what toys you might add, to select the right motherboard. Of course, many add-in functions also come in PCI Express format, and an x1 card can be plugged into an x16 slot. A "bigger slot" can accept "smaller" PCI Express cards. http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/13-157-150-S03?$S640W$ The high end video cards, can have relatively high power consumption. (Scroll half way down, to see a GTX 480 uses 262 watts) http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/gigabyte-gf-gtx400_6.html#sect0 You check the video card picture, for the power connectors needed. This one, has a 2x3 and a 2x4 connector, in the bottom right of the photo. http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/14-130-558-Z05?$S640W$ This is what the advertisement for that video card lists for power: "System Requirements Minimum of a 600 Watt power supply. (Minimum recommended power supply with +12 Volt current rating of 42 Amps.) Power Connector 6 pin / 8 pin" Those include some assumptions on the part of the person making up that 600 watt number. We know we have a 130 watt processor, and a 262 watt video card, which is 392 watts all coming from +12V. The motherboard chipset and RAM uses another 50W. A hard drive is 12W. A CD/DVD is 25W. These are numbers to use for a ballpark figure for the supply. Now, we're up to 479 watts, and the supply should have a bit of expansion room. (It doesn't draw 479 watts all the time. That is the peak gaming power. At idle, the processor could be 12W, the video card 42.1 watts, so in non-gaming situations, power usage is a lot lower. In fact, when I quote 479 watts, you're unlikely to actually be able to hit that number. Your consumption will be somewhat less. But there is little point in "just scraping by", when you've spent so much money on the rest of it. If you were on a tight budget, you might buy this. (has two PCI Express connectors, just enough for the high end video card) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139005 and for a bit more margin, you could get this. The 80% efficiency rating of these, helps reduce the waste heat contributed by the power supply itself. The best supplies you can get, are about 87% efficient, but they cheat (in the same way they cheat on air conditioner efficiency). The 87% supplies are only 87% efficient, as long as virtually all the power comes from the +12V rail. If you draw significant power from 3.3V or 5V, the efficiency of the 87% supply drops quite a bit. In any case, you don't want an ordinary supply, at 68% efficiency, because the heat pouring out of there, when it is supplying the 479 watt load, would be quite bad. (has more PCI Express power cables) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006 http://www.corsair.com/_images/charts/tx750w_efficiency.jpg http://www.corsair.com/_productmanuals/P49-00002%20TX%20Manual%20Read%20layout.pdf Part of the fun of building a computer, is avoiding mechanical issues. For example, your high end video card is 10.6" long, while the motherboard is 9.6" wide. That means the end of the video card, extends past the edge of the motherboard. It can bump into the hard drive rack. This case, has the lower rack turned sideways. There might be enough room here. You can use the holes in the motherboard tray, as a guide as to where 9.6" is. (In this example, 9.6" would be slightly to the right, of the right-most screw hole in the picture. Add an inch onto that, leaves a bit of room to the rack.) "Antec Sonata Proto Black" http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/11-129-086-Z06?$S640W$ Picking a good case, is perhaps the toughest job of all, as there are hundreds of cases, and not many of them are winners. Paul
From: PeoplesChoice on 8 Jul 2010 17:37 Paul, thanks very much for all the detail. It's going to take me a while to go through all the URLs - and to understand the whole picture. This is the first time I've come across someone so knowledgable in building a computer. If you were willing to 'hold my hand' while I go through this information (and build my first PC), may I suggest we start using email. If you agree, how do we exchange email addresses without letting the world know what they are? I would consider myself fairly proficient in using a PC (but not nearly up to YOUR speed). With help, I'm fully capable of buiding a unit. I'm 65 years old and live both in the Northeast and in Texas. I'm a retired engineer (both Electronic and Quality). Willing to help??? On Thu, 08 Jul 2010 15:49:12 -0400, Paul <nospam(a)needed.com> wrote: >PeoplesChoice(a)Chicago.net wrote: >> Also, I've never built a computer before - although I'd like to. My >> concern is: will everything I buy (all components) work with each other? >> Is there a way to find out? If I build, I would build a very high end >> desktop. BTW, what is the difference between a desktop and a >> workstation? That has always confused me. Thank you. >> >> Bob > >At one time, the situation might have looked like this > >1) Regular motherboard - desktop processor, two busses (PCI, video slot) > >2) Workstation motherboard - desktop processor, three busses (PCI, PCI-X, video slot) > or alternately, single server processor > - occasionally, added disk interfaces like SAS (serial SCSI) > > The PCI-X might have been valued, for the addition of a plug in RAID controller. > At one time, there was a better selection of PCI-X, and not as > many choices for PCI Express. > >3) Server motherboard - one, two, four processor sockets, gobs of RAM (up to 192GB), > - pretty weird choices for expansion slots, > crappy built-in video (because it isn't meant for gaming) > >If you look at the boards here, the distinction is getting blurred. I >don't think the "WS" boards here have PCI-X, and seem to have more >fully wired x16 PCI Express slots. > >http://usa.asus.com/ProductGroup2.aspx?PG_ID=mKyCKlQ4oSEtSu5m > >For high end, all you really need is LGA1366, and at least one >PCI Express x16 slot for a video card, and voila, you're done. > >ASUS P6X58D Premium LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX $310 >http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131614 > >You check the web site, for what kind of processors are supported. > >http://support.asus.com.tw/cpusupport/cpusupport.aspx?SLanguage=en-us&model=P6X58D%20Premium > >You download the user manual (before buying anything), to study your >purchase more carefully. For example, you'd learn it could benefit >from a three stick kit of DDR3 memory as a minimum configuration. >(The choice you make here, when queried about the OS, doesn't affect >the offering of PDF manuals for download.) > >http://support.asus.com.tw/download/download.aspx?SLanguage=en-us&model=P6X58D%20Premium > >I study the picture of the motherboard pretty carefully, as the >location and type of expansion slots is important. If we look >at the picture here, a high end video card goes in the left-most >dark blue expansion slot. Then, assume the cooler on the video card, >covers the next two slots. That leaves room to use only one, powder-blue >PCI slot, for a good sound card. So this layout barely satisfies my >desired add-in cards. > >http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/13-131-614-Z03?$S640W$ > >In this example, I could use the left-most dark blue PCI Express >slot for the good video card, leave two blank, use a white PCI slot >for a sound card, and have a second white PCI slot for my favorite >TV tuner card. You have to plan ahead, and think of what toys you >might add, to select the right motherboard. Of course, many add-in >functions also come in PCI Express format, and an x1 card can be plugged >into an x16 slot. A "bigger slot" can accept "smaller" PCI Express >cards. > >http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/13-157-150-S03?$S640W$ > >The high end video cards, can have relatively high power consumption. > >(Scroll half way down, to see a GTX 480 uses 262 watts) >http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/gigabyte-gf-gtx400_6.html#sect0 > >You check the video card picture, for the power connectors needed. >This one, has a 2x3 and a 2x4 connector, in the bottom right of the photo. > >http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/14-130-558-Z05?$S640W$ > >This is what the advertisement for that video card lists for power: > > "System Requirements Minimum of a 600 Watt power supply. > (Minimum recommended power supply with +12 Volt > current rating of 42 Amps.) > Power Connector 6 pin / 8 pin" > >Those include some assumptions on the part of the person making up that >600 watt number. We know we have a 130 watt processor, and a 262 watt >video card, which is 392 watts all coming from +12V. The motherboard >chipset and RAM uses another 50W. A hard drive is 12W. A CD/DVD is 25W. >These are numbers to use for a ballpark figure for the supply. >Now, we're up to 479 watts, and the supply should have a bit of >expansion room. (It doesn't draw 479 watts all the time. That is the >peak gaming power. At idle, the processor could be 12W, the video card >42.1 watts, so in non-gaming situations, power usage is a lot lower. >In fact, when I quote 479 watts, you're unlikely to actually be able >to hit that number. Your consumption will be somewhat less. But there >is little point in "just scraping by", when you've spent so much >money on the rest of it. > >If you were on a tight budget, you might buy this. > >(has two PCI Express connectors, just enough for the high end video card) >http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139005 > >and for a bit more margin, you could get this. The 80% efficiency >rating of these, helps reduce the waste heat contributed by the >power supply itself. The best supplies you can get, are about >87% efficient, but they cheat (in the same way they cheat on >air conditioner efficiency). The 87% supplies are only 87% efficient, >as long as virtually all the power comes from the +12V rail. If >you draw significant power from 3.3V or 5V, the efficiency of >the 87% supply drops quite a bit. In any case, you don't want >an ordinary supply, at 68% efficiency, because the heat pouring >out of there, when it is supplying the 479 watt load, would be >quite bad. > >(has more PCI Express power cables) >http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006 > >http://www.corsair.com/_images/charts/tx750w_efficiency.jpg > >http://www.corsair.com/_productmanuals/P49-00002%20TX%20Manual%20Read%20layout.pdf > >Part of the fun of building a computer, is avoiding mechanical >issues. For example, your high end video card is 10.6" long, >while the motherboard is 9.6" wide. That means the end of the >video card, extends past the edge of the motherboard. It can >bump into the hard drive rack. > >This case, has the lower rack turned sideways. There might >be enough room here. You can use the holes in the motherboard >tray, as a guide as to where 9.6" is. (In this example, 9.6" >would be slightly to the right, of the right-most screw >hole in the picture. Add an inch onto that, leaves a bit of >room to the rack.) > >"Antec Sonata Proto Black" >http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/11-129-086-Z06?$S640W$ > >Picking a good case, is perhaps the toughest job of all, >as there are hundreds of cases, and not many of them are >winners. > > Paul
From: PeoplesChoice on 8 Jul 2010 17:39
I forgot to mention that I'd like to build the 'best' with quality components. From your email, considering the spec detail, I think that's where you're coming from too. On Thu, 08 Jul 2010 15:49:12 -0400, Paul <nospam(a)needed.com> wrote: >PeoplesChoice(a)Chicago.net wrote: >> Also, I've never built a computer before - although I'd like to. My >> concern is: will everything I buy (all components) work with each other? >> Is there a way to find out? If I build, I would build a very high end >> desktop. BTW, what is the difference between a desktop and a >> workstation? That has always confused me. Thank you. >> >> Bob > >At one time, the situation might have looked like this > >1) Regular motherboard - desktop processor, two busses (PCI, video slot) > >2) Workstation motherboard - desktop processor, three busses (PCI, PCI-X, video slot) > or alternately, single server processor > - occasionally, added disk interfaces like SAS (serial SCSI) > > The PCI-X might have been valued, for the addition of a plug in RAID controller. > At one time, there was a better selection of PCI-X, and not as > many choices for PCI Express. > >3) Server motherboard - one, two, four processor sockets, gobs of RAM (up to 192GB), > - pretty weird choices for expansion slots, > crappy built-in video (because it isn't meant for gaming) > >If you look at the boards here, the distinction is getting blurred. I >don't think the "WS" boards here have PCI-X, and seem to have more >fully wired x16 PCI Express slots. > >http://usa.asus.com/ProductGroup2.aspx?PG_ID=mKyCKlQ4oSEtSu5m > >For high end, all you really need is LGA1366, and at least one >PCI Express x16 slot for a video card, and voila, you're done. > >ASUS P6X58D Premium LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX $310 >http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131614 > >You check the web site, for what kind of processors are supported. > >http://support.asus.com.tw/cpusupport/cpusupport.aspx?SLanguage=en-us&model=P6X58D%20Premium > >You download the user manual (before buying anything), to study your >purchase more carefully. For example, you'd learn it could benefit >from a three stick kit of DDR3 memory as a minimum configuration. >(The choice you make here, when queried about the OS, doesn't affect >the offering of PDF manuals for download.) > >http://support.asus.com.tw/download/download.aspx?SLanguage=en-us&model=P6X58D%20Premium > >I study the picture of the motherboard pretty carefully, as the >location and type of expansion slots is important. If we look >at the picture here, a high end video card goes in the left-most >dark blue expansion slot. Then, assume the cooler on the video card, >covers the next two slots. That leaves room to use only one, powder-blue >PCI slot, for a good sound card. So this layout barely satisfies my >desired add-in cards. > >http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/13-131-614-Z03?$S640W$ > >In this example, I could use the left-most dark blue PCI Express >slot for the good video card, leave two blank, use a white PCI slot >for a sound card, and have a second white PCI slot for my favorite >TV tuner card. You have to plan ahead, and think of what toys you >might add, to select the right motherboard. Of course, many add-in >functions also come in PCI Express format, and an x1 card can be plugged >into an x16 slot. A "bigger slot" can accept "smaller" PCI Express >cards. > >http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/13-157-150-S03?$S640W$ > >The high end video cards, can have relatively high power consumption. > >(Scroll half way down, to see a GTX 480 uses 262 watts) >http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/gigabyte-gf-gtx400_6.html#sect0 > >You check the video card picture, for the power connectors needed. >This one, has a 2x3 and a 2x4 connector, in the bottom right of the photo. > >http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/14-130-558-Z05?$S640W$ > >This is what the advertisement for that video card lists for power: > > "System Requirements Minimum of a 600 Watt power supply. > (Minimum recommended power supply with +12 Volt > current rating of 42 Amps.) > Power Connector 6 pin / 8 pin" > >Those include some assumptions on the part of the person making up that >600 watt number. We know we have a 130 watt processor, and a 262 watt >video card, which is 392 watts all coming from +12V. The motherboard >chipset and RAM uses another 50W. A hard drive is 12W. A CD/DVD is 25W. >These are numbers to use for a ballpark figure for the supply. >Now, we're up to 479 watts, and the supply should have a bit of >expansion room. (It doesn't draw 479 watts all the time. That is the >peak gaming power. At idle, the processor could be 12W, the video card >42.1 watts, so in non-gaming situations, power usage is a lot lower. >In fact, when I quote 479 watts, you're unlikely to actually be able >to hit that number. Your consumption will be somewhat less. But there >is little point in "just scraping by", when you've spent so much >money on the rest of it. > >If you were on a tight budget, you might buy this. > >(has two PCI Express connectors, just enough for the high end video card) >http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139005 > >and for a bit more margin, you could get this. The 80% efficiency >rating of these, helps reduce the waste heat contributed by the >power supply itself. The best supplies you can get, are about >87% efficient, but they cheat (in the same way they cheat on >air conditioner efficiency). The 87% supplies are only 87% efficient, >as long as virtually all the power comes from the +12V rail. If >you draw significant power from 3.3V or 5V, the efficiency of >the 87% supply drops quite a bit. In any case, you don't want >an ordinary supply, at 68% efficiency, because the heat pouring >out of there, when it is supplying the 479 watt load, would be >quite bad. > >(has more PCI Express power cables) >http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006 > >http://www.corsair.com/_images/charts/tx750w_efficiency.jpg > >http://www.corsair.com/_productmanuals/P49-00002%20TX%20Manual%20Read%20layout.pdf > >Part of the fun of building a computer, is avoiding mechanical >issues. For example, your high end video card is 10.6" long, >while the motherboard is 9.6" wide. That means the end of the >video card, extends past the edge of the motherboard. It can >bump into the hard drive rack. > >This case, has the lower rack turned sideways. There might >be enough room here. You can use the holes in the motherboard >tray, as a guide as to where 9.6" is. (In this example, 9.6" >would be slightly to the right, of the right-most screw >hole in the picture. Add an inch onto that, leaves a bit of >room to the rack.) > >"Antec Sonata Proto Black" >http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/11-129-086-Z06?$S640W$ > >Picking a good case, is perhaps the toughest job of all, >as there are hundreds of cases, and not many of them are >winners. > > Paul |