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From: dorayme on 29 May 2010 01:29
In article <htq4ht$sn3$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>,
Priam <priam(a)notsosure.com> wrote:

> On 05/28/2010 12:16 AM, JF Mezei wrote:
> > dorayme wrote:
> >
> >> The Dell is always quick to wake on mouse movement or keyboard
> >> press, the LG always slower but too often failing altogether to
> >> wake from monitor sleep and I have to switch the power on and off
> >
> > I have the opposite problem. There are times when the computer goes to
> > sleep and only turns off one of the 2 monitors. First one stays lighted
> > up. When I mouse mouse, it goes dark, and then both turn back on. This
> > is on a Macpro with DVI connected NEC monitors.
>
> This is what you get for not buying Apple monitors.

Not true, I ge(o)t good with many of my present and past Dell
monitors, also my Viewsonic monitor and plus I have had various
kinds of trouble with Apple monitors in the past with other Mac
computers over many years. One gets trouble with complicated
things, no need to frighten folk into more incestuousness than
already exists in the Mac world.

--
dorayme
From: Erik Richard Sørensen on 29 May 2010 19:47

dorayme wrote:
> Erik Richard Sørensen <NOSPAM(a)NOSPAM.dk> wrote:
>> dorayme wrote:
>>> Tiger, G4 QS Powermac. Two screens, single desktop. *Never* for
>>> computer to sleep but 20 mins set for display sleep in Energy
>>> saver panel. Screensaver set to come on after 6 mins. A Dell and
>>> a 24" LG (W2452). Both the Dell and the LG run at their native
>>> resolutions.
>>>
>>> The Dell is always quick to wake on mouse movement or keyboard
>>> press, the LG always slower but too often failing altogether to
>>> wake from monitor sleep and I have to switch the power on and off
>>> to it to trigger it back on via the mains at the wall, (the power
>>> on the monitor frame is unresponsive in this situation).
>>>
>>> Any similar experience and ideas on how to fix?
>> Yes! - I've now sent my 28" ViewSonic to the factory with a near similar
>> problem, while my other ViewSonic reacts like a dream. The techbuy said
>> that it probably is the PSU in the monitor or the electronically
>> handling that fails, so it might be something similar on your machine.
>
> I rather suspect the energy saving software built into the LG.
> Not keen to suffer the inconvenience of doing without it to
> return it on guarantee but I can return it when it is convenient
> in a couple of years maybe... I have the mains power to it handy
> on the desk, that kicks it into action.

Software or hardware... If I'm right this energy saving stuff in put
into a small chip sitting close to the PSU, so it very well can be a
temporary error such like a 'cold' solding somewhere. If so you must
send it for repair.

>> But before deciding anyting... Which graphics card are you using...
>
> ATI Radeon 9800 Pro:
>
> Chipset Model: ATY,R350
> Type: Display
> Bus: AGP
> Slot: SLOT-1
> VRAM (Total): 128 MB
> Vendor: ATI (0x1002)
> Device ID: 0x4e48
> Revision ID: 0x0000
> ROM Revision: 113-A07525-130
> Displays:
> W2452:
> Resolution: 1920 x 1200 @ 60 Hz
> Depth: 32-bit Color
> Core Image: Supported
> Main Display: Yes
> Mirror: Off
> Online: Yes
> Quartz Extreme: Supported
> DELL SP1908FP:
> Resolution: 1280 x 1024 @ 60 Hz
> Depth: 32-bit Color
> Core Image: Supported
> Mirror: Off
> Online: Yes
> Quartz Extreme: Supported

As I can see card has the latest firmware, so it should be able to
handle any kind of sleep. You can try to delete the energy saving prefs
from username/library/preferences, reboot and set new prefs again to see
if this would help.

> I have another card in there not being used at all
>
> ATI VGA:
>
> Chipset Model: ATY,RV100
> Type: Display
> Bus: PCI
> Slot: SLOT-3
> VRAM (Total): 64 MB
> Vendor: ATI (0x1002)
> Device ID: 0x5159
> Revision ID: 0x0000
> ROM Revision: 113-85501-208
> Displays:
> Display:
> Status: No display connected
> Display:
> Status: No display connected

Try to unmount this PCI card and see if anything changes. The QS's
sometimes can be very sensitive with multiple graphics cards. - I once
put a Radeon 128/16mb from a B&W G3 into my QS 733mhz and later after
upgrading it to the dual 1,8ghz. It wouldn't boot with two monitors
turned on at the same time - a 24" Acer on the DVI and a 19" Philips CRT
on the VGA on the PCI card. But only turning on the power on the Acer
and boot everything was well, and I could then turn on the CRT afterwards...

> but I used to use it and I think I had the same problem with the
> LG. I might try to confirm this by switching the LG to it. It is
> a card I also used to have in my 7300 and 7600 to run a LCD
> screens on 9.2. I think my QS 2002 came with the GForce 4MX/64mb,
> (its in a box somewhere)

Yes, the QS 2002 came either with the GForce 2MX/32mb the 4MX/64mb or
the Radeon 9000Pro/64mb (1ghz and dual 1ghz models). My old QS dual 1ghz
had the Radeon 9000Pro, and it could handle 1920x1200(a)60hz and so can
the 4MX/64mb, but the refreshing is far much slower on a QS, but is very
good on the MDDs - also with the 4MX/64mb card. - The Radeon 9000Pro/64
though is the best of the two 64mb cards, so I was lucky to get a
9000Pro for my MDD dual 1ghz and the later 1,25ghz single was born with
the 9000Pro.

> and I ran it for years and years but it
> won't do the res on the LG so i bought the Radeon 9800 Pro and
> have been happy with it.

The 9800Pro/128mb and the 256mb versions I count as the best graphics
card for any G4 as well as the smaller G5s - especially the 256mb
verison is running very, very fast on both G4 and G5 machines.

> I have the feeling that this problem of not waking from screen
> sleep is getting more regular. It does not always happen and I am
> experimenting on where to leave the mouse cursor, the Dell or the
> LG and other things to see if it affects it.

Hm, don't know whether thsi has anything to say, but I'd leave the mouse
on the fastest screen, so look up the refreshrates given in milliseconds
to se which one is the fastest - my guess will be the DELL...

> I should yank the unused display card out and see if this helps.
> Doubt it!

As written - maybe, maybe not...

>> - the
>> std. GForce 2MX/32mb or the larger 4MX/64mb? - Radeon 9000Pro/32mb /
>> 9000Pro/64mb? - 2x DVI connection or DVI+VGA? - and which one is
>> connected then to the VGA (if VGA is used)? - OR - worst case - are you
>> using a Radeon 9200 PCI card for the one monitor?
>>
>> I presume that you are aware of the 'deep sleep' problem on the G4s...,
>
> Is a cat aware of a mouse? It is the reason I never put the QS to
> sleep ever (apart from turning it off now and then). I understand
> that my USB 2 PCI Belkin card (good quality though it be) might
> be responsible.

Yes, a cat can smell a mouse at a long distance.:-) - That's also why I
wrote 'presume'.:-)) - I also have Belkin cards in my MDDs (I've sold
the two dual 1,8ghz QS monsters - and regreted it too...). OWC has an
USB PCI card that will handle the deep sleep on the G4s, but it's also
rather expensive - about $50USd if I recall right. And the Belkin cards
always do deliever what they promise - at least in my experiences...

> Did you know, Erik, that there is a PhD course in
> the vagaries of sleep on G4 Powermacs? You graduate as a Dr of
> MacSleep.

Nope, never heard of this... - Are you taking the course.:-)?

>> but if you have an extra PCI graphics card, I'll guarantee you that this
>> is the problem.
>
> What is the problem exactly?

As I understand it the problems in the missing deep-sleep is that the
PCI slots donot get enough power to wake up the cards again, when the
computer is put to sleep. The strange thing though is that if you have
PCI cards mounted and take out any external units - printer, harddisk,
mouse etc. from the PCI cards, you can put the G4s to sleep and also
wake them up again without problem. I did this myself once by mistake
just after I bought the MDDs, but it was before they were connected with
the external things like printer, harddisks, zip drive, LS & floppy
drives. So I thought that the problems wasn't on the MDDs, but I got
wiser the first time I got it fully setup and put it to sleep - no
awake...forced reboot...

Cheers, Erik Richard

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Erik Richard Sørensen, Member of ADC, <mac-manNOSP(a)Mstofanet.dk>
NisusWriter - The Future In Multilingual Text Processing - www.nisus.com
OpenOffice.org - The Modern Productivity Solution - www.openoffice.org
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
From: dorayme on 29 May 2010 21:09
In article <4c01a7ab$0$4826$ba624c82(a)nntp02.dk.telia.net>,
Erik Richard Sørensen <NOSPAM(a)NOSPAM.dk> wrote:

> dorayme wrote:
> > Erik Richard Sørensen <NOSPAM(a)NOSPAM.dk> wrote:
> >> dorayme wrote:
....
> >>> the LG ... too often failing altogether to
> >>> wake from monitor sleep and I have to switch the power on and off
> >>> to it to trigger it back on via the mains at the wall, (the power
> >>> on the monitor frame is unresponsive in this situation).
> >>>
....
>
> >> But before deciding anyting... Which graphics card are you using...
> >
> > ATI Radeon 9800 Pro:
> >
> > Chipset Model: ATY,R350
> > Type: Display
....
>
> As I can see card has the latest firmware, so it should be able to
> handle any kind of sleep. You can try to delete the energy saving prefs
> from username/library/preferences, reboot and set new prefs again to see
> if this would help.
>

Which file? Under what name, nothing stands out?

...


> As I understand it the problems in the missing deep-sleep is that the
> PCI slots donot get enough power to wake up the cards again, when the
> computer is put to sleep. The strange thing though is that if you have
> PCI cards mounted and take out any external units - printer, harddisk,
> mouse etc. from the PCI cards, you can put the G4s to sleep and also
> wake them up again without problem. I did this myself once by mistake
> just after I bought the MDDs, but it was before they were connected with
> the external things like printer, harddisks, zip drive, LS & floppy
> drives. So I thought that the problems wasn't on the MDDs, but I got
> wiser the first time I got it fully setup and put it to sleep - no
> awake...forced reboot...
>

OK but, of course, you will agree that it is not exactly fitting
in with the point of having PCI cards. Anyway, easy enough to
simply leave the machine running all day and night! But I rather
want monitor sleep.

This pesky monitor problem did not happen just this morning, went
off to a long breakfast (OK, OK, I hear you ask and accept you
need to know:

* Home made muesli, served with kiwi fruit, banana, rock melon
honey, greek style yogurt, low fat variety, a few teaspoons of
Psyllium husks (water retaining grain, good for bowl movements),
soya milk.

* Then real espresso coffee, espresso machine made, wholemeal
bread warmed, a sliver of bacon, fat sliced off, a free range egg
fried, a sliver of low fat cheese on the bread which is
'buttered' by an altogether too expensive cholesterol lowering
margarine. Some cleansing cold peeled lebanese cucumber to go
with.

Why are you all so interested in what I eat anyway?)

and when I came back, the LG kicked back into life. Wonder if it
is something to do with the exact composition of my breakfast <g>

--
dorayme
From: nospam on 30 May 2010 00:06
In article <htsnrf$5dr$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>, Priam
<priam(a)notsosure.com> wrote:

> If your iPhone is stolen, the data stored on the device is accessible.

that's the case with nearly *any* phone, or computer for that matter.

there is no security if someone has physical access to the device.
From: Priam on 30 May 2010 00:44
On 05/30/2010 12:06 AM, nospam wrote:
> In article<htsnrf$5dr$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>, Priam
> <priam(a)notsosure.com> wrote:
>
>> If your iPhone is stolen, the data stored on the device is accessible.
>
> that's the case with nearly *any* phone, or computer for that matter.
>
> there is no security if someone has physical access to the device.

In message 280520101128199253%nospam(a)nospam.invalid, you wrote:

"the expectation is because apple said it has hardware encryption."

and I added the reference on Apple's site:

�And your data is secure with support for encrypted data in
transmission, *hardware encryption for data at rest*, and encrypted
backups in iTunes.�

<http://www.apple.com/iphone/business/integration/>

Passwords are easy to bypass. Encryption is another matter because even
if you have access to the file, you can't read it.


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