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From: Sam Wormley on 31 Oct 2009 10:37
kenseto wrote:
> On Oct 30, 8:06 pm, Sam Wormley <sworml...(a)mchsi.com> wrote:
>> kenseto wrote:
>>
>>> Hey idiot I already told you that this is wrong. A predicts that B's
>>> time is retarded as follows:
>>> Delta(t_B') = gamma*Delta(t_A)
>>> OR
>>> Delta(t_B') = Delta(t_A)/gamma
>> Using your equation
>>
>> Delta(t_A)/gamma = Delta(t_B') = gamma*Delta(t_A)
>>
>> Delta(t_A)/gamma = gamma*Delta(t_A)
>>
>> 1/gamma = gamma
>
> No idiot if the observed clock is running sow you use the factor of 1/
> gamma and if the observed clock is running fast you use the factor of
> gamma.
>
>
>> gamma = 1
>>
>> And you think I'm an idiot?
>
> Yes you are an idiot.
>
> Ken Seto

Given that special relativity says that ∆t = γ ∆to and that γ has a
value that ranges from 1 to infinity and does not have any negative
values, it seems to me that the time interval ∆t ≥ ∆to for all
observations. In other words the measured time interval is always
greater (slowed) for velocities v > zero, independent of direction.

So for a clock tick of one second, ∆to = 1 , an observer with
relative velocity 0.866 c give a γ = 2 and

∆t = γ ∆to

2 s = 2 (1 s)



From: kenseto on 31 Oct 2009 11:17
On Oct 31, 10:37 am, Sam Wormley <sworml...(a)mchsi.com> wrote:
> kenseto wrote:
> > On Oct 30, 8:06 pm, Sam Wormley <sworml...(a)mchsi.com> wrote:
> >> kenseto wrote:
>
> >>> Hey idiot I already told you that this is  wrong. A predicts that B's
> >>> time is retarded as follows:
> >>>      Delta(t_B') = gamma*Delta(t_A)
> >>>      OR
> >>>      Delta(t_B') = Delta(t_A)/gamma
> >>    Using your equation
>
> >>    Delta(t_A)/gamma = Delta(t_B') = gamma*Delta(t_A)
>
> >>    Delta(t_A)/gamma = gamma*Delta(t_A)
>
> >>    1/gamma = gamma
>
> > No idiot if the observed clock is running sow you use the factor of 1/
> > gamma and if the observed clock is running fast you use the factor of
> > gamma.
>
> >>    gamma = 1
>
> >>    And you think I'm an idiot?
>
> > Yes you are an idiot.
>
> > Ken Seto
>
>    Given that special relativity says that ∆t = γ ∆to  and that γ has a
>    value that ranges from 1 to infinity and does not have any negative
>    values, it seems to me that the time interval ∆t ≥ ∆to for all
>    observations. In other words the measured time interval is always
>    greater (slowed) for velocities v > zero, independent of direction.
>
>    So for a clock tick of one second, ∆to = 1 , an observer with
>    relative velocity 0.866 c give a γ = 2 and
>
>      ∆t = γ ∆to

Sigh wormy....this is wrong in SR.
SR says thatfor clock moving wrt the observer are running slow as
follows:
Delta(t')=Delta(to)/gamma.
IRT include the above but it also includes the situation when the
observed clock is running fast compared to the observer's clock as
follows:
Delta(t')=gamma*Delta(to)

Ken Seto

>
>      2 s = 2 (1 s)- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

From: Sam Wormley on 31 Oct 2009 11:35
kenseto wrote:
> On Oct 31, 10:37 am, Sam Wormley <sworml...(a)mchsi.com> wrote:

>> Given that special relativity says that ∆t = γ ∆to and that γ has a
>> value that ranges from 1 to infinity and does not have any negative
>> values, it seems to me that the time interval ∆t ≥ ∆to for all
>> observations. In other words the measured time interval is always
>> greater (slowed) for velocities v > zero, independent of direction.
>>
>> So for a clock tick of one second, ∆to = 1 , an observer with
>> relative velocity 0.866 c give a γ = 2 and
>>
>> ∆t = γ ∆to
>
> Sigh wormy....this is wrong in SR.
> SR says thatfor clock moving wrt the observer are running slow as
> follows:
> Delta(t')=Delta(to)/gamma.
> IRT include the above but it also includes the situation when the
> observed clock is running fast compared to the observer's clock as
> follows:
> Delta(t')=gamma*Delta(to)
>
> Ken Seto
>
>> 2 s = 2 (1 s)- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>

Ken, where in the real world are clock observed to run fast,
just due to relative velocity?

Doppler shift can make clocks appear to be running faster.
Differences in gravitation also produce time dilation, but
general relativity is the applicable tool in those situations.
Satellite clocks, such as GPS, come to mind.
From: kenseto on 31 Oct 2009 15:26
On Oct 31, 11:35 am, Sam Wormley <sworml...(a)mchsi.com> wrote:
> kenseto wrote:
> > On Oct 31, 10:37 am, Sam Wormley <sworml...(a)mchsi.com> wrote:
> >>    Given that special relativity says that ∆t = γ ∆to  and that γ has a
> >>    value that ranges from 1 to infinity and does not have any negative
> >>    values, it seems to me that the time interval ∆t ≥ ∆to for all
> >>    observations. In other words the measured time interval is always
> >>    greater (slowed) for velocities v > zero, independent of direction.
>
> >>    So for a clock tick of one second, ∆to = 1 , an observer with
> >>    relative velocity 0.866 c give a γ = 2 and
>
> >>      ∆t = γ ∆to
>
> > Sigh wormy....this is wrong in SR.
> > SR says thatfor clock moving wrt the observer are running slow as
> > follows:
> > Delta(t')=Delta(to)/gamma.
> > IRT include the above but it also includes the situation when the
> > observed clock is running fast compared to the observer's clock as
> > follows:
> > Delta(t')=gamma*Delta(to)
>
> > Ken Seto
>
> >>      2 s = 2 (1 s)- Hide quoted text -
>
> >> - Show quoted text -
>
>    Ken, where in the real world are clock observed to run fast,
>    just due to relative velocity?

If every clock in the universe is running slow compared to the
observer's clock then that would mean that the observer's clock is in
a preferred frame....we know that is not the case. Therefore the
observer must include the situation that his clock can run slower than
the observed clock. Learn some real physics instead of sticking your
head in the SR arsehole.

Ken Seto

>
>    Doppler shift can make clocks appear to be running faster.
>    Differences in gravitation also produce time dilation, but
>    general relativity is the applicable tool in those situations.
>    Satellite clocks, such as GPS, come to mind.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

From: Sam Wormley on 31 Oct 2009 15:41
kenseto wrote:
> On Oct 31, 11:35 am, Sam Wormley <sworml...(a)mchsi.com> wrote:

>> Ken, where in the real world are clock observed to run fast,
>> just due to relative velocity?
>
> If every clock in the universe is running slow compared to the
> observer's clock then that would mean that the observer's clock is in
> a preferred frame....we know that is not the case.

Ken, that would be true for ANY observer--the other clocks in
relative motion would appear to run slower... That would be
true for almost all observer. None of them is special or
preferred.


Therefore the
> observer must include the situation that his clock can run slower than
> the observed clock. Learn some real physics instead of sticking your
> head in the SR arsehole.
>
> Ken Seto
>
>> Doppler shift can make clocks appear to be running faster.
>> Differences in gravitation also produce time dilation, but
>> general relativity is the applicable tool in those situations.
>> Satellite clocks, such as GPS, come to mind.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
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