Sagnac Revisited. Why Paul, Tom and Jerry are Hopelessly Wrong.
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From: Henry Wilson DSc on 8 Apr 2010 16:06 On Thu, 08 Apr 2010 15:10:56 +0200, "Paul B. Andersen" <paul.b.andersen(a)somewhere.no> wrote: >On 06.04.2010 23:22, Henry Wilson DSc wrote: >> On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 22:18:21 +0200, "Paul B. Andersen"<someone(a)somewhere.no> >> wrote: >> >>> On 05.04.2010 23:53, Henry Wilson DSc wrote: >>>> On Mon, 05 Apr 2010 20:33:53 +0200, "Paul B. Andersen"<someone(a)somewhere.no> >>>> wrote: >>>> >> >>>>> It is quite obvious that the speed of light in >>>>> a ring laser is c in the non-rotating frame, >>>>> that's why the standing wave doesn't rotate with >>>>> the ring. But the sources are moving with the ring. >>>> >>>> Photons are not simple oscillators. In the nonR frame, the path lengths of the >>>> two rays are different and therefore contain different numbers of >>>> 'wavelengths'. >>> >>> Where does the stationary standing wave in a ring laser >>> start and end, Henry? :-) >>> >>> How can a stationary (in the non rotating frame) standing wave >>> have different number of wavelengths in the two rays, Ralph? >> >> It isn't stationary. It moves at v. Each photon has its own 'pair of waves' >> >>> And since the standing wave is stationary in the non rotating frame, >>> the speed of light in the non rotating frame has to be the same >>> in both directions, doesn't it? >> >> Look, I know this is difficult, particularly for somebody who does not want to >> learn. >> When a 'photon' splits at the 45 mirror, one half will travel a distance of N+n >> wavelengths before it reaches the detector, the other will travel N-n >> wavelengths. Thus, even though both halves arrive simultaneously, they are 'out >> of phase' when they reunite. >> >> I'm sure you're bright enough to construct a model of light that fits this >> behavior. Ask one of your students.... >> >> Henry Wilson... >> >> .......A person's IQ = his snipping ability. > >I think you should look up what a ring laser is. >It's not a Sagnac interferometer. It basically is. The use of the modulated signal provides much greater sensitivity than counting fringe movements. Henry Wilson... ........A person's IQ = his snipping ability.
From: Paul B. Andersen on 8 Apr 2010 16:30 On 08.04.2010 22:06, Henry Wilson DSc wrote: > On Thu, 08 Apr 2010 15:10:56 +0200, "Paul B. Andersen" > <paul.b.andersen(a)somewhere.no> wrote: > >> On 06.04.2010 23:22, Henry Wilson DSc wrote: >>> On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 22:18:21 +0200, "Paul B. Andersen"<someone(a)somewhere.no> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> On 05.04.2010 23:53, Henry Wilson DSc wrote: >>>>> On Mon, 05 Apr 2010 20:33:53 +0200, "Paul B. Andersen"<someone(a)somewhere.no> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>> >>>>>> It is quite obvious that the speed of light in >>>>>> a ring laser is c in the non-rotating frame, >>>>>> that's why the standing wave doesn't rotate with >>>>>> the ring. But the sources are moving with the ring. >>>>> >>>>> Photons are not simple oscillators. In the nonR frame, the path lengths of the >>>>> two rays are different and therefore contain different numbers of >>>>> 'wavelengths'. >>>> >>>> Where does the stationary standing wave in a ring laser >>>> start and end, Henry? :-) >>>> >>>> How can a stationary (in the non rotating frame) standing wave >>>> have different number of wavelengths in the two rays, Ralph? >>> >>> It isn't stationary. It moves at v. Each photon has its own 'pair of waves' >>> >>>> And since the standing wave is stationary in the non rotating frame, >>>> the speed of light in the non rotating frame has to be the same >>>> in both directions, doesn't it? >>> >>> Look, I know this is difficult, particularly for somebody who does not want to >>> learn. >>> When a 'photon' splits at the 45 mirror, one half will travel a distance of N+n >>> wavelengths before it reaches the detector, the other will travel N-n >>> wavelengths. Thus, even though both halves arrive simultaneously, they are 'out >>> of phase' when they reunite. >>> >>> I'm sure you're bright enough to construct a model of light that fits this >>> behavior. Ask one of your students.... >>> >>> Henry Wilson... >>> >>> .......A person's IQ = his snipping ability. >> >> I think you should look up what a ring laser is. >> It's not a Sagnac interferometer. > > It basically is. > The use of the modulated signal provides much greater sensitivity than counting > fringe movements. So you didn't look it up. -- Paul http://home.c2i.net/pb_andersen/
From: Henry Wilson DSc on 8 Apr 2010 17:03 On Thu, 08 Apr 2010 22:30:53 +0200, "Paul B. Andersen" <someone(a)somewhere.no> wrote: >On 08.04.2010 22:06, Henry Wilson DSc wrote: >> On Thu, 08 Apr 2010 15:10:56 +0200, "Paul B. Andersen" >> <paul.b.andersen(a)somewhere.no> wrote: >> >>>>> Where does the stationary standing wave in a ring laser >>>>> start and end, Henry? :-) >>>>> >>>>> How can a stationary (in the non rotating frame) standing wave >>>>> have different number of wavelengths in the two rays, Ralph? >>>> >>>> It isn't stationary. It moves at v. Each photon has its own 'pair of waves' >>>> >>>>> And since the standing wave is stationary in the non rotating frame, >>>>> the speed of light in the non rotating frame has to be the same >>>>> in both directions, doesn't it? >>>> >>>> Look, I know this is difficult, particularly for somebody who does not want to >>>> learn. >>>> When a 'photon' splits at the 45 mirror, one half will travel a distance of N+n >>>> wavelengths before it reaches the detector, the other will travel N-n >>>> wavelengths. Thus, even though both halves arrive simultaneously, they are 'out >>>> of phase' when they reunite. >>>> >>>> I'm sure you're bright enough to construct a model of light that fits this >>>> behavior. Ask one of your students.... >>> I think you should look up what a ring laser is. >>> It's not a Sagnac interferometer. >> >> It basically is. >> The use of the modulated signal provides much greater sensitivity than counting >> fringe movements. > >So you didn't look it up. I don't want to discuss ring laser gyros. I'm talking about simple optical fibre ring gyros. Henry Wilson... ........A person's IQ = his snipping ability.
From: eric gisse on 8 Apr 2010 20:14
...@..(Henry Wilson DSc) wrote: > On Thu, 08 Apr 2010 22:30:53 +0200, "Paul B. Andersen" > <someone(a)somewhere.no> wrote: > >>On 08.04.2010 22:06, Henry Wilson DSc wrote: >>> On Thu, 08 Apr 2010 15:10:56 +0200, "Paul B. Andersen" >>> <paul.b.andersen(a)somewhere.no> wrote: >>> > >>>>>> Where does the stationary standing wave in a ring laser >>>>>> start and end, Henry? :-) >>>>>> >>>>>> How can a stationary (in the non rotating frame) standing wave >>>>>> have different number of wavelengths in the two rays, Ralph? >>>>> >>>>> It isn't stationary. It moves at v. Each photon has its own 'pair of >>>>> waves' >>>>> >>>>>> And since the standing wave is stationary in the non rotating frame, >>>>>> the speed of light in the non rotating frame has to be the same >>>>>> in both directions, doesn't it? >>>>> >>>>> Look, I know this is difficult, particularly for somebody who does not >>>>> want to learn. >>>>> When a 'photon' splits at the 45 mirror, one half will travel a >>>>> distance of N+n wavelengths before it reaches the detector, the other >>>>> will travel N-n wavelengths. Thus, even though both halves arrive >>>>> simultaneously, they are 'out of phase' when they reunite. >>>>> >>>>> I'm sure you're bright enough to construct a model of light that fits >>>>> this behavior. Ask one of your students.... > > >>>> I think you should look up what a ring laser is. >>>> It's not a Sagnac interferometer. >>> >>> It basically is. >>> The use of the modulated signal provides much greater sensitivity than >>> counting fringe movements. >> >>So you didn't look it up. > > I don't want to discuss ring laser gyros. Naturally you don't want to discuss something that screws up your pet theory. > > I'm talking about simple optical fibre ring gyros. > > > Henry Wilson... > > .......A person's IQ = his snipping ability. |