Turn your Rigol DS1052E Oscilloscope into a 100MHz DS1102E
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From: Nico Coesel on 7 Apr 2010 13:17 "David L. Jones" <altzone(a)gmail.com> wrote: >John Larkin wrote: >> On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 19:34:32 -0700, >> "JosephKK"<quiettechblue(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >> >>> On Mon, 05 Apr 2010 21:45:57 -0700, John Larkin > >Yup, economy of scale and other factors. >and the 470MHz at $12K+: >http://www.tequipment.net/IwatsuSS-7847A.html >Ouch! They are a lot cheaper second hand because no-one wants an analog scope anymore. $500 should be enough. -- Failure does not prove something is impossible, failure simply indicates you are not using the right tools... nico(a)nctdevpuntnl (punt=.) --------------------------------------------------------------
From: krw on 7 Apr 2010 19:07 On Wed, 07 Apr 2010 07:05:25 -0700, John Larkin <jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote: >On Wed, 7 Apr 2010 15:58:46 +1000, "David L. Jones" ><altzone(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >>John Larkin wrote: >>> On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 19:34:32 -0700, >>> "JosephKK"<quiettechblue(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>> >>>> On Mon, 05 Apr 2010 21:45:57 -0700, John Larkin >>>> <jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> On Mon, 05 Apr 2010 21:28:29 -0700, >>>>> "JosephKK"<quiettechblue(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On Tue, 6 Apr 2010 09:58:53 +0800, "Andrew" <anbyvbel(a)yahoo.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> "John Larkin" <jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote >>>>>>> in message news:kj2lr598g79va9rjpir1e1jaa0bvg90ji6(a)4ax.com... >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> If you don't like Rigol scopes, buy Tek or Agilent or LeCroy. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Of course, the low-end Agilent is actually a Rigol. They rebrand >>>>>>>> it and sell it for about twice the price of the Rigol. How do >>>>>>>> you like that for rip-off-ness? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Wow, you just deprived Agilent of their hard earned cash, since a >>>>>>> lot of people will buy Rigol instead. >>>>>>> You should have kept this information to yourself. >>>>>> >>>>>> Bwahahahaha. That tidbit is kind of common knowledge around here >>>>>> (s.e.d). >>>>>> >>>>>> For some real interesting times go really hunting for fast analog >>>>>> scopes, they are available, though not inexpensive. 500 MHz is >>>>>> still reasonably available, for about the price of a modest car. >>>>> >>>>> Tek 7103s and 7104s, 1 GHz analog scopes with microchannel plate >>>>> CRTs, are fairly cheap on the used market. >>>>> >>>>> An 11801 sampler with a 12 GHz head can be had for under $2K. Nice >>>>> scopes. >>>>> >>>>> John >>>> >>>> John, i am talking about brand _new_ analog 'scopes. Probably with >>>> microchannel faceplates as well. All the old groovy Tektronix >>>> patents >>>> have expired. >>> >>> The only new analog scopes I know of are minor brands, >>> B&K/Instek/Kenwood sort of stuff. All the name-brand scopes are >>> digital now. LeCroy used to sell the 470 MHz Iwatsu scope, but I think >>> they gave that up. The Iwatsu SS-7840H is around $10K. And not even >>> color. It looks to me like digital scopes are less expensive at pretty >>> much every performance point. >> >>Yup, economy of scale and other factors. >> >>Iwatsu still do a 1GHz analog storage scope at $28K: >>http://www.tequipment.net/IwatsuTS-81000.html >> > >That's quasi-digital, with a CRT-based scan converter tube. > >My friend Bernard still makes this: > >http://www.greenfieldtechnology.com/-Data-aquisition-system-.html I had a couple pairs of the Tektronix version of this I bought in the late '70s and early '80s. They had two 7000 series plug-in bays and went for ~$20K each (don't remember if that included the 7B92 and 7A19, or not). >which uses the older kind of scan converter, two electron >gun/deflection systems facing one another in one tube with some sort >of charge storage film between them. This is the one Tek used to >market. Goodness knows where he gets the tubes... probably old stock. If it's the Tek tube, it's a 512x512 diode array inbetween the two guns. >I don't miss tubes, or meter needles, or analog scopes at all. Nope, though I do still like analog scopes, at times. Don't have one, but that's a different matter.
From: David L. Jones on 7 Apr 2010 20:43 John Larkin wrote: > On Wed, 7 Apr 2010 15:58:46 +1000, "David L. Jones" > <altzone(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> John Larkin wrote: >>> On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 19:34:32 -0700, >>> "JosephKK"<quiettechblue(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>> >>>> On Mon, 05 Apr 2010 21:45:57 -0700, John Larkin >>>> <jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> On Mon, 05 Apr 2010 21:28:29 -0700, >>>>> "JosephKK"<quiettechblue(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On Tue, 6 Apr 2010 09:58:53 +0800, "Andrew" <anbyvbel(a)yahoo.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> "John Larkin" <jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote >>>>>>> in message news:kj2lr598g79va9rjpir1e1jaa0bvg90ji6(a)4ax.com... >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> If you don't like Rigol scopes, buy Tek or Agilent or LeCroy. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Of course, the low-end Agilent is actually a Rigol. They >>>>>>>> rebrand it and sell it for about twice the price of the Rigol. >>>>>>>> How do you like that for rip-off-ness? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Wow, you just deprived Agilent of their hard earned cash, since >>>>>>> a lot of people will buy Rigol instead. >>>>>>> You should have kept this information to yourself. >>>>>> >>>>>> Bwahahahaha. That tidbit is kind of common knowledge around here >>>>>> (s.e.d). >>>>>> >>>>>> For some real interesting times go really hunting for fast analog >>>>>> scopes, they are available, though not inexpensive. 500 MHz is >>>>>> still reasonably available, for about the price of a modest car. >>>>> >>>>> Tek 7103s and 7104s, 1 GHz analog scopes with microchannel plate >>>>> CRTs, are fairly cheap on the used market. >>>>> >>>>> An 11801 sampler with a 12 GHz head can be had for under $2K. Nice >>>>> scopes. >>>>> >>>>> John >>>> >>>> John, i am talking about brand _new_ analog 'scopes. Probably with >>>> microchannel faceplates as well. All the old groovy Tektronix >>>> patents >>>> have expired. >>> >>> The only new analog scopes I know of are minor brands, >>> B&K/Instek/Kenwood sort of stuff. All the name-brand scopes are >>> digital now. LeCroy used to sell the 470 MHz Iwatsu scope, but I >>> think they gave that up. The Iwatsu SS-7840H is around $10K. And >>> not even color. It looks to me like digital scopes are less >>> expensive at pretty much every performance point. >> >> Yup, economy of scale and other factors. >> >> Iwatsu still do a 1GHz analog storage scope at $28K: >> http://www.tequipment.net/IwatsuTS-81000.html >> > > That's quasi-digital, with a CRT-based scan converter tube. > > My friend Bernard still makes this: > > http://www.greenfieldtechnology.com/-Data-aquisition-system-.html > > which uses the older kind of scan converter, two electron > gun/deflection systems facing one another in one tube with some sort > of charge storage film between them. This is the one Tek used to > market. Goodness knows where he gets the tubes... probably old stock. > > I don't miss tubes, or meter needles, or analog scopes at all. Me neither. Although the low end digitals like the Rigols are no match for an analog scope for some jobs. So unless you've got a high end digital, it's still useful to have that analog scope around. Dave. -- ================================================ Check out my Electronics Engineering Video Blog & Podcast: http://www.eevblog.com
From: JosephKK on 7 Apr 2010 22:17 On Wed, 07 Apr 2010 07:05:25 -0700, John Larkin <jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote: >On Wed, 7 Apr 2010 15:58:46 +1000, "David L. Jones" ><altzone(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >>John Larkin wrote: >>> On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 19:34:32 -0700, >>> "JosephKK"<quiettechblue(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>> <snip> >>>> John, i am talking about brand _new_ analog 'scopes. Probably with >>>> microchannel faceplates as well. All the old groovy Tektronix >>>> patents >>>> have expired. >>> >>> The only new analog scopes I know of are minor brands, >>> B&K/Instek/Kenwood sort of stuff. All the name-brand scopes are >>> digital now. LeCroy used to sell the 470 MHz Iwatsu scope, but I think >>> they gave that up. The Iwatsu SS-7840H is around $10K. And not even >>> color. It looks to me like digital scopes are less expensive at pretty >>> much every performance point. >> >>Yup, economy of scale and other factors. >> >>Iwatsu still do a 1GHz analog storage scope at $28K: >>http://www.tequipment.net/IwatsuTS-81000.html >> > >That's quasi-digital, with a CRT-based scan converter tube. John, it writes to a miniature phosphor screen at up to 10 divisions/ns. That is analog. Then phosphor trace is amplified in intensity, and image size is scaled up with a fiber optic lens and a camera like sensor. Then it is digitized, rasterized and colorized. They have to make these tubes themselves, and i bet there are new patents involved. In terms of repeatable triggering and single shot capture it goes toe to toe with any previous technology, notably including your 7104 and DVST scopes. > >My friend Bernard still makes this: > >http://www.greenfieldtechnology.com/-Data-aquisition-system-.html > >which uses the older kind of scan converter, two electron >gun/deflection systems facing one another in one tube with some sort >of charge storage film between them. This is the one Tek used to >market. Goodness knows where he gets the tubes... probably old stock. The old Tek scopes were DVSTs. Two guns, one write gun and one projector gun both on the same side of the storage grating. The scan converters are a different technology. > >I don't miss tubes, or meter needles, or analog scopes at all. > >John >
From: JosephKK on 7 Apr 2010 22:25
On Wed, 07 Apr 2010 17:17:53 GMT, nico(a)puntnl.niks (Nico Coesel) wrote: >"David L. Jones" <altzone(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >>John Larkin wrote: >>> On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 19:34:32 -0700, >>> "JosephKK"<quiettechblue(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >>> >>>> On Mon, 05 Apr 2010 21:45:57 -0700, John Larkin >> >>Yup, economy of scale and other factors. > >>and the 470MHz at $12K+: >>http://www.tequipment.net/IwatsuSS-7847A.html >>Ouch! > >They are a lot cheaper second hand because no-one wants an analog >scope anymore. $500 should be enough. There is still a few us who want one. I am still on the lookout for a Tek 2465 or very similar. There are cases where even my TDS 544A won't get me the same results. |