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From: Krooburg Science on 14 Jun 2010 19:35 On Jun 14, 11:27 am, "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > "Phildo" <P...(a)phildo.net> wrote in message > > news:hv5s1m$g4r$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... > > > > > > > > > "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message > >news:MeednbQ2Zt4K84vRnZ2dnUVZ_tSdnZ2d(a)earthlink.com... > > >> "Phildo" <P...(a)phildo.net> wrote in message > >>news:hv5qfv$9s6$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... > > >>> "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message > >>>news:EoydnfeMp5qxDSXWnZ2dnUVZ_rSdnZ2d(a)earthlink.com... > >>>> some get close but nothing beats Meyer IMO > > >>> D&B is equal if not better. > > >>> Phildo not better and then only when talking Line arrays, I do not like > >>> the sound of line arrays, I should have pointed out that I have never > >>> heard anything better than a good point source,(not a shitty one like > >>> the 850s) the L'acoustics traps were quite good but give me a TMS 3 or > >>> Msl3 over any line array anyday > > > Listen to a D&B conventional system and you'll hear what I mean. Every bit > > the equal of Meyer. Their J series line array is the canine testicular but > > their conventional boxes were always bloody good as well. > > > Phildo > > we have had those used for a bunch of the country acts I did last summer, > seemed pretty ok, much better than eaw but not something I would choose over > Meyer, but still all in all very useable > It is this kind of thinking that will keep you at the level you're at Georgie boy - you choose antiquated old boxes over newer, higher output better sounding boxes that are in demand. And you'll keep getting the lame clients you're complaining about in the other thread. "Those that strive for mediocrity shall achieve it." - KS If that's the level you *want* to stay at, fine. But it doesn't mean you're right and everyone else is wrong. If you seriously think your MSL3s can compete against anything by L'Acoustics, D&B, and other newer boxes in that league, you're seriously mistaken or you need to get out more. Meyer makes some decent sounding modern boxes, but their top end stuff can't compete with the new L'Acoustics or D&B. K.
From: George's Pro Sound Co. on 14 Jun 2010 19:50 "Krooburg Science" <krooburg(a)gmail.com> wrote in message news:9315c3a1-4488-4cba-82d3-9c2bc5bb924a(a)u3g2000prl.googlegroups.com... On Jun 14, 11:27 am, "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > "Phildo" <P...(a)phildo.net> wrote in message > > news:hv5s1m$g4r$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... > > > > > > > > > "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message > >news:MeednbQ2Zt4K84vRnZ2dnUVZ_tSdnZ2d(a)earthlink.com... > > >> "Phildo" <P...(a)phildo.net> wrote in message > >>news:hv5qfv$9s6$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... > > >>> "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message > >>>news:EoydnfeMp5qxDSXWnZ2dnUVZ_rSdnZ2d(a)earthlink.com... > >>>> some get close but nothing beats Meyer IMO > > >>> D&B is equal if not better. > > >>> Phildo not better and then only when talking Line arrays, I do not > >>> like > >>> the sound of line arrays, I should have pointed out that I have never > >>> heard anything better than a good point source,(not a shitty one like > >>> the 850s) the L'acoustics traps were quite good but give me a TMS 3 or > >>> Msl3 over any line array anyday > > > Listen to a D&B conventional system and you'll hear what I mean. Every > > bit > > the equal of Meyer. Their J series line array is the canine testicular > > but > > their conventional boxes were always bloody good as well. > > > Phildo > > we have had those used for a bunch of the country acts I did last summer, > seemed pretty ok, much better than eaw but not something I would choose > over > Meyer, but still all in all very useable > It is this kind of thinking that will keep you at the level you're at Georgie boy - you choose antiquated old boxes over newer, higher output better sounding boxes that are in demand. And you'll keep getting the lame clients you're complaining about in the other thread. "Those that strive for mediocrity shall achieve it." - KS If that's the level you *want* to stay at, fine. But it doesn't mean you're right and everyone else is wrong. If you seriously think your MSL3s can compete against anything by L'Acoustics, D&B, and other newer boxes in that league, you're seriously mistaken or you need to get out more. Meyer makes some decent sounding modern boxes, but their top end stuff can't compete with the new L'Acoustics or D&B. K. Dear sir, you are entitled to your opinion, if the line arrays did actually sound better I would be all about them, but sadly they don't. I have not ever heard a single line array that sounds "Natural" , which is the standards I use , "does this sound just like the act would without a PA system but only louder,?" line arrays do not do that just because something is the flavor of the week does not make it better and you ought know this by now. George
From: Krooburg Science on 14 Jun 2010 22:14 On Jun 14, 4:50 pm, "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > "Krooburg Science" <kroob...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message > > news:9315c3a1-4488-4cba-82d3-9c2bc5bb924a(a)u3g2000prl.googlegroups.com... > On Jun 14, 11:27 am, "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > "Phildo" <P...(a)phildo.net> wrote in message > > >news:hv5s1m$g4r$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... > > > > "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message > > >news:MeednbQ2Zt4K84vRnZ2dnUVZ_tSdnZ2d(a)earthlink.com... > > > >> "Phildo" <P...(a)phildo.net> wrote in message > > >>news:hv5qfv$9s6$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... > > > >>> "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message > > >>>news:EoydnfeMp5qxDSXWnZ2dnUVZ_rSdnZ2d(a)earthlink.com... > > >>>> some get close but nothing beats Meyer IMO > > > >>> D&B is equal if not better. > > > >>> Phildo not better and then only when talking Line arrays, I do not > > >>> like > > >>> the sound of line arrays, I should have pointed out that I have never > > >>> heard anything better than a good point source,(not a shitty one like > > >>> the 850s) the L'acoustics traps were quite good but give me a TMS 3 or > > >>> Msl3 over any line array anyday > > > > Listen to a D&B conventional system and you'll hear what I mean. Every > > > bit > > > the equal of Meyer. Their J series line array is the canine testicular > > > but > > > their conventional boxes were always bloody good as well. > > > > Phildo > > > we have had those used for a bunch of the country acts I did last summer, > > seemed pretty ok, much better than eaw but not something I would choose > > over > > Meyer, but still all in all very useable > > It is this kind of thinking that will keep you at the level you're at > Georgie boy - you choose antiquated old boxes over newer, higher > output better sounding boxes that are in demand. And you'll keep > getting the lame clients you're complaining about in the other thread. > "Those that strive for mediocrity shall achieve it." - KS > > If that's the level you *want* to stay at, fine. But it doesn't mean > you're right and everyone else is wrong. If you seriously think your > MSL3s can compete against anything by L'Acoustics, D&B, and other > newer boxes in that league, you're seriously mistaken or you need to > get out more. Meyer makes some decent sounding modern boxes, but their > top end stuff can't compete with the new L'Acoustics or D&B. > > K. > > Dear sir, you are entitled to your opinion, if the line arrays did actually > sound better I would be all about them, but sadly they don't. I have not > ever heard a single line array that sounds "Natural" , which is the > standards I use , "does this sound just like the act would without a PA > system but only louder,?" line arrays do not do that > just because something is the flavor of the week does not make it better > and you ought know this by now. > George L'Acoustics and V-DOSC have been a "flavor of the week" for over 15 years now. And apparently all the manufactures have failed to prove otherwise and have jumped on the bandwagon. As for "natural" sounding PA, if a cluster of trap boxes producing "comb filter city" is your idea of natural, then I guess so. I propose this: line arrays produce far less of this phenomenon than the trap arrays you're accustom to because there are no extra boxes in the horizontal plane to induce comb filtering on that plane which is what you're ears are most sensitive to. They produce their combining in the vertical plane to which human hearing is far less sensitive. Large trap arrays produce combing in *both* planes. Maybe what you don't like about line sources is that they're actually more correct sounding since the relative time smear is less in the plane your hearing is most sensitive to. Sure there are some good sounding trap arrays out there still. Most importantly, any type of system needs to be the right tool for the job. In any case, the latest offering of line source products by the top tier makers are far superior to any of the latest trap systems out there in the big venues & when they're properly deployed.
From: Phildo on 15 Jun 2010 05:50 "George's Pro Sound Co." <bmoas(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message news:i-ednYQC8szbXYvRnZ2dnUVZ_tidnZ2d(a)earthlink.com... > Dear sir, you are entitled to your opinion, if the line arrays did > actually sound better I would be all about them, but sadly they don't. I > have not ever heard a single line array that sounds "Natural" , which is > the standards I use , "does this sound just like the act would without a > PA system but only louder,?" line arrays do not do that > just because something is the flavor of the week does not make it better > and you ought know this by now. Who said anything about line arrays George? A nice D&B C system, conventional boxes, will give any Meyer range a run for it's money. Phildo
From: George's Pro Sound Co. on 15 Jun 2010 07:22
"Krooburg Science" <krooburg(a)gmail.com> wrote in message news:c9a4d1b4-2220-4d3a-b91c-d0b0dc6e1ac3(a)y18g2000prn.googlegroups.com... On Jun 14, 4:50 pm, "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > "Krooburg Science" <kroob...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message > > news:9315c3a1-4488-4cba-82d3-9c2bc5bb924a(a)u3g2000prl.googlegroups.com... > On Jun 14, 11:27 am, "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > "Phildo" <P...(a)phildo.net> wrote in message > > >news:hv5s1m$g4r$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... > > > > "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message > > >news:MeednbQ2Zt4K84vRnZ2dnUVZ_tSdnZ2d(a)earthlink.com... > > > >> "Phildo" <P...(a)phildo.net> wrote in message > > >>news:hv5qfv$9s6$1(a)news.eternal-september.org... > > > >>> "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message > > >>>news:EoydnfeMp5qxDSXWnZ2dnUVZ_rSdnZ2d(a)earthlink.com... > > >>>> some get close but nothing beats Meyer IMO > > > >>> D&B is equal if not better. > > > >>> Phildo not better and then only when talking Line arrays, I do not > > >>> like > > >>> the sound of line arrays, I should have pointed out that I have > > >>> never > > >>> heard anything better than a good point source,(not a shitty one > > >>> like > > >>> the 850s) the L'acoustics traps were quite good but give me a TMS 3 > > >>> or > > >>> Msl3 over any line array anyday > > > > Listen to a D&B conventional system and you'll hear what I mean. Every > > > bit > > > the equal of Meyer. Their J series line array is the canine testicular > > > but > > > their conventional boxes were always bloody good as well. > > > > Phildo > > > we have had those used for a bunch of the country acts I did last > > summer, > > seemed pretty ok, much better than eaw but not something I would choose > > over > > Meyer, but still all in all very useable > > It is this kind of thinking that will keep you at the level you're at > Georgie boy - you choose antiquated old boxes over newer, higher > output better sounding boxes that are in demand. And you'll keep > getting the lame clients you're complaining about in the other thread. > "Those that strive for mediocrity shall achieve it." - KS > > If that's the level you *want* to stay at, fine. But it doesn't mean > you're right and everyone else is wrong. If you seriously think your > MSL3s can compete against anything by L'Acoustics, D&B, and other > newer boxes in that league, you're seriously mistaken or you need to > get out more. Meyer makes some decent sounding modern boxes, but their > top end stuff can't compete with the new L'Acoustics or D&B. > > K. > > Dear sir, you are entitled to your opinion, if the line arrays did > actually > sound better I would be all about them, but sadly they don't. I have not > ever heard a single line array that sounds "Natural" , which is the > standards I use , "does this sound just like the act would without a PA > system but only louder,?" line arrays do not do that > just because something is the flavor of the week does not make it better > and you ought know this by now. > George L'Acoustics and V-DOSC have been a "flavor of the week" for over 15 years now. And apparently all the manufactures have failed to prove otherwise and have jumped on the bandwagon. As for "natural" sounding PA, if a cluster of trap boxes producing "comb filter city" is your idea of natural, then I guess so. I propose this: line arrays produce far less of this phenomenon than the trap arrays you're accustom to because there are no extra boxes in the horizontal plane to induce comb filtering on that plane which is what you're ears are most sensitive to. They produce their combining in the vertical plane to which human hearing is far less sensitive. Large trap arrays produce combing in *both* planes. Maybe what you don't like about line sources is that they're actually more correct sounding since the relative time smear is less in the plane your hearing is most sensitive to. Sure there are some good sounding trap arrays out there still. Most importantly, any type of system needs to be the right tool for the job. In any case, the latest offering of line source products by the top tier makers are far superior to any of the latest trap systems out there in the big venues & when they're properly deployed. sorry listening just does not prove what your claiming to be true line arrays are the flavor of the week and many of the most serios players are right now working on new point source systems sound in nature is point source, not line array, it is impossible to deliver sound that is natural when the very permise of the line array works against natural sound yes they are loud, yes the "fill " the area, but that is far from natural, argue all you want to support the marketing claims of these companies, I have the science of sound behind my opinions George |