Win Hill: Inverse Marx Generator ??
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From: Artemus on 16 Jul 2010 17:15 "John Larkin" <jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote in message news:br3146dm2fr5mnejr2rs7m0qrdcjig7lbe(a)4ax.com... > On Thu, 15 Jul 2010 18:34:23 -0700, "Artemus" <bogus(a)invalid.org> > wrote: > > > > >"Jim Thompson" <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon(a)On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote in message > >news:1ibv36d2lmvvptmtq7e58cjvb8qqhq90ci(a)4ax.com... > >> > >> It's _really_ easy once you stare at the waveforms for awhile... I > >> _knew_ charge has to be conserved, but I finally saw the answer while > >> half dozing at a granddaughter's swim party :-) > >> > >> ...Jim Thompson > > > >A capacitor in an electronic circuit doesn't store charge, it stores energy. > >The circuit passes a charge thru a capacitor. For every electron that enters > >the + end another electron leaves the - end. So the capacitor doesn't store > >charge with respect to the external circuit any more than a resistor does. > >Art > > > > That's silly. I can pump ampere-seconds into a resistor for years, and > can recover none of them. If I pump amp-seconds into a cap, I can get > them back. And how many go in versus how many come out is > mathematically predictable, not to mention useful in real life. > > John > If you continue to ignore the phrase "with respect to the external circuit" you will never understand my point. Nor will you resolve your parallel vs serial capacitor paradox. You can pump air INTO a balloon, but you can't pump electrons INTO a component as they always come out the other terminal(s) in the same quantity as went in. Unless of course you have managed to prove Kirchoff wrong in which case I'd love to see the proof. Art
From: Artemus on 16 Jul 2010 17:15 "Jim Thompson" <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon(a)On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote in message news:25s04697btl1ejmhghlo6pn5tbjjl3cr93(a)4ax.com... > On Fri, 16 Jul 2010 08:23:36 +0100, John Devereux > <john(a)devereux.me.uk> wrote: > > >Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon(a)On-My-Web-Site.com> writes: > > > >> On Thu, 15 Jul 2010 18:34:23 -0700, "Artemus" <bogus(a)invalid.org> > >> wrote: > >> > >>> > >>>"Jim Thompson" <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon(a)On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote in message > >>>news:1ibv36d2lmvvptmtq7e58cjvb8qqhq90ci(a)4ax.com... > >>>> > >>>> It's _really_ easy once you stare at the waveforms for awhile... I > >>>> _knew_ charge has to be conserved, but I finally saw the answer while > >>>> half dozing at a granddaughter's swim party :-) > >>>> > >>>> ...Jim Thompson > >>> > >>>A capacitor in an electronic circuit doesn't store charge, it stores energy. > >>>The circuit passes a charge thru a capacitor. For every electron that enters > >>>the + end another electron leaves the - end. So the capacitor doesn't store > >>>charge with respect to the external circuit any more than a resistor does. > >>>Art > >>> > >> > >> Huh? > > > >That's pretty much my model too. So why not enlighten us? > > > >Of course there are usually several ways of describing any physical > >system that end up amounting to saying the same thing in a different > >way. I suspect that your epiphany may turn out to be something like > >that. But we'll never know if you just sit there going "huh?". > > > >Put up or shut up Jim :) > > I'm waiting to see if there's someone out there who can solve it. > > I should have time to write it up this weekend. > > Of course both you and Artemus need to study up on the basics of > capacitors. "That's pretty much my model..." is not the _accepted_ > condition :-) > > ...Jim Thompson You think I'm wrong so please say why. If you convince me I'll admit my error and change my mind. However, waving your arms around, looking down your nose at others, spouting condescending remarks, offering platitudes and saying nothing specific which could expose you to criticism just isn't going to do it. Art
From: John Larkin on 16 Jul 2010 18:24 On Fri, 16 Jul 2010 14:15:14 -0700, "Artemus" <bogus(a)invalid.org> wrote: > >"John Larkin" <jjlarkin(a)highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote in message >news:br3146dm2fr5mnejr2rs7m0qrdcjig7lbe(a)4ax.com... >> On Thu, 15 Jul 2010 18:34:23 -0700, "Artemus" <bogus(a)invalid.org> >> wrote: >> >> > >> >"Jim Thompson" <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon(a)On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote in >message >> >news:1ibv36d2lmvvptmtq7e58cjvb8qqhq90ci(a)4ax.com... >> >> >> >> It's _really_ easy once you stare at the waveforms for awhile... I >> >> _knew_ charge has to be conserved, but I finally saw the answer while >> >> half dozing at a granddaughter's swim party :-) >> >> >> >> ...Jim Thompson >> > >> >A capacitor in an electronic circuit doesn't store charge, it stores energy. >> >The circuit passes a charge thru a capacitor. For every electron that enters >> >the + end another electron leaves the - end. So the capacitor doesn't store >> >charge with respect to the external circuit any more than a resistor does. >> >Art >> > >> >> That's silly. I can pump ampere-seconds into a resistor for years, and >> can recover none of them. If I pump amp-seconds into a cap, I can get >> them back. And how many go in versus how many come out is >> mathematically predictable, not to mention useful in real life. >> >> John >> > >If you continue to ignore the phrase "with respect to the external >circuit" you will never understand my point. Nor will you resolve >your parallel vs serial capacitor paradox. >You can pump air INTO a balloon, but you can't pump electrons >INTO a component as they always come out the other terminal(s) >in the same quantity as went in. No. You can charge a free-floating sphere, as you could electrostatically charge the body of a capacitor, by shooting electrons at it. But charging the body of the cap isn't the same thing as charging the cap internally, which is what we do in electronics. That's why 0603 caps have voltage ratings and come in different values. Unless of course you have managed >to prove Kirchoff wrong in which case I'd love to see the proof. All this is academic. When we design electronic circuits, we assume that we can pump charge into a cap, and later extract it. We assume that because it works. John
From: Jim Thompson on 16 Jul 2010 19:47 On Fri, 16 Jul 2010 14:15:22 -0700, "Artemus" <bogus(a)invalid.org> wrote: > >"Jim Thompson" <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon(a)On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote in message >news:25s04697btl1ejmhghlo6pn5tbjjl3cr93(a)4ax.com... >> On Fri, 16 Jul 2010 08:23:36 +0100, John Devereux >> <john(a)devereux.me.uk> wrote: >> >> >Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon(a)On-My-Web-Site.com> writes: >> > >> >> On Thu, 15 Jul 2010 18:34:23 -0700, "Artemus" <bogus(a)invalid.org> >> >> wrote: >> >> >> >>> >> >>>"Jim Thompson" <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon(a)On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote in >message >> >>>news:1ibv36d2lmvvptmtq7e58cjvb8qqhq90ci(a)4ax.com... >> >>>> >> >>>> It's _really_ easy once you stare at the waveforms for awhile... I >> >>>> _knew_ charge has to be conserved, but I finally saw the answer while >> >>>> half dozing at a granddaughter's swim party :-) >> >>>> >> >>>> ...Jim Thompson >> >>> >> >>>A capacitor in an electronic circuit doesn't store charge, it stores energy. >> >>>The circuit passes a charge thru a capacitor. For every electron that enters >> >>>the + end another electron leaves the - end. So the capacitor doesn't store >> >>>charge with respect to the external circuit any more than a resistor does. >> >>>Art >> >>> >> >> >> >> Huh? >> > >> >That's pretty much my model too. So why not enlighten us? >> > >> >Of course there are usually several ways of describing any physical >> >system that end up amounting to saying the same thing in a different >> >way. I suspect that your epiphany may turn out to be something like >> >that. But we'll never know if you just sit there going "huh?". >> > >> >Put up or shut up Jim :) >> >> I'm waiting to see if there's someone out there who can solve it. >> >> I should have time to write it up this weekend. >> >> Of course both you and Artemus need to study up on the basics of >> capacitors. "That's pretty much my model..." is not the _accepted_ >> condition :-) >> >> ...Jim Thompson > > >You think I'm wrong so please say why. If you convince me I'll admit >my error and change my mind. > >However, waving your arms around, looking down your nose at others, >spouting condescending remarks, offering platitudes and saying nothing >specific which could expose you to criticism just isn't going to do it. > >Art > I got a free ride thru MIT way back when scholarships were awarded only on merit. What are your credentials? As for fundamentals, get a textbook. Even John "The Bloviator" Larkin, referring to your description, says, "That's silly" ;-) I'll post the "charge not conserved" solution tomorrow afternoon... I'm tied up until then. In the meantime get out a high school physics book. ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, CTO | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | Friday is Wine and Cheeseburger Day
From: Michael A. Terrell on 18 Jul 2010 15:38
John Larkin wrote: > > [1] I didn't have to follow orders, they couldn't court-martial me, > and we got to go out on ships and shoot guns off the fantail and stuff > like that. I didn't follow some orders, and I knocked down a two star General along with his aide (a Captain) a full bird Colonel and the First Sergeant. I also slammed an annoying Lieutenant in the balls with an office chair while on duty at the TV station. The fool was standing right behind me when I had an equipment failure. He had been warned several times to sit down so he wouldn't get hurt. ::) I didn't get courtmartialed for anything. I did get a letter of commendation from that general, after knocking him down -- Anyone wanting to run for any political office in the US should have to have a DD214, and a honorable discharge. |