Wonderful!
in [Physics]
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From: mpc755 on 11 Jan 2010 09:47 On Jan 11, 9:41 am, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Jan 8, 6:46 pm, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Jan 8, 7:43 pm, moro...(a)world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) > > wrote: > > > > mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> writes: > > > >> >The C-60 molecule is in the slit(s). The instant before it exits the > > > >> >slit(s) detectors are placed at the exits. > > > > >> This almost certainly violates the HUP, if you do it on a scale small > > > >> enough so that C-60 molecules diffract from a grating. > > > > >The photon is on a deterministic path, but it is uncertain to us. > > > > According to the HUP, we can never know the position to within > > > hbar/2*delta_P, where delta_P is the uncertainty in the momentum. > > > That's what I said. > > > > >> >Your refusal to answer my question is evidence I am more correct. > > > > >> So I take it from this that your refusal to discuss the alleged evidence > > > >> of ether entrainment is evidence I am more correct, that there is none. > > > > >> Therefore, aether simply does not exist, or if it does, it has no effects > > > >> whatsoever on matter or energy. > > > >If the aether does not push back then there is no aether. > > > >'Ether and the Theory of Relativity by Albert Einstein' > > > >http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/Extras/Einstein_ether.html > > > >"According to the general theory of relativity space without ether is > > > >unthinkable" > > > > Read the rest of that paragraph (heck, the whole paper). Esp. the last > > > sentence: "The idea of motion may not be applied to it (ether). > > > Einstein's idea of motion requires particles which can be tracked > > through time. > > Yes, that's right. Any material medium that is elastic is made of > particles. Any material medium that exerts pressure is made of > particles. Your medium is therefore made of particles, because you say > it is elastic and exerts pressure. You also say it is displaced and > entrained. Therefore it is moved, because that's what those words > mean. Therefore the particles in your aether move, which means they > can be tracked in time. > Incorrect. You are saying the aether must consist of particles because it can be displaced. I have said no such thing. Furthermore, even if the aether does consist of particles, which I am not saying it does, does not mean those particles can be tracked through time. > > > "Generalising we must say this:- There may be supposed to be extended > > physical objects to which the idea of motion cannot be applied. They > > [the physical objects to which the idea of motion cannot be applied] > > may not be thought of as consisting of particles which allow > > themselves to be separately tracked through time." > > > "The special theory of relativity forbids us to assume the ether to > > consist of particles observable through time, but the hypothesis of > > ether in itself is not in conflict with the special theory of > > relativity." > > > "If the existence of such floats for tracking the motion of the > > particles of a fluid were a fundamental impossibility in physics - if, > > in fact nothing else whatever were observable than the shape of the > > space occupied by the water as it varies in time, we should have no > > ground for the assumption that water consists of movable particles. > > But all the same we could characterise it as a medium." > > > Aether Displacement: The shape of the space occupied by the aether as > > it varies in time, as determined by its connections with the matter. > >
From: mpc755 on 11 Jan 2010 09:52 On Jan 11, 9:41 am, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Jan 8, 6:46 pm, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Jan 8, 7:43 pm, moro...(a)world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) > > wrote: > > > > mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> writes: > > > >> >The C-60 molecule is in the slit(s). The instant before it exits the > > > >> >slit(s) detectors are placed at the exits. > > > > >> This almost certainly violates the HUP, if you do it on a scale small > > > >> enough so that C-60 molecules diffract from a grating. > > > > >The photon is on a deterministic path, but it is uncertain to us. > > > > According to the HUP, we can never know the position to within > > > hbar/2*delta_P, where delta_P is the uncertainty in the momentum. > > > That's what I said. > > > > >> >Your refusal to answer my question is evidence I am more correct. > > > > >> So I take it from this that your refusal to discuss the alleged evidence > > > >> of ether entrainment is evidence I am more correct, that there is none. > > > > >> Therefore, aether simply does not exist, or if it does, it has no effects > > > >> whatsoever on matter or energy. > > > >If the aether does not push back then there is no aether. > > > >'Ether and the Theory of Relativity by Albert Einstein' > > > >http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/Extras/Einstein_ether.html > > > >"According to the general theory of relativity space without ether is > > > >unthinkable" > > > > Read the rest of that paragraph (heck, the whole paper). Esp. the last > > > sentence: "The idea of motion may not be applied to it (ether). > > > Einstein's idea of motion requires particles which can be tracked > > through time. > > Yes, that's right. Any material medium that is elastic is made of > particles. Any material medium that exerts pressure is made of > particles. Your medium is therefore made of particles, because you say > it is elastic and exerts pressure. You also say it is displaced and > entrained. Therefore it is moved, because that's what those words > mean. Therefore the particles in your aether move, which means they > can be tracked in time. > Incorrect. You are saying the aether must consist of particles because it can be displaced. I have said no such thing. Furthermore, even if the aether does consist of particles, which I am not saying it does, does not mean they can be tracked through time. > > > > "Generalising we must say this:- There may be supposed to be extended > > physical objects to which the idea of motion cannot be applied. They > > [the physical objects to which the idea of motion cannot be applied] > > may not be thought of as consisting of particles which allow > > themselves to be separately tracked through time." > > > "The special theory of relativity forbids us to assume the ether to > > consist of particles observable through time, but the hypothesis of > > ether in itself is not in conflict with the special theory of > > relativity." > > > "If the existence of such floats for tracking the motion of the > > particles of a fluid were a fundamental impossibility in physics - if, > > in fact nothing else whatever were observable than the shape of the > > space occupied by the water as it varies in time, we should have no > > ground for the assumption that water consists of movable particles. > > But all the same we could characterise it as a medium." > > > Aether Displacement: The shape of the space occupied by the aether as > > it varies in time, as determined by its connections with the matter. > >
From: mpc755 on 11 Jan 2010 10:02 On Jan 11, 9:41 am, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Jan 8, 6:46 pm, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Jan 8, 7:43 pm, moro...(a)world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) > > wrote: > > > > mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> writes: > > > >> >The C-60 molecule is in the slit(s). The instant before it exits the > > > >> >slit(s) detectors are placed at the exits. > > > > >> This almost certainly violates the HUP, if you do it on a scale small > > > >> enough so that C-60 molecules diffract from a grating. > > > > >The photon is on a deterministic path, but it is uncertain to us. > > > > According to the HUP, we can never know the position to within > > > hbar/2*delta_P, where delta_P is the uncertainty in the momentum. > > > That's what I said. > > > > >> >Your refusal to answer my question is evidence I am more correct. > > > > >> So I take it from this that your refusal to discuss the alleged evidence > > > >> of ether entrainment is evidence I am more correct, that there is none. > > > > >> Therefore, aether simply does not exist, or if it does, it has no effects > > > >> whatsoever on matter or energy. > > > >If the aether does not push back then there is no aether. > > > >'Ether and the Theory of Relativity by Albert Einstein' > > > >http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/Extras/Einstein_ether.html > > > >"According to the general theory of relativity space without ether is > > > >unthinkable" > > > > Read the rest of that paragraph (heck, the whole paper). Esp. the last > > > sentence: "The idea of motion may not be applied to it (ether). > > > Einstein's idea of motion requires particles which can be tracked > > through time. > > Yes, that's right. Any material medium that is elastic is made of > particles. Any material medium that exerts pressure is made of > particles. Your medium is therefore made of particles, because you say > it is elastic and exerts pressure. You also say it is displaced and > entrained. Therefore it is moved, because that's what those words > mean. Therefore the particles in your aether move, which means they > can be tracked in time. > Incorrect. You are saying the aether must consist of particles because it can be displaced. I have said no such thing. Furthermore, even if the aether does consist of particles, which I am not saying it does, does not mean they can be tracked separately through time. > > > > "Generalising we must say this:- There may be supposed to be extended > > physical objects to which the idea of motion cannot be applied. They > > [the physical objects to which the idea of motion cannot be applied] > > may not be thought of as consisting of particles which allow > > themselves to be separately tracked through time." > > > "The special theory of relativity forbids us to assume the ether to > > consist of particles observable through time, but the hypothesis of > > ether in itself is not in conflict with the special theory of > > relativity." > > > "If the existence of such floats for tracking the motion of the > > particles of a fluid were a fundamental impossibility in physics - if, > > in fact nothing else whatever were observable than the shape of the > > space occupied by the water as it varies in time, we should have no > > ground for the assumption that water consists of movable particles. > > But all the same we could characterise it as a medium." > > > Aether Displacement: The shape of the space occupied by the aether as > > it varies in time, as determined by its connections with the matter. > >
From: PD on 11 Jan 2010 13:47 On Jan 11, 8:52 am, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Jan 11, 9:41 am, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Jan 8, 6:46 pm, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > On Jan 8, 7:43 pm, moro...(a)world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) > > > wrote: > > > > > mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> writes: > > > > >> >The C-60 molecule is in the slit(s). The instant before it exits the > > > > >> >slit(s) detectors are placed at the exits. > > > > > >> This almost certainly violates the HUP, if you do it on a scale small > > > > >> enough so that C-60 molecules diffract from a grating. > > > > > >The photon is on a deterministic path, but it is uncertain to us. > > > > > According to the HUP, we can never know the position to within > > > > hbar/2*delta_P, where delta_P is the uncertainty in the momentum. > > > > That's what I said. > > > > > >> >Your refusal to answer my question is evidence I am more correct. > > > > > >> So I take it from this that your refusal to discuss the alleged evidence > > > > >> of ether entrainment is evidence I am more correct, that there is none. > > > > > >> Therefore, aether simply does not exist, or if it does, it has no effects > > > > >> whatsoever on matter or energy. > > > > >If the aether does not push back then there is no aether. > > > > >'Ether and the Theory of Relativity by Albert Einstein' > > > > >http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/Extras/Einstein_ether.html > > > > >"According to the general theory of relativity space without ether is > > > > >unthinkable" > > > > > Read the rest of that paragraph (heck, the whole paper). Esp. the last > > > > sentence: "The idea of motion may not be applied to it (ether). > > > > Einstein's idea of motion requires particles which can be tracked > > > through time. > > > Yes, that's right. Any material medium that is elastic is made of > > particles. Any material medium that exerts pressure is made of > > particles. Your medium is therefore made of particles, because you say > > it is elastic and exerts pressure. You also say it is displaced and > > entrained. Therefore it is moved, because that's what those words > > mean. Therefore the particles in your aether move, which means they > > can be tracked in time. > > Incorrect. You are saying the aether must consist of particles because > it can be displaced. No, I'm not. I'm saying it must consist of particles if it is elastic and exerts pressure. Anybody knows that. > I have said no such thing. Furthermore, even if > the aether does consist of particles, which I am not saying it does, > does not mean they can be tracked through time. Yes, it does. If the aether is displaced, then ANY element of that aether can be tracked through that displacement, which occurs over an interval of time. That element of the aether contains the particles of the aether. > > > > > > "Generalising we must say this:- There may be supposed to be extended > > > physical objects to which the idea of motion cannot be applied. They > > > [the physical objects to which the idea of motion cannot be applied] > > > may not be thought of as consisting of particles which allow > > > themselves to be separately tracked through time." > > > > "The special theory of relativity forbids us to assume the ether to > > > consist of particles observable through time, but the hypothesis of > > > ether in itself is not in conflict with the special theory of > > > relativity." > > > > "If the existence of such floats for tracking the motion of the > > > particles of a fluid were a fundamental impossibility in physics - if, > > > in fact nothing else whatever were observable than the shape of the > > > space occupied by the water as it varies in time, we should have no > > > ground for the assumption that water consists of movable particles. > > > But all the same we could characterise it as a medium." > > > > Aether Displacement: The shape of the space occupied by the aether as > > > it varies in time, as determined by its connections with the matter.
From: mpc755 on 11 Jan 2010 14:10
On Jan 11, 1:47 pm, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Jan 11, 8:52 am, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Jan 11, 9:41 am, PD <thedraperfam...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > On Jan 8, 6:46 pm, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Jan 8, 7:43 pm, moro...(a)world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) > > > > wrote: > > > > > > mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> writes: > > > > > >> >The C-60 molecule is in the slit(s). The instant before it exits the > > > > > >> >slit(s) detectors are placed at the exits. > > > > > > >> This almost certainly violates the HUP, if you do it on a scale small > > > > > >> enough so that C-60 molecules diffract from a grating. > > > > > > >The photon is on a deterministic path, but it is uncertain to us.. > > > > > > According to the HUP, we can never know the position to within > > > > > hbar/2*delta_P, where delta_P is the uncertainty in the momentum. > > > > > That's what I said. > > > > > > >> >Your refusal to answer my question is evidence I am more correct. > > > > > > >> So I take it from this that your refusal to discuss the alleged evidence > > > > > >> of ether entrainment is evidence I am more correct, that there is none. > > > > > > >> Therefore, aether simply does not exist, or if it does, it has no effects > > > > > >> whatsoever on matter or energy. > > > > > >If the aether does not push back then there is no aether. > > > > > >'Ether and the Theory of Relativity by Albert Einstein' > > > > > >http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/Extras/Einstein_ether.html > > > > > >"According to the general theory of relativity space without ether is > > > > > >unthinkable" > > > > > > Read the rest of that paragraph (heck, the whole paper). Esp. the last > > > > > sentence: "The idea of motion may not be applied to it (ether). > > > > > Einstein's idea of motion requires particles which can be tracked > > > > through time. > > > > Yes, that's right. Any material medium that is elastic is made of > > > particles. Any material medium that exerts pressure is made of > > > particles. Your medium is therefore made of particles, because you say > > > it is elastic and exerts pressure. You also say it is displaced and > > > entrained. Therefore it is moved, because that's what those words > > > mean. Therefore the particles in your aether move, which means they > > > can be tracked in time. > > > Incorrect. You are saying the aether must consist of particles because > > it can be displaced. > > No, I'm not. I'm saying it must consist of particles if it is elastic > and exerts pressure. Anybody knows that. > Incorrect. What is the difference between an infinite number of aether particles, quanta of aether, being physically displaced by matter and the aether as a singleton being physically displaced by matter? Nothing. > > I have said no such thing. Furthermore, even if > > the aether does consist of particles, which I am not saying it does, > > does not mean they can be tracked through time. > > Yes, it does. If the aether is displaced, then ANY element of that > aether can be tracked through that displacement, which occurs over an > interval of time. That element of the aether contains the particles of > the aether. > There is a particle of aether, a quantum of aether, right now one inch in front of your nose. Tell me how you track that individual particle of aether separately from all of the other particles of aether it exists with and tell me exactly how you determine where that individual particle of aether exists one minute from now. > > > > > > "Generalising we must say this:- There may be supposed to be extended > > > > physical objects to which the idea of motion cannot be applied. They > > > > [the physical objects to which the idea of motion cannot be applied] > > > > may not be thought of as consisting of particles which allow > > > > themselves to be separately tracked through time." > > > > > "The special theory of relativity forbids us to assume the ether to > > > > consist of particles observable through time, but the hypothesis of > > > > ether in itself is not in conflict with the special theory of > > > > relativity." > > > > > "If the existence of such floats for tracking the motion of the > > > > particles of a fluid were a fundamental impossibility in physics - if, > > > > in fact nothing else whatever were observable than the shape of the > > > > space occupied by the water as it varies in time, we should have no > > > > ground for the assumption that water consists of movable particles. > > > > But all the same we could characterise it as a medium." > > > > > Aether Displacement: The shape of the space occupied by the aether as > > > > it varies in time, as determined by its connections with the matter.. > > |