A constant speed of light in all reference frames? Surely you can't be serious. [Physics]

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From: mpc755 on 15 Feb 2010 00:58

On Feb 15, 12:35 am, "Peter Webb"
<webbfam...(a)DIESPAMDIEoptusnet.com.au> wrote:
> "mpc755" <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:e03b248e-5f49-4e80-9c4c-d542dd7e269e(a)k5g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 15, 12:18 am, "Peter Webb"
>
> <webbfam...(a)DIESPAMDIEoptusnet.com.au> wrote:
> > As I have said at least three times now,
> > you cannot determine the speed of the aether.
> > ____________________________________
>
> > You said light moves at a constant velocity relative to the ether. So why
> > can't you measure the speed of light, see how much it differs from c, and
> > the difference is your speed relative to the ether? Why doesn't that
> > procedure determine the speed of the ether?
>
> How do you measure your speed relative to the ether?
>
> As I have said at least four times now, you can't measure the speed of
> the aether. If you can't measure the speed of the aether you can't
> measure your speed relative to the aether.
>
> Do you want to ask this same question again so I can answer it for a
> fifth time?
>
> ______________________________________
> I just described how you *can* measure your speed relative to the ether. You
> measure the speed of light, see how much it differs from c, and the
> difference is your speed relative to the ether. That is because according to
> you, light moves at a constant speed relative to the ether. So if you
> measure the speed of light, and subtract if from c, that must give you your
> speed relative to the ether.
>
> So say you measure that light is moving at 2 x 10^8 m/s relative to you. We
> know it is moving at 3 x 10^8 m/s relative to the ether, therefore you are
> moving at 3 x 10^8 m/s - 2 x 10^8 m/s = 1 x 10^8 m/s relative to the ether.
>
> Why doesn't that procedure determine your speed relative to the ether?

Not sure this link will work, but this is a link to the two posts I
made having to do with the train and the embankment and the time on
the clocks and the lightning strikes.

I realize you are not going to understand what I have written, but
this is why the light is not detected at other than 'c' for either the
Observers on the embankment or the Observers on the train:

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics.relativity/browse_frm/thread/2bb6ac5e1cbf17ed#

From: mpc755 on 15 Feb 2010 01:01

On Feb 15, 12:58 am, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 15, 12:35 am, "Peter Webb"
>
>
>
> <webbfam...(a)DIESPAMDIEoptusnet.com.au> wrote:
> > "mpc755" <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:e03b248e-5f49-4e80-9c4c-d542dd7e269e(a)k5g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
> > On Feb 15, 12:18 am, "Peter Webb"
>
> > <webbfam...(a)DIESPAMDIEoptusnet.com.au> wrote:
> > > As I have said at least three times now,
> > > you cannot determine the speed of the aether.
> > > ____________________________________
>
> > > You said light moves at a constant velocity relative to the ether. So why
> > > can't you measure the speed of light, see how much it differs from c, and
> > > the difference is your speed relative to the ether? Why doesn't that
> > > procedure determine the speed of the ether?
>
> > How do you measure your speed relative to the ether?
>
> > As I have said at least four times now, you can't measure the speed of
> > the aether. If you can't measure the speed of the aether you can't
> > measure your speed relative to the aether.
>
> > Do you want to ask this same question again so I can answer it for a
> > fifth time?
>
> > ______________________________________
> > I just described how you *can* measure your speed relative to the ether.. You
> > measure the speed of light, see how much it differs from c, and the
> > difference is your speed relative to the ether. That is because according to
> > you, light moves at a constant speed relative to the ether. So if you
> > measure the speed of light, and subtract if from c, that must give you your
> > speed relative to the ether.
>
> > So say you measure that light is moving at 2 x 10^8 m/s relative to you.. We
> > know it is moving at 3 x 10^8 m/s relative to the ether, therefore you are
> > moving at 3 x 10^8 m/s - 2 x 10^8 m/s = 1 x 10^8 m/s relative to the ether.
>
> > Why doesn't that procedure determine your speed relative to the ether?
>
> Not sure this link will work, but this is a link to the two posts I
> made having to do with the train and the embankment and the time on
> the clocks and the lightning strikes.
>
> I realize you are not going to understand what I have written, but
> this is why the light is not detected at other than 'c' for either the
> Observers on the embankment or the Observers on the train:
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics.relativity/browse_frm/thre...

The above link doesn't work. If you are using google groups and you do
sort by date it is post #52. Click on "- show quoted text -" to start
reading from my first post.

From: Peter Webb on 15 Feb 2010 01:06

"mpc755" <mpc755(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
news:21c1d72e-9898-436a-ba4e-05a849fc4efc(a)g8g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 15, 12:35 am, "Peter Webb"
<webbfam...(a)DIESPAMDIEoptusnet.com.au> wrote:
> "mpc755" <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:e03b248e-5f49-4e80-9c4c-d542dd7e269e(a)k5g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 15, 12:18 am, "Peter Webb"
>
> <webbfam...(a)DIESPAMDIEoptusnet.com.au> wrote:
> > As I have said at least three times now,
> > you cannot determine the speed of the aether.
> > ____________________________________
>
> > You said light moves at a constant velocity relative to the ether. So
> > why
> > can't you measure the speed of light, see how much it differs from c,
> > and
> > the difference is your speed relative to the ether? Why doesn't that
> > procedure determine the speed of the ether?
>
> How do you measure your speed relative to the ether?
>
> As I have said at least four times now, you can't measure the speed of
> the aether. If you can't measure the speed of the aether you can't
> measure your speed relative to the aether.
>
> Do you want to ask this same question again so I can answer it for a
> fifth time?
>
> ______________________________________
> I just described how you *can* measure your speed relative to the ether.
> You
> measure the speed of light, see how much it differs from c, and the
> difference is your speed relative to the ether.

How do you measure the speed of light so it is not 'c'?

_________________________________
Anyway you like. Aren't you claiming that the speed of light is a constant
relative to the speed of the ether, and not constant relative to the
observer? So you can measure the speed of light in some way, to make this
claim at all, right? So why not measure it, see how much it departs from c,
and then the difference is the speed of the ether.

Why won't that work?

From: Peter Webb on 15 Feb 2010 01:08

"mpc755" <mpc755(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
news:285f58e2-a468-4257-8051-fa7249dc0e72(a)m35g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 15, 12:35 am, "Peter Webb"
<webbfam...(a)DIESPAMDIEoptusnet.com.au> wrote:
> "mpc755" <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:e03b248e-5f49-4e80-9c4c-d542dd7e269e(a)k5g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 15, 12:18 am, "Peter Webb"
>
> <webbfam...(a)DIESPAMDIEoptusnet.com.au> wrote:
> > As I have said at least three times now,
> > you cannot determine the speed of the aether.
> > ____________________________________
>
> > You said light moves at a constant velocity relative to the ether. So
> > why
> > can't you measure the speed of light, see how much it differs from c,
> > and
> > the difference is your speed relative to the ether? Why doesn't that
> > procedure determine the speed of the ether?
>
> How do you measure your speed relative to the ether?
>
> As I have said at least four times now, you can't measure the speed of
> the aether. If you can't measure the speed of the aether you can't
> measure your speed relative to the aether.
>
> Do you want to ask this same question again so I can answer it for a
> fifth time?
>
> ______________________________________
> I just described how you *can* measure your speed relative to the ether.
> You
> measure the speed of light, see how much it differs from c, and the
> difference is your speed relative to the ether. That is because according
> to
> you, light moves at a constant speed relative to the ether. So if you
> measure the speed of light, and subtract if from c, that must give you
> your
> speed relative to the ether.
>
> So say you measure that light is moving at 2 x 10^8 m/s relative to you.
> We
> know it is moving at 3 x 10^8 m/s relative to the ether, therefore you are
> moving at 3 x 10^8 m/s - 2 x 10^8 m/s = 1 x 10^8 m/s relative to the
> ether.
>
> Why doesn't that procedure determine your speed relative to the ether?

Not sure this link will work, but this is a link to the two posts I
made having to do with the train and the embankment and the time on
the clocks and the lightning strikes.

I realize you are not going to understand what I have written, but
this is why the light is not detected at other than 'c' for either the
Observers on the embankment or the Observers on the train:

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics.relativity/browse_frm/thread/2bb6ac5e1cbf17ed#

_____________________________________________
I didn't ask about trains, or embankments, or anything like that. I asked
you why you can't measure the relative speed of the ether by the simple
process I described above. Why can't you? Or can you?

From: Peter Webb on 15 Feb 2010 01:18

"mpc755" <mpc755(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
news:cc37a395-3b16-4471-9964-d9db63246254(a)v20g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 15, 12:18 am, "Peter Webb"
<webbfam...(a)DIESPAMDIEoptusnet.com.au> wrote:
> As I have said at least three times now,
> you cannot determine the speed of the aether.
> ____________________________________
>
> You said light moves at a constant velocity relative to the ether. So why
> can't you measure the speed of light, see how much it differs from c, and
> the difference is your speed relative to the ether? Why doesn't that
> procedure determine the speed of the ether?

How do you measure the speed of light and how do you determine it is
different from 'c'? Are you using a mirror or synchronized clocks?

_______________________________
Use whatever measuring apparatus you like.

What you are incapable of understanding is everything is under the
effects of the aether. As I said in one of my original posts which it
would help you understand the point I am making. The atomic clocks the
Observers on the train are using are offset because of their state
with respect to the aether.

So, I will ask you again. How is the light to be measured?

________________________________
You must already have some means of measuring light speed, or you couldn't
claim the speed was constant relative to the ether. Use that.